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re: Heart Disease leading cause of death in america

Posted on 10/18/18 at 8:47 pm to
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
35521 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 8:47 pm to
quote:

I’ll get downvoted


Deservedly so. Lord. A) your statement is metabolically incorrect and B) we aren't talking about simple weight loss. Do you really think only fat people can be insulin resistant?

Have you researched Alzheimer's Disease much? Cancer as a metabolic disease?
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 8:48 pm
Posted by fishfighter
RIP
Member since Apr 2008
40026 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 8:51 pm to
At 61 and fighting heart failure going on 9 years, I eat whatever I want. Ate a fat juicy ribeye tonight. Been a meat eater all my life.

My heart failure came from a virus infection. I had more test then 10 people that show if it wasn't for that infection, I would of a a heart of a 20 year old. Every part of all my veins are clear.

More meat for me for those that are scared.
Posted by Thib-a-doe Tiger
Member since Nov 2012
36799 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 8:54 pm to
quote:

I recommend the 7-hour podcast Dr. Peter Attia did with Dr. Tom Dayspring as a primer on lipidology.



That’s gonna be a no from me dawg
Posted by WaWaWeeWa
Member since Oct 2015
15714 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 9:21 pm to
quote:

Deservedly so. Lord. A) your statement is metabolically incorrect and B) we aren't talking about simple weight loss. Do you really think only fat people can be insulin resistant? Have you researched Alzheimer's Disease much? Cancer as a metabolic disease?


What is metabolically incorrect about my statement?
When did I say anything about insulin resistance?


We should also clarify, if by sugar we mean carbohydrates or high glycemic index “table sugar”.
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 9:25 pm
Posted by Jcorye1
Tom Brady = GoAT
Member since Dec 2007
76373 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 9:30 pm to
Wait so it's not breast cancer?
Posted by Junky
Louisiana
Member since Oct 2005
9319 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 9:37 pm to
quote:

Heart Disease can be attributed to our animal product based diets in America.


And I bet you believe meat causes cancer too
Posted by WaWaWeeWa
Member since Oct 2015
15714 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 10:00 pm to
Processed meats? For sure

And regular meats activate the mTor pathway and could accelerate aging and cancer as well.

That being said, I eat meat probably twice a day.

Do you have evidence to suggest otherwise?
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 10:01 pm
Posted by choupiquesushi
yaton rouge
Member since Jun 2006
35673 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 10:50 pm to
quote:

Simply eating eggs will put you 5 times over the daily recommended cholesterol intake.


How many eggs?
Posted by Hopeful Doc
Member since Sep 2010
15388 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 10:51 pm to
quote:

Plaque is formed from LDL, meats and animal products are extremely high in cholesterol. Simply eating eggs will put you 5 times over the daily recommended cholesterol intake.


dietary cholesterol has never been causally linked to atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease.
Posted by Hopeful Doc
Member since Sep 2010
15388 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 10:56 pm to
quote:

Soft drinks are liquid candy


Give it 30 years. Soft drinks will be about as socially frowned upon as cigarettes.
Posted by Pragmatic PiG
Plumas County
Member since Nov 2012
761 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 11:15 pm to
better be sooner than that
Posted by mark65mc
Baton Rouge
Member since Dec 2007
11552 posts
Posted on 10/18/18 at 11:18 pm to
Damn, I thought Brett Kavanaugh was the leading cause of death in America.
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
35521 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 6:40 am to
Calories are a measure of energy, conducted outside the body, nothing more.

CICO is an absurd reductionsim, as it fails to account for the metabolic effects of the actual substances being consumed--how our bodies actually produce/utilize the energy from those ingested substances , viewing same from the mitochondrial level to more macro levels (e.g., if what you eat makes your body unable to metabolize it properly-including through insulin resistance, and an inability to move your body much to burn calories, then that lab-measured calorie is not a very useful nutritional metric, is it?)

And exactly re: "When did I say anything about insulin resistance?" IR should be a key focus when discussing CVD and our habits.
This post was edited on 10/19/18 at 6:48 am
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
35521 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 6:46 am to
quote:

And regular meats activate the mTor pathway and could accelerate aging and cancer as well. 



I don't feel like an mTor debate on my phone because my thumbs will fall off. Have you kept up with Sabatini on this?
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
35521 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 7:09 am to
quote:

That’s gonna be a no from me dawg


Haha. It's broken into 5 eps. I just put it on while working out or working or in bed. It's amazing how much you can absorb. But this one is definitely technical and the graphics in shownotes are a big help.

But basically if you want to really understand lipids and cholesterol and why our mainstream treatment of same is idiotic and useless at best (and actually deadly), then it's a must to grasp the basics, and Dayspring is a great teacher.
This post was edited on 10/19/18 at 7:10 am
Posted by MorbidTheClown
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2015
76772 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 7:13 am to
thought this has been the case for decades?
Posted by WaWaWeeWa
Member since Oct 2015
15714 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 7:40 am to
quote:

CICO is an absurd reductionsim, as it fails to account for the metabolic effects of the actual substances being consumed-


Are fats, carbs, and protein metabolized differently? Yes

Would these different modes of metabolism matter in a net NEGATIVE caloric intake? No

You can’t see the forest for the trees. The obesity epidemic isn’t because people are eating too many carbs as opposed to fat or protein. If people just substituted all their carb calories for fat/protein calories we would still have a massive problem. Sugar is just easier to consume and less satiating so it leads to over consumption.

Again, no one on a net negative caloric intake is getting insulin resistant.
Posted by MorbidTheClown
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2015
76772 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 7:43 am to
i remember kidd kraddick dying in nola from heart disease and he didn't even know he had it.
Posted by WaWaWeeWa
Member since Oct 2015
15714 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 7:45 am to
quote:

McLemore


You are citing Metanalyses of old data. That is easily manipulated and has already been widely criticized. It’s not new science like these podcasters are trying to tell you.

My mind is open to change, but you will have to show me the data.
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
35521 posts
Posted on 10/19/18 at 8:31 am to
quote:

You can’t see the forest for the trees. The obesity epidemic isn’t because people are eating too many carbs as opposed to fat or protein. If people just substituted all their carb calories for fat/protein calories we would still have a massive problem. Sugar is just easier to consume and less satiating so it leads to over consumption.

Again, no one on a net negative caloric intake is getting insulin resistant.


I very well see the forest and the trees here. You are making an argument out of semantics, in one way;and you are wrong --dead wrong--in others: e.g., your statement that I underscored is almost certainly false, including as a result of your defeater in the very next sentence, bolded.
the bold part really does go a long way toward making my point.

And the statement in italics is almost completely irrelevant in practice, applied to the population writ large, even if it is technically true--how long does this person remain in a net caloric deficit? What % of the population can do this, and for how long? What did this person do to get into a state where he or she needed to go to a net caloric deficit? How does one maintain such a state?

If you think you can consume nothing but fructose over an extended period of time and remain in a sufficiently healthy metabolic state to operate at a net calorie deficiency, then I don't have much else to say about that hypothesis. (Maybe if you locked someone in a lab, but not in vivo.)

speaking of forest:trees....

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