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re: federal prosecutors open massive criminal probe of multiple opioid painkiller companies
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:18 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:18 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
As a recovering addict I really don't know how to feel about this. Seems like we are trying to push the blame on anyone who has money to help clean this mess up, when we in recovery should be accountable for our own actions. No one made me take a pill that I knew could ruin my life.
1
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:21 pm to Obtuse1
quote:
Are you suggesting doctors don't get compensation in multiple ways for prescribing certain meds or using certain appliances?
I am absolutely suggesting that. Physicians can be compensated for being "experts" for different products (meds, surgical devices, etc), however that is tied to traveling the country and giving talks and such.
Most physicians who are a part of an ACO, or other large group, will get incentive payments for NOT prescribing excess meds or expensive meds.
I think many people believe doctors get a royalty check for each script the give out.
With laws the way they are now, and have been for awhile, the biggest "incentive" a doctor may get from a device or pharmaceutical company is some chick fil a or panera for lunch one day.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:22 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
Whatever happened to personal responsibility?
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:23 pm to GEAUXT
They can’t even be taken to dinner with their spouse unless the doctor’s spouse is also a doctor being called on by the same pharmaceutical rep for the same specialty.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:26 pm to stapuffmarshy
I assume everyone on the “no one made people take the pills” bandwagon is also on board with legalizing all drug dealing and releasing all convicted drug dealers from prison?
I mean no one made people snort that fentanyl or shoot up that heroin.
I mean no one made people snort that fentanyl or shoot up that heroin.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 2:28 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:27 pm to Obtuse1
quote:
significant compensation is still alive and well.
I mean, the typical doc will get a provided lunch or something for meeting with the rep.
But the docs aren't being paid a commission for each script they write.
Go look at the database, you will see amounts like $15 here or there...something that will correspond to a few Popeye's chicken sandwiches.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 2:29 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:28 pm to GEAUXT
What led to the opioid crisis was two major things:
1. Requirement to treat pain as a vital sign
2. The drugs worked.
Doctors prescribed the hell out of the drugs because they worked. Now, the pharmaceutical companies obviously hid/downplayed the potential risks, but they made drugs that were designed to treat pain and did a damn good job of it.
The biggest issue now that prescribing of narcotics has been curtailed, which is definitely a good thing, is that patients expect to experience no pain regardless of what may be going on.
1. Requirement to treat pain as a vital sign
2. The drugs worked.
Doctors prescribed the hell out of the drugs because they worked. Now, the pharmaceutical companies obviously hid/downplayed the potential risks, but they made drugs that were designed to treat pain and did a damn good job of it.
The biggest issue now that prescribing of narcotics has been curtailed, which is definitely a good thing, is that patients expect to experience no pain regardless of what may be going on.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:28 pm to tigerfan88
You edited it to make it better.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 2:29 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:29 pm to IAmNERD
quote:
I cant look up the specific numbers right now, but I remember seeing a 60 minutes episode about a pharmacy in WV that was catering to pain clinics in the area and holy shite, McKesson absolutely knew something was up in certain places they delivered to and said nothing to anyone.
It was a small town in West Virgina with a population of 3,000. The amount of pain pills shipped to this town over a decade? 20 million
quote:
Between 2006 and 2016, drug wholesalers shipped 10.2 million hydrocodone pills and 10.6 million oxycodone pills to Tug Valley Pharmacy and Hurley Drug in Williamson, according to Drug Enforcement Administration data obtained by the House Committee.
Or how about the town of Kermit, population 400?
quote:
The drug wholesaler shipped 5.7 million hydrocodone and oxycodone pills to Save-Rite and a branch pharmacy called Sav-Rite #2 between 2005 and 2011, according records Miami-Luken gave the committee. In 2008, the company provided 5,624 prescription pain pills for every man, woman and child in Kermit.
This post was edited on 11/26/19 at 2:33 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:30 pm to GetCocky11
quote:
something that will correspond to a few Popeye's chicken sandwiches.
Don’t frick around broseph. Those things are worth their hefty weight in gold
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:45 pm to GEAUXT
quote:
With laws the way they are now, and have been for awhile, the biggest "incentive" a doctor may get from a device or pharmaceutical company is some chick fil a or panera for lunch one day.
My wife brings home free food all the time...what's better than cold Chick Fil A? Just about anything.
Both of her parents are physicians and she remembers them going to dinners (that aren't allowed anymore) with pharmaceutical reps when she was a kid. They didn't prescribe more or different drugs because of those dinners and I think most doctors weren't really affected, but there are bad actors and weak-minded people in every profession, so it did work on some doctors.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:56 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/3/21 at 8:35 pm
Posted on 11/26/19 at 2:58 pm to GetCocky11
quote:
Go look at the database, you will see amounts like $15 here or there
Charles Decook family medicine 280 payments from 16 companies in 2018 totaling $7.4 million dollars.
PROMOTIONAL SPEAKING/OTHER
14 $7.09M
CONSULTING
72 $330K
TRAVEL AND LODGING
91 $33,688
FOOD AND BEVERAGE
103 $4,686
Mostly device manufacturers but just one example of a golden child.
Jain Rakesh psychiatry got 1140 "payments" in 2018 from 18 drug companies totaling $878k.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:06 pm to Adam Banks
quote:
LINK
This is from the joint commission themselves
Interesting link.
Where did you see opiate use skyrocketing in 2001? According to the document you linked, it didn't skyrocket in 2001. It continued the steady increase it had been on since the early 90s.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:08 pm to Itismemc
quote:
The same thing happened during the housing crisis. Banks at risk of getting penalized for not making loans in low income areas. When they started going belly up, they were criticized for their loose lending standards.
Yes and no. The problem was the lenders took advantage of the loose lending parameters to make large sums of money via fees and commissions then bundled the junk with A+ paper loans to make the average look better.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:10 pm to logjamming
quote:
80’s crack epidemic is dismissed because it primarily affects urban areas. No one forced them to smoke crack, those people just need self control, accountability, etc.
But Redneck Ronnie gets hooked on pain killers and suddenly Big Pharm is under criminal investigation.
TIL pharmacies were making crack in the 80's
At least according to logjamming who is either trolling or a moron.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:10 pm to ragincajun77
quote:
No one made me take a pill that I knew could ruin my life.
Speaking hypothetically here, because I dont know the particulars of your situation:
Patient A goes to doctor B for some painful condition, who writes an opiod script when maybe the patient didnt need it, because pharma rep C sold him on a new formulation that "all the latest research shows is non-addictive when used as directed." Who bears responsibility?
This is a real life scenario because the pharma companies spent a lot of money marketing the idea that opiods werent addictive when used to treat pain, that the whole addiction problem was with recreational use.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:12 pm to Obtuse1
quote:
Are you suggesting doctors don't get compensation in multiple ways for prescribing certain meds or using certain appliances?
I thought laws were passed long ago to stop the kickback game between manufacturers and doctors.
Posted on 11/26/19 at 3:12 pm to Papplesbeast
It increased by 50 million in the ten years before and 90 million in the ten years after per their chart. In the text it also notes that from 2000-2002 the pacu morphine went up 50%.
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