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re: EDIT: Should employees be allowed unpaid leave if their work is covered?
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:06 am to LNCHBOX
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:06 am to LNCHBOX
I have input in who we hire, at least the ones who will work underneath me, but i'm not paying them so the final decision isn't with me.
Our entry position is an apprenticeship of sorts and it takes a lot of time and training from our end to get these new hires up to speed. Its a deadline and production based industry so if you are concerned about taking significant time off that early, it doesn't show the level of commitment we would want in order to take on the time and expense of training you.
I mean we let people jump out early on friday's or take a day here and there if necessary, but as far as taking off four or five paid days I don't see why someone would be entitled to that within six months.
Our entry position is an apprenticeship of sorts and it takes a lot of time and training from our end to get these new hires up to speed. Its a deadline and production based industry so if you are concerned about taking significant time off that early, it doesn't show the level of commitment we would want in order to take on the time and expense of training you.
I mean we let people jump out early on friday's or take a day here and there if necessary, but as far as taking off four or five paid days I don't see why someone would be entitled to that within six months.
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Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:07 am to Sneaky__Sally
quote:
There is a difference in the business going to hell, and not being missed while you are gone.
Yeah, but I think most companies and people are smart enough to make due when this happens. If a company can't, as I said it is due to shitty management.
Plus this is also telling the employee that you live to work, not work to live, which is an incredibly unhealthy work environment.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:07 am to shel311
quote:
Not if I wanted the department to keep running, basically.
If that employee was smart they'd extort you for everything you're worth. Or just quit and have you beg him to come back with a monster raise. Either way it's not a good place for a company to be.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:08 am to Sneaky__Sally
quote:
There is a difference in the business going to hell, and not being missed while you are gone.
There's also a difference between being missed when you're out for a few days, and being missed when you're out for an extended period (like 2-3 weeks for example).
If you're genuinely missed when you are out for just a day or two, then that's more an indication of poor management.
This post was edited on 3/11/16 at 9:10 am
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:13 am to lsupride87
quote:
My cousin works for LinkedIn out in San Fran and she has unlimited vacation. People dont abuse it either. If you hire good quality employees, they are going to get the work done
As more and more boomers leave management, hopefully the "unlimited" vacation thing starts to catch on. It makes me feel good to know that my generation is more of a "work to live" rather than a "live to work" type generation.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:14 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:What?
If that employee was smart they'd extort you for everything you're worth
quote:Or I'd just hire any number of the people applying for positions at a much cheaper rate?
Or just quit and have you beg him to come back with a monster raise.
quote:One of the best companies to work for in the nation based on multiple publications.
Either way it's not a good place for a company to be.
I think people have distored views based on how their industry/departments may work, but it's certainly not a blanket type of thing across all industries. Not even close.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:14 am to UGATiger26
I'm just speaking from the fact that our office let two entry positions go recently. I can't confirm the exact reasons, but my suspicions are that the president decided if multiple people can be out for extended periods in December / January leading up to Mardi Gras without our production dropping, we were likely overstaffed at that position.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:15 am to Epic Cajun
quote:Well, in fairness to me, as I said this was very shortly after I started. The department I took over had lots of challenges and opportunities, to put it nicely. There was no backup plan in place when I got here, there is now.
It's your responsibility as a manager to have backups in place
One of them was staffing. That shift was already running short handed and had no pool of part time team members(Which has since been built up) to pull from to help out.
FWIW, it didn't take very long at all after I got here to fix that so I can approve any week long requests.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:19 am to ThatMakesSense
quote:
Continue on fighting the good fight and interviewing at 40+ different positions, companies love employees that use them as leverage for a better offer or ones that jump ship after a year of work because the grass is greener. You're a super naive person if you believe these people you interviewed with don't speak about potential hires among themselves. They all know each other, went to school together, worked together, etc. etc.
This is 40 interviews over 5 years, most granted were straight out of college and when I returned from China, so I don't see why that is all a bad number. And as I said I somehow get emails weekly from people wishing to interview/hire me. This is a good problem to have, something a clown like you with no discernible skills and too dumb to negotiate time off for an entire year would know nothing about.
And why should I be loyal to a company? I know they're not all that loyal to me (the higher ups at least), so why should I show the company much respect? I'll show my managers respect and talk to them about my decision making process once I've gotten a better offer, and if they can't match it, then sorry, I'm going to go make an extra 15K a year elsewhere and turn in my two weeks. You would be an idiot to not do this at least on an annual basis.
quote:
Ya big dumb dumb stupid head.
High praise coming from the guy who can't negotiate any time off.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:20 am to shel311
quote:
One of the best companies to work for in the nation based on multiple publications.
I think people have distored views based on how their industry/departments may work, but it's certainly not a blanket type of thing across all industries. Not even close.
I don't think you understand the context of my answer. If a company can't let an employee take a vacation because the company will fall apart, either the employee is extremely valuable, or he's completely worthless and the management is laughably abysmal.
If that employee was smart, he'd realize how close to collapse the company is and hold it over their head. That's not a great position as a company to be totally dependant on one person. Either way it's shitty management.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:20 am to lsupride87
Tech companies are especially unique in this instance since nearly everyone there is highly educated and independently motivated.
Huge difference from a lot of traditional sectors like say Walmart.
Huge difference from a lot of traditional sectors like say Walmart.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:24 am to OMLandshark
quote:
discernible
I stopped there. For someone claiming to be an exceptional linguist, you sure do use the same vocabulary often.
I totally believe you, by the way. I bet you're the best salesman, ever.
You're problem is you've never created anything, you sell and market other peoples ideas. 'Grats.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:28 am to ThatMakesSense
quote:
exceptional linguist
quote:
You're problem
If you are going to call me out on my grammatical and vocabulary skills, then you might want to make sure you are also using them correctly.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:29 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:It's simply a numbers game, in this case. And there was no real management(there was a lead who just wasn't ready for this type of role) for some time before I took over, so there's that.
I don't think you understand the context of my answer. If a company can't let an employee take a vacation because the company will fall apart, either the employee is extremely valuable, or he's completely worthless and the management is laughably abysmal.
quote:Maybe I overstated it, well i definitely did it seems. The department wouldn't collapse, but there would be major issues if someone took 1 week off at that time. It's an entry level position, there would be no holding anything hostage for a raise, simply wouldn't happen. And as I said, it was rectified as quickly as possible from the time I started.
If that employee was smart, he'd realize how close to collapse the company is and hold it over their head. That's not a great position as a company to be totally dependant on one person. Either way it's shitty management.
I'll still stick to my previous point about things being different across industries. I know of the multiple companies I've worked for over 15 years, and have spoke to countless people on their experiences at other similar companies. I mean, if you're a department of 4 and need 2 minimum at all times to run smoothly, and 3 people wanted the exact same week off, you'd just let them all have it? I may not follow your full logic trail on this one.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:32 am to OMLandshark
quote:
This is something you don't have to worry about, since you clearly have no skills that the competition is wanting to hire.
I could go through the process of trying to defend my skills, but you show an incredibly thin skin for discussion so it would all be futile. However,
quote:
speaking foreign languages, international marketing
Ya that doesn't impress me a whole lot. I mean foreign languages are cool, but I'm more of a math and science kind of person.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:32 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:
If that employee was smart, he'd realize how close to collapse the company is and hold it over their head. That's not a great position as a company to be totally dependant on one person. Either way it's shitty management.
That's an easy way to receive a huge raise, I've been in that position before
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:33 am to shel311
Some of the attitudes in this thread are really eye-opening. I'd never want to work at some of these companies. I can understand if it's a fast food joint, or maybe if you're a contractor, but really?
I mean it sounds like some of these companies are ready to fire people the first day they are hired.
I mean it sounds like some of these companies are ready to fire people the first day they are hired.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:38 am to shel311
quote:
I mean, if you're a department of 4 and need 2 minimum at all times to run smoothly, and 3 people wanted the exact same week off, you'd just let them all have it? I may not follow your full logic trail on this one.
This happens in every industry. You plan around it. Bring in other people to cover for them. Cross train employees so that they can do other jobs. Make it so that employees give lead time for extended leave. It's not rocket science.
By simply saying "sorry we can't afford vacation for you", it just gives the employee reason to find a better job with better benefits somewhere else, and you trying to pick from a diminished applicant pool.
Also, if the attitude in your shop gets too low, you run the risk of your employees unionizing.
Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:41 am to Epic Cajun
quote:
That's an easy way to receive a huge raise, I've been in that position before
But somehow they can't afford vacation-
.Posted on 3/11/16 at 9:43 am to NYNolaguy1
I'm as pro-vacation as just about anyone, but that doesn't mean you always get to take off the exact week you want to take off.
To take the 4 person department example, the first two people to request that week off get it off. The third guy can take a different week off. This is the way it works around Christmas at every department I have been in.
To take the 4 person department example, the first two people to request that week off get it off. The third guy can take a different week off. This is the way it works around Christmas at every department I have been in.
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