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re: Do Russian history students learn about WWII the other way around?
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:20 am to Ole War Skule
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:20 am to Ole War Skule
Are you implying the Jews were not having a negative effect on the European economy during the period?
0
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:20 am to Tiger1242
quote:
I think (or hope) most westerners recognize that sack of Berlin as the unofficial end of the Nazis
Why is that important to recognize?
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:20 am to TheGasMan
quote:
Actuality: The war was won due to the combined efforts and any removal of the Brits, Americans, or Russians would have resulted in a prolonged war with an eventual Allied victory. Russia wasn't doing shite without our supplies coming across the Atlantic though.
Oh no doubt this is the case, I doubt that's how it's portrayed in Russia though (just like it isn't portrayed that way in the US)
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:21 am to Tiger1242
quote:except it is. At least nowadays. Idk what it was like 25 years ago
just like it isn't portrayed that way in the US
This post was edited on 1/8/17 at 10:22 am
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:21 am to Tiger1242
The Stalin-era USSR still believed strongly in spreading the gospel of communism through any means necessary. Proletarians of the world, unite!, and all that. In the communist hardline view, all non-communist countries were filled with oppressed workers just waiting for the opportunity to throw off their chains and join the victorious Red Army, and so violent overthrow of other governments was justified. This worldview, combined with the unique opportunity post-WW2 to remake Eastern Europe in their own image, ensured that the US and the USSR would wind up facing off.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:22 am to vilma4prez
quote:
Was China just doing it's own thing?
The Republic of China was fighting Communist China (backed by Russia) and the Japanese at the same time.
This post was edited on 1/8/17 at 10:23 am
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:22 am to WestCoastAg
quote:
To act like it was the United States who soured our relationship with the Soviet Union and not the other way around is crazy
Eh, I'm sure we both contributed to it. What I'm basically saying is it seems like Stalin respected Rosevelt and not Truman. Would he have done the same crap if Rosevelt were still alive? Maybe, I guess we'll never know
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:24 am to Dire Wolf
If you get a chance, read Ten Years and Twenty Days. One of the most amazing books I've ever read. Written by Grand Admiral Karl Donitz while he was in Spandau Prison. It goes into absolute detail of the U Boat force as he was in charge and the Battle of the Atlantic. It also provides incredible insight to the thought process of the upper chain of command at the end of the war as Donitz took over from Hitler.
Very technically heavy on the submarine side which I loved as a former submariner. Fascinating read though.
Very technically heavy on the submarine side which I loved as a former submariner. Fascinating read though.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:25 am to Tiger1242
quote:
China was busy being conquered by Japan
Japan was treating China like it was still at war in 1500s They were brutal to the Chinese.
China was hardly a united country (still fresh from a civil war) at the time and Japan took advantage of their ancient rivals.
If you are in the mood for a Movie about that era in China, check out To Live. Its more about the revolutions effects on one family but it is really good.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:27 am to Dire Wolf
Yeah, the Japs were brutal. China was terrified of them, for good reason. It is amazing we beat a team of the Germans and Japanese. Maybe the two greatest armies ever on the planet until we organized.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:28 am to TheTideMustRoll
quote:
In Russia it isn't called World War 2, it's called the Great Patriotic War. I've never taken a history class there but I would assume they are taught that it was primarily a German-Russian affair, with the Western countries getting beaten badly up front, and then showing up again right at the end to try and steal all the credit after Russia had done all the heavy lifting. From their point of view, you have to admit that is kind of correct.
Everyone got beat up front. Moscow was surrounded, Petrograd/Leningrad was occupied, and Stalingrad was a decimated stalemate, while all production factories for the Soviets had to be moved beyond the Urals. It's not like Western Europe got crushed and the Soviets held their own the whole time. Hitler's crushed everyone at the outset and his controlled territory stretched from the Pyrenees (and even beyond that because Franco's Spain was an ally) to the western foothills of the Urals.
Also the only reason the Soviets stayed in the fight is American production and aid was feeding their unlimited supply of peasants to throw into the fight.
The Societs also only had to fight one real battle with Japan on what would've been a second front for them, and it occurred before the Molotov-von Ribbontrop Pact and the division of Poland (The Battle of Khalkin Gol). Moscow had a single front and the US/GBE fought in 3-4 separate theatres of war.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:29 am to TheGasMan
quote:
If you get a chance, read Ten Years and Twenty Days. One of the most amazing books I've ever read. Written by Grand Admiral Karl Donitz while he was in Spandau Prison. It goes into absolute detail of the U Boat force as he was in charge and the Battle of the Atlantic. It also provides incredible insight to the thought process of the upper chain of command at the end of the war as Donitz took over from Hitler.
thanks, added to my reading list. I just finished Das Boot a few months ago so I am on a bit of a U-boat kick
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:30 am to WestCoastAg
quote:I am 29, and all the history classes I took would have you believe D-day was monumental and the turning point of the war, and Germany was on the brink of winning the war until we got involved
except it is. At least nowadays. Idk what it was like 25 years ago
Russia is mentioned, but the weather gets all the credit for the eastern front
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:31 am to TIGERSandFROGS
Yes, but the question was, "How do you think World War 2 is taught in Russia?" not, "What really happened in World War 2?" Obviously the two things will most likely differ, especially in a country spiritually descended from the Soviet Union.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:32 am to TigerFanInSouthland
quote:
Honestly, I wonder if they are taught about Stalin killing hundreds of his officers?
And millions upon millions of other innocent people? More than hitler and hussein combined.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:32 am to AUCE05
quote:
WW2 was much more complex than what is written is western history. The common German people were struggling to feed their self, and the rich elite was shafting them hard. They didn't wake up one day and target the Jewish people for fun. Now, extremism won, which is terrifying, but the elite Jewish population during the era had a hand in starving the common German, which fueled the revolution, and rise of Hitler. Of course, us killing off the powers that be in WW1 didn't help. Point being, you can only steal form the poor for so long before something bad happens. France is another example. Their Queens head was separated from her body because she was a crook.
You sound like you heard that at a meeting of people with pointy hats. Hitler blamed the Jews for the economic troubles of the Weimar Republic, but there was no basis for it. There was no "Jewish Ruling Elite" in Germany.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:33 am to lsupride87
DDay was monumental. Germany wasn't on the brink of ending the war but they were up until American air power got involved. If America doesn't enter the war the Germany conquered Wurope sans Great Britain and Russia fights Germany to a standstill.
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:34 am to lsupride87
Agree. We slant it heavily in our direction. Which of course, is not true. Had Hitler left the U.K. alone, the Germanic tribes would be united today, minus the Anglos. I love European history. I have always tried to not view it as a good vs evil like we script it, but try and understand why one side is so angry that they want to war. Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:36 am to Tiger1242
quote:well sure. We had fundamentally different views on how the world should work. That was always going to breed conflict and did so even during the war time alliance
Eh, I'm sure we both contributed to it
quote:absolutely
Would he have done the same crap if Rosevelt were still alive?
Posted on 1/8/17 at 10:36 am to lsupride87
quote:I'm 23 and had a much different experience
I am 29, and all the history classes I took would have you believe D-day was monumental and the turning point of the war, and Germany was on the brink of winning the war until we got involved
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