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re: Colorado deputies shoot and kill man who asked for help after car crash
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:34 pm to lsugradman
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:34 pm to lsugradman
quote:its easy to argue after the fact. You have a guy thats talking and acting crazy. Until the cops get him out of the vehicle they are going to assume that he is a threat. How could they not? Are you really trying to argue that you would trust what this guy is saying with your life?
what the f are you talking about? Who said trust what he says? If he throws the knife out of the window then you can trust that he just threw a knife out of the window. At that point the risk profile of this whole situation has decreased dramatically. Then you can breach and use non lethal means with a much lower risk of bodily harm to anyone. He had the knife on his lap and threw it to the other seat. The cops thanked him for that. So how is it hard to take it one step further and remove it from the vehicle?
2
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:36 pm to Steadyhands
quote:
They should have broken the window, increased amount of non-lethal force, got his door open, and got him out.
From what i can tell they broke his window, shot him multiple times with non lethal rounds, hit him with a tazer, and possibly some mace. What else could they do?
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:37 pm to diat150
quote:
First off, they didnt know what weapons the guy had. What if he pulls out a gun and starts shooting? Then we would all be asking why they didnt pull him out of the car.
Your answer as to why, instead of waiting things out, they escalated the situation up to a fatal encounter is that he might have had a gun?
Are you a cop?
This post was edited on 9/14/22 at 12:39 pm
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:40 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
The discussion, if you'd bothered to follow it, was a hypothetical time frame for someone to sober up.
As long as it takes to not shoot someone dead?
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:41 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
Oh boy, you're one of those...
One of what?
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:47 pm to diat150
quote:
Are you really trying to argue that you would trust what this guy is saying with your life?
Again you have failed to point out where i said they should trust what the guy says. They had the car surrounded on all sides, they had flashlights illuminating the vehicle. If he throws the knife out, and then pulls a gun while you try to extract him, then clearly he needs to be shot dead. They were right next to the vehicle and one officer was on the hood, if they thought he might have a gun they wouldnt have been in those positions. They were working under the belief the only lethal weapon he had was a knife, and there was a clear missed opportunity to remove that from the equation early on.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:47 pm to Smoke7024
quote:
As long as it takes to not shoot someone dead?
And hope that this dude is truthful about his intentions?
No. Get him out of the car and under control. It sucks that he's dead, probably, but he wouldn't be dead if not for his own actions.
fricking thinking cops should sit around all day hoping this guy just needs some time...
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:47 pm to Corinthians420
quote:
when he was shot he was waving a knife but that door was shut and window was still in tact so no way he couldve stabbed anyone except himself
"Do not harm yourself or we're going to be forced to shoot!"
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:48 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
Let's push the suicidal guy off the bridge because he's been standing there an hour. 
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:48 pm to BuckyCheese
quote:just wnat to make sure I understand what you're saying. You quoted it so I'm pretty sure I do but I feel I need confirmation.
You're an incredibly ignorant person if you believe this.
You are saying that I am an "incredibly ignorant person" because I said I wouldn't trust what a person says when that person also just said that there are skin crawler people around that he may have to kill? Bold take by you!
quote:Now make it a gun...still not a threat? Why did you choose sword and not gun anyway?
He was sitting in his locked car. He could have a sword and not be a threat to those cops standing there pointing their guns at him.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:49 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:I love that he went to "he could have pulled a sword" to make his point but not, ya know, a gun.
Always love it when people who don't know what the frick they're talking about chime in as if they're experts.
Take a knee, sport.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:49 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
quote:
The one dude has posted no less than 4 times that that comment was a a response to an "IF" hypothetical question,
That's an assumption. A big one.
quote:
but you've yet to acknowledge that.
I have acknowledged that we don't have all of the audio as of this discussion
yet you definitively say that Leo should have left based on a supervisors opinion who is hearing about the situation from someone not directly on the scene. The audio made it sound like a state police officer (not on scene), talked to a different department officer (maybe on scene, maybe not) about the situation, and then the state police officer called his supervisor to discuss the situation (this last conversation was the audio in the edited video). So a person's initial thought on the situation who is 3-4 steps removed, is where you draw your hard line from for the thought that cops should have just left or waited it out?
Maybe the initial departments to respond called the state police because they likely have better resources and wanted to see if the state dept would be willing to send a person better trained for the situation. Then, upon initial details provided the state supervisor said no. Regardless of any of this, it is clear to anyone, that the officers on scene needed to stay until the situation was resolved.
Hopefully, you can conclude that you should drop the whole, "but muh supervisor said," thing.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:50 pm to diat150
quote:
From what i can tell they broke his window, shot him multiple times with non lethal rounds, hit him with a tazer, and possibly some mace. What else could they do?
Called him a tow truck
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:52 pm to ReauxlTide222
quote:Is that part of their policy? If so, then yes they should have. If not, we can argue it should be, but we can't then blame cops for not calling a doctor.
Maybe get a doctor out there who could talk to him in a way that he understand?
quote:i don't think that's a thing, at least not htat the cops are gonna use in that situation.
I doubt it’s realistic but I’d give police permission to tranquilize my son before blasting him in the chest. Or throw some type of sleeping gas shite in there(Idk if that’s even a thing
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:52 pm to BuckyCheese
quote:
Well, right before they unloaded on him he had at least 5 cops pointing guns at him, one standing on the hood of his car, all screaming at him.
That's not how the majority of the interaction went. They had five different people talk to him to ask him to step out. I've seen other body cam footages where the person refuses to get out and it is usually because they are DUI or have weapons. I've also seen footages where the cops were too easy going and ended up getting shot.
All this person said on the 911 call was that he crashed, he's not okay, and he has weapons.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:53 pm to Smoke7024
quote:
Let's push the suicidal guy off the bridge because he's been standing there an hour.
Nah. Let's wait around for 16 hours and hope he doesn't jump or attack someone.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:53 pm to shel311
quote:
Always love it when people who don't know what the frick they're talking about chime in as if they're experts.
Take a knee, sport.
I love that he went to "he could have pulled a sword" to make his point but not, ya know, a gun.
A cop was standing on the hood of his car.
I don't think he was too worried about him having a gun.
Ignorant frick.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:53 pm to diat150
quote:
From what i can tell they broke his window, shot him multiple times with non lethal rounds, hit him with a tazer, and possibly some mace. What else could they do?
It sounds like they had dozens of cops from every agency in the state. If that many officers can't get one presumably stoned skinny white dude out of a vehicle without blowing him away, they need to turn their badges in and find another line of work.
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:55 pm to Steadyhands
quote:
you definitively say that Leo should have left based on a supervisors opinion
That's my argument as to how this is going to unfold over time.
quote:
The audio made it sound like a state police officer (not on scene), talked to a different department officer (maybe on scene, maybe not) about the situation, and then the state police officer called his supervisor to discuss the situation (this last conversation was the audio in the edited video). So a person's initial thought on the situation who is 3-4 steps removed, is where you draw your hard line from for the thought that cops should have just left or waited it out?
If they advised there was no crime, then why were the LEO still there? That's what it sounds like the supervisor said, and I agree. Why were they still there if no crime or threat of bodily harm was present?
quote:
Regardless of any of this, it is clear to anyone, that the officers on scene needed to stay until the situation was resolved.
If there was no (1) crime or (2) threat of bodily harm, why?
Posted on 9/14/22 at 12:55 pm to Earnest_P
quote:Honest question looking for an actual number answer, how many hours are you waiting?
If you think he’s high and it’s causing him to act irrationally, why not wait until he either exits the car and actually poses a threat or until he’s no longer high and irrational?
quote:How many hours?
Just because it would be inconvenient to leave a couple officers there for hours watching him?
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