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re: All "Deep South" metro areas (MSAs) ranked by 2023 population (according to U.S. Census)
Posted on 6/20/24 at 12:36 pm to lsupride87
Posted on 6/20/24 at 12:36 pm to lsupride87
quote:
It’s very strange that people seem to be taking it personal that St. Tammany was dropped from the Nola MSA
Just Saints fans concerned it makes NOLA look even less like a NFL city.
2
Posted on 6/20/24 at 12:43 pm to chalmetteowl
quote:
That would be Metairie?
Nah, Metairie is pretty much just counted as part of New Orleans now, at least for these statistical purposes .. most of Old Metairie for instance is closer to the CBD than parts of actual New Orleans are, like Lakeview .
Posted on 6/20/24 at 12:45 pm to Govt Tide
quote:
There are a few things that as a fairly frequent visitor I strongly dislike about the Atlanta area in particular...the traffic...and the state of Georgia as a whole...the arrogant elitist attitude of a significant % of native Georgians who have the attitude that their s### doesn't stink and act like the state as a whole is a sophisticated utopia devoid of any shitty run down redneck areas like the rest of the South because they share a state with Atlanta, etc but I agree with this.
Traffic in Atlanta does suck and the suburban sprawl in a bad way is becoming LA like but to argue that Atlanta (the city and the metro) is a s###hole instead of the economic powerhouse and world class city it unquestionably is is a weird take. Atlanta has all the amenities of a world class city and has become one of the great large cities/urban areas in the U.S. It has been and will for the foreseeable future be the unquestioned king of the Southeast economically with huge job growth historically not to mention a massive international airport where you can catch a direct flight to almost anywhere. It's obvious why it's such a popular area for job seekers and families across the country to relocate to.
quote:
Govt Tide
Posted on 6/20/24 at 12:51 pm to No Colors
quote:Memphis is some kind of segregated.
Interesting fact: In the next census of 2030 the city that will most likely leapfrog Hattiesburg as the second largest city in the state is.....Olive Branch. A place that essentially no one had ever heard of 20 years ago.
2020 Census Racial Dot Map
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:00 pm to lsupride87
quote:
Correct. I can’t speak to the 90s but there is a very clear overall disdain for New Orleans in St. Tammany from my perspective currently
River Ridge was “I love Nola, but it isn’t safe enough”
Mandeville is “frick that shithole”
Painting with a broad brush obviously with both of the above
I think this is every suburban-city dynamic.
I'm originally from the Chicago MSA/CSA, but DEEP out in the suburbs. Everyone out there wanted nothing to do with Chicago proper/Cook county - but everyone would still say:
1) To other people from Illinois: "Suburbs of Chicago", "The Burbs" or something along those line.
2) Outside of Illinois: "Chicago"
I still think more than 51% of Mandeville residents will answer the question "Welcome to the Hilton Cologne, oh! I see you're from the States, where from?" with "New Orleans".
Regardless of the "frick Nola" sentiment, there is still a cultural connection between the Northshore and NOLA. Nothing about the Mandeville/Nola relationship seems any different than how the "rich" suburbs of any city feel about their core city. And honestly, Mandeville feels closer to NOLA on all fronts than say, Sleepy Hollow IL feels to Chicago.
Anecdotal, but in my 6 years in Mandeville I find my self in New Orleans proper FAR more times than I've been to Chicago in 22 years of living in the suburbs. The Causway, while long, is still fairly inconsequential to drive across compared to screwing around with I-90.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:03 pm to BRIllini07
quote:
I'm originally from the Chicago MSA/CSA, but DEEP out in the suburbs. Everyone out there wanted nothing to do with Chicago proper/Cook county - but everyone would still say: 1) To other people from Illinois: "Suburbs of Chicago", "The Burbs" or something along those line. 2) Outside of Illinois: "Chicago"
“White Boys Off the Lake”… that was the original working title of a movie called Risky Business .
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:05 pm to lsupride87
quote:
Mandeville is 35 miles from Nola
How do figure? NOLA (maybe technically Metairie) is on the south end of the Causeway and Mandeville is on the north end. You are literally in an urban area on either side before you get onto the bridge. Lake Ponchartrain Causeway is 24 miles long if I recall. None of the cities on the Northshore would even exist if not for NOLA.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:08 pm to BRIllini07
quote:Dash Rip Rock would disagree:
The Causway, while long, is still fairly inconsequential to drive across compared to screwing around with I-90.
"Longest Bridge in the World" YouTube Link
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:10 pm to LegendInMyMind
I’m surprised Decatur is not included with Huntsville yet. The river is the only thing left making them distinct.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:11 pm to samson73103
quote:Its not technically
How do figure? NOLA (maybe technically Metairie) is on the south end of the Causeway
When you get off the causeway you are in Metairie. Period
When deciding distance between cities it’s mid point to midpoint, which is 35 miles for mandeville to New Orleans
Sometimes it will be less as you are closer than the midpoint, and sometimes it will be further
This post was edited on 6/20/24 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:13 pm to lsupride87
quote:
They do include St. Fran which is 31 miles from BR. I do agree anything outside of 30 miles seems to stretch then limit but it still meets the commuter threshold
Yeah, anecdotal, but most of the people I know that live in St Francisville commute to BR. It's pretty far to consider it part of the metro though. I'd definitely include up to Zachary/Port Hudson though.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:19 pm to lsupride87
So what. Metairie joins NOLA and Mandeville would join Metairie if not for the lake. Newport Beach is 45 miles down the freeway from Los Angeles and it's considered part of L.A. Metro. Pretty sure most people consider the Northshore part of Greater NOLA. Once again, none of them would even exist if not for NOLA.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:27 pm to cbree88
quote:
Why the hell are people moving to a shite hole like Atlanta??
They are coming from shittier shitholes like Philly, Jersey, NYC, New Orleans. Atlanta is an upgrade for those people, but make it shitter for natives like myself who have watched the decline over the decades.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:28 pm to samson73103
quote:
None of the cities on the Northshore would even exist if not for NOLA.
Things change.
Galveston was at one point bigger and more profitable than Houston.
This post was edited on 6/20/24 at 1:29 pm
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:33 pm to lsupride87
quote:
The logic is based on actual commuters into the city
Less than 25% of St. Tammany residents commute into Nola for work. That’s the logic. The end
I'm not sure why this is so hard for those arguing against your point to understand.
As you have pointed out St. Tammany parrish didn't voluntarily decide to leave or split off from the New Orleans metro. The U.S. Census criteria for a county to be included in an MSA is for at least 25% of an adjacent county's workforce to commute to one of the core counties (i.e. Orleans or Jefferson parrish in NOLA's case). The Northshore has transitioned more from bedroom suburbs of New Orleans proper to its own business community hence their dropping below 25% commuting rate into NOLA proper. The most comparable example to St. Tammany parrish no longer being included in the New Orleans MSA is the situation with Baldwin County no longer officially being a part of the Mobile MSA. For decades Baldwin County was a part of the Mobile, AL MSA due to the large % of people who lived on the Eastern Shore and commuted to work in Mobile. That living in Baldwin/working in Mobile setup became an ever increasing trend for people living in Mobile who increasingly decided to live in Daphne, Fairhope, and Spanish Fort instead of Mobile but still work in Mobile.
This trend accelerated big time about 30 or so years ago while over the same time period hundreds/thousands of families and especially retirees from outside of the Mobile/Baldwin County area moved into Baldwin County from other parts of the state, the South, and also the Midwest. This created a critical mass of supporting businesses on the Eastern Shore to the point that the number of quality jobs in Baldwin County made it much less necessary to commute to Mobile for work. A lot of people still do commute to Mobile but the rate that still do dropped below the 25% threshhold needed for Baldwin County to remain a part of the Mobile MSA. The change in designation of Baldwin County as part of the Mobile MSA to its own MSA occurred a few years ago.
The most obvious similarity between Baldwin County and St. Tammany Parrish is that both are separated geographically from the core MSA they were once a part of by a large body of water...Mobile Bay and Lake Pontchartrain respectively. Likewise, the cities of Mandeville, Covington, Slidell, Ponchatoula, etc are in some ways similar to Daphne, Fairhope, and Spanish Fort with both situated on or near each body of water.
There are, of course, a couple of significant differences between the two areas (St Tammany and Baldwin) as well. Baldwin County has popular and well known beaches close by and both the beach areas and the Eastern Shore area of Baldwin County have become a fairly popular area for both retirees and families from across the state, the South, and even the Midwest to relocate to. I suspect (although I could be wrong) that St. Tammany's growth is more driven by flight from other areas of the NOLA metro and from other areas of the state of Louisiana whereas Baldwin County has a more regional draw
FYI, I have immediate family who have lived in the Mandeville/Covington area for the last 10 years and love it btw. I visit a lot and like the area a lot as well.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:40 pm to Govt Tide
quote:
I'm not sure why this is so hard for those arguing against your point to understand. As you have pointed out St. Tammany parrish didn't voluntarily decide to leave or split off from the New Orleans metro. The U.S. Census criteria for a county to be included in an MSA is for at least 25% of an adjacent county's workforce to commute to one of the core counties (i.e. Orleans or Jefferson parrish in NOLA's case). The Northshore has transitioned more from bedroom suburbs of New Orleans proper to its own business community hence their dropping below 25% commuting rate into NOLA proper.
Yep. Rather than take a look at why it’s now businesses fleeing nola not just residents to the point where <25% commute to the south shore they want to ignore the problem and still claim the northshore.
This should be a MAJOR red flag that that statistical point has been reached.
This post was edited on 6/20/24 at 1:42 pm
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:40 pm to LegendInMyMind
quote:
quote:
Nola could be second if they didn’t split off Hammond, Slidell-mandeville-Covington areas.
And Birmingham would be way down the list if they didn't get to keep claiming towns/cities that no longer claim them and are, by pretty much every standard, their own cities now.
What is included in Birmingham's MSA that shouldn't be? Birmingham is actually a pretty dense metropolitan area all things considered given that Hoover, Leeds, Gardendale, Bessemer, Pelham, Trussville, etc. are all a 15 - 20 minute drive to town. The MSA doesn't include Talledega, Sylacauga, Cullman, Tuscaloosa, etc. Only a couple of places with decent-sized population included in the MSA (Alabaster and Jasper, maybe) are more than a quick drive from the city.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 1:47 pm to fallguy_1978
quote:
Yeah, anecdotal, but most of the people I know that live in St Francisville commute to BR. It's pretty far to consider it part of the metro though
the commuting is exactly how the figure the MSA
Posted on 6/20/24 at 4:07 pm to lsupride87
quote:
It’s very strange that people seem to be taking it personal that St. Tammany was dropped from the Nola MSA
It's a personal affront to people who consider a city- limits New Orleans zip code part of their status in life.
Posted on 6/20/24 at 4:39 pm to Govt Tide
quote:
A lot of people still do commute to Mobile but the rate that still do dropped below the 25% threshhold needed for Baldwin County to remain a part of the Mobile MSA. The change in designation of Baldwin County as part of the Mobile MSA to its own MSA occurred a few years ago.
I’m pretty sure the commute rate from Baldwin County to Mobile is >30% still. There is hasn’t been a good reason why the two are still not considered one MSA.
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