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re: Trade I would like to see...

Posted on 10/29/23 at 6:42 pm to
Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
20737 posts
Posted on 10/29/23 at 6:42 pm to
quote:

JV + Kira + lottery protected 24 lakers pick for Daniel Gafford + 2 2nds.


I'm not sure that we'd get much better, if any. Yes, Gafford can run and protect the rim, but he's a poor rebounder. We'd be trading one set of weaknesses for a different one.

In on-the-court terms, Gafford would be an upgrade for Larry, not for JV. But I think that we are unlikely to trade Larry -- his voice in the locker room is very valuable right now.
Posted by Broski
Member since Jun 2011
79222 posts
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:25 pm to
If we make a run this year, we’ll pay the lux tax
Posted by VOR
Member since Apr 2009
67567 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 8:42 am to
Regardless of his slowish feet, I’d
hate to give up Val without a huge return.
Posted by saints5021
Louisiana
Member since Jul 2010
19157 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 8:47 am to
I don't think JV should start anymore, because of how he clogs the lane. However, I would love for him to come in and feast on second units. Swap him for Trigga in the starting lineup and watch Zion destroy first units
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112637 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 8:53 am to
quote:


I don't think JV should start anymore, because of how he clogs the lane. However, I would love for him to come in and feast on second units. Swap him for Trigga in the starting lineup and watch Zion destroy first units
I think that much Zion at center wouldn't work defensively.

But I agree Val shouldn't start. Nance should start at center and they stagger the Val/Zion minutes as much as possible
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29818 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 9:53 am to
quote:

They are going to trade JV to get under the cap



no. they are going to trade Kira to get under the cap.

quote:

They also have to extend Trey this offseason.

Trey makes $5.1M next season. his extension has nothing to do with next off season as it pertains to our team salary for next year, so we aren't looking to shed salary for next year b/c of him.
Jose on the other hand likely will get a contract this offseason. While we could keep him one more year at the minimum, i think they'll do him right and give him a real contract, like we did with Herb, and if they don't want to, then he would ask them to let him become a FA and not guarantee his option. He should get a TJ McConnell type deal, 4/$33M with the 4th year partially guaranteed.


We should be bringing JV back next year with a 2/$26M deal, or 3/$36M.
I like Larry, but i think you can find guys that make half of what he makes to do the same job.


Here's a trade i would rather see:

Larry to Washington into their TPE they have from Porzingis
Kira and a 2nd or two from Washington to Toronto
Precious, good ole Garrett Temple, Taj Gibson and one or two 2nds from Washington to Pels.
Raptors and Pels get under the tax.


It was confirmed last week that Toronto did not extend Precious' contract, so he'll be a RFA this offseason. I think he's an excellent backup big as a really really good defender and rim protector, better than Larry.
I think you can likely get him for under $8M/yr, although i think the reason he didn't get an extension is b/c he wants more than that. He looks at Brandon Clarke's 4/$50M and wants something more like that, although i think most in the league think Clarke is a bit overpaid at that salary for someone who legit can't shoot, but Clarke does have better looking stats than Precious, which is why i think you'll see him more in that $8-10M/yr range rather than $12M.
Precious is a bit lighter than Larry, so it would be important to keep another vet big on the roster, like Zeller, but he without a doubt can be the backup 5 on our team, like Larry is, and he's an excellent perimeter defender for a big.
Posted by Soggymoss
Member since Aug 2018
17419 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 10:20 am to
Larry is a HUGE influence on the locker room, y’all can keep trying but they will not trade him no matter how wild you concoct a trade.
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29818 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 10:33 am to
quote:

Larry is a HUGE influence on the locker room, y’all can keep trying but they will not trade him no matter how wild you concoct a trade.



i'm 100% aware of that, and for the most part agree that they would be very unlikely to trade him.
But it's going to be very difficult to stay under the tax next year with JV and Larry, and we need both of those guys.
Even if you didn't resign JV, you have to find someone who can physically try to defend Jokic, and there aren't any 7' 250lb guys in the league that can do that making under $10M/yr unless they are on a rookie deal.
Posted by WicKed WayZ
Louisiana Forever
Member since Sep 2011
33551 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:02 am to
I’m all for trying to get young and athletic at center but right now…JV should stay. I really liked the CJ/JV lineup from the other night.


Keep that lineup and then have BI/Zion or maybe do BI/JV and CJ/Zion. I think that’s the optimal way to go and makes us really hard to defend for 4 quarters
Posted by supe12sta12z
Tiger Town
Member since Apr 2012
12945 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:12 am to
I'll be paying attention closely to a guy like Kyle Filipowski this year to see if he naturally progresses as a 3 point shooter. I think he would make a good successor to JV if we end up moving on from him after the season.

We're going to lose someone important after the season. I can't imagine we go into the tax for JV. Just can't see it.

Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29818 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:17 am to
JV is one of the best offensive centers in the league, still. He can make a shot from anywhere on the court and if you took a poll from nba players on what guys they can't stand having to play against from a strength point of view, JV would be in the top 5 without a doubt. He's so big and strong and always gives the effort to get rebounds, and keeping him off the boards is a challenge for every team we play.

No he cannot guard the perimeter effectively, but at least his offense and rebounding help out tremendously, and can affect how the other team plays and actually who they play. You can try to go small against us with JV, but if we feed him the ball with a smaller guy on him, he will destroy them. There aren't many centers who demand the other team play another big center like JV does.
Posted by WicKed WayZ
Louisiana Forever
Member since Sep 2011
33551 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:23 am to
And I think the Nuggs winning last year proved you can just be average defensively and win it all. It pays to be really really good offensively
Posted by supe12sta12z
Tiger Town
Member since Apr 2012
12945 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:24 am to
It's a misconception that Denver is average defensively. They are very good.
Posted by Soggymoss
Member since Aug 2018
17419 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:32 am to
quote:

But it's going to be very difficult to stay under the tax next year with JV and Larry

It really won’t, we’re currently 22 million under the projected tax with 10 contracts next year (assuming we pick up Jose’s option). That’s at Spotrac’s estimate if 172 million tax line, it could be higher depending on what the cap spikes to.

12 million to JV leaves 10 million to fill out 4 spots. We could give 4 million to Naji and sign 3 minimum level contracts and still be below the tax. Those numbers can change depending on draft position of course, but still 22 million below the tax with really only have one consequential free agent that won’t demand more than 12-14 million is a great place to be in.
This post was edited on 10/30/23 at 11:38 am
Posted by supe12sta12z
Tiger Town
Member since Apr 2012
12945 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:36 am to
Auh... You gotta pay BI and possibly Trey as well.
Posted by Soggymoss
Member since Aug 2018
17419 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:38 am to
quote:

Auh... You gotta pay BI and possibly Trey as well.

They’re already under contract for next year, if they get an extension it wouldn’t be on next years cap numbers.
Posted by iwyLSUiwy
I'm your huckleberry
Member since Apr 2008
40825 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:41 am to
quote:

JV is a better player than Gafford. But Gafford would fill a huge need on defense and is cheaper.



So give away the better player and better assets? Trade makes no sense other than just lowering salary. I personally don't like trades that make our team worse.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112637 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 11:43 am to
quote:

Auh... You gotta pay BI and possibly Trey as well.

They're already under contract next season and baked into the $22mil under the tax number the previous poster mentioned.
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
29818 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 12:10 pm to
quote:

assuming we pick up Jose’s option


I just don't think Jose is going to be making $2M next year.
Both this year and next year were team options.

Jose can easily get TJ McConnell money on the open market right now, 4/$33M. He wants to get that next deal, and he deserves it. I would think that he would ask the Pels to either give him a new contract, or do not guarantee his contract so he can become a FA.

Both he and Naji signed similar contracts, but the difference between the two is Jose has value to other teams in the league, and teams would give him a decent contract if he was available. No one is giving Naji more than slightly above the minimum. Naji doesn't have the opportunity to hit a nice contract like Jose does, and while the Pelicans could tell Jose we still have you for one more year at the league minimum, that's a good way to ensure that it will be the last year you get to keep Jose b/c he'll remember that when free agency starts and basically tell the Pels to go frick themselves while he signs a new contract elsewhere.



It's the same scenario we just had with Herb. Yeah we could have told Herb we still got you at one more year at the league minimum, but the right thing to do was to give him a new contract and not exercise that 3rd year minimum. Same should be done for Jose with his 4th year. He's given enough to the team and earned it, now pay him.




and if he makes $8M next year instead of $2M, now you have 4 spots to fill with $4M, and one of those will be a 1st round pick that will make $3M
Posted by Soggymoss
Member since Aug 2018
17419 posts
Posted on 10/30/23 at 12:27 pm to
We could pick up Jose’s option and still give him an extension after, it’s not one or the other.
This post was edited on 10/30/23 at 12:28 pm
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