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2
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:26 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:Thats why I didn't understand passing on him last year. The talent was clear. Almost all of his peers said he was/is the best player in his HS class.
Reddish flashed from serious potential imo, and with his physical gifts he could be something.
We should keep Langdon in mind here, also. Being a Duke guy, i'm sure he got every piece of info possible from Coach K. So what was it about Reddish that made him feel ok passing on twice? Then feel ok about about trading Jrue for him a year later. Because to me, Reddish flashed the same talent he'd always flashed. That shouldn't have been a surprise.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:26 pm to Pelefraan 1
quote:I'd be cool with him going to a third team, but he will want a max and he isn't a natural fit next to Zion defensively.
John Collins is a complete stud. I'd take him before Myles Turner any day.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:26 pm to NOSHAU
Yeah I do not think Herro is available.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:27 pm to supe12sta12z
quote:
John Collins would be a good get as far as assets goes.
I didn't realize he shot so well from 3 this past year, 40% on 3.6 attempts per game. Admittedly, i don't watch the Hawks, and didn't keep up with much this year, but i thought he couldn't shoot and they might have been shopping him last offseason.
Seems i was way off on that.
Did find this nugget on him. He wants a max extension this offseason.
quote:
Even with all those concerns, what this potential showdown will boil down to is the dollar amount. Collins believes he’s earned a max extension. Atlanta is reportedly hesitant to throw such money his way (subscription required). The situation isn’t aided by the ongoing uncertainty of the 2019-20 season and beyond, which could leave a sizeable dent in projected cap figures.
The Atlanta Hawks do have one leg up in negotiations. Even if Collins is hell-bent on a max deal, would he really be willing to enter restricted free agency in 2021 amid the unknown waters of the league’s finances?
maybe they are looking at extending Collins, and trading him for Jrue, who will be extended as well, and the salaries will match up for the most part.
Not a bad idea for the Hawks if they really believe in Hunter and Reddish. Both of them are big guards who can defend multiple positions. Would give them a really nice defensive lineup with Jrue/Hunter/Reddish/Capela. You get Hunter and Reddish to knock down open 3's on offense while you let Trae run PnR with Capela, and Jrue is your secondary ball handler.
Maybe Collins is a guy that will play really well alongside Zion.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:29 pm to Bronc
quote:Their assumption is that Huerter + 6 is equivalent to the Warriors pick, based upon what we've heard speculation about in regards to Jrue's value, I doubt that Herro is on the block.
Seems like the bar is likely Caris Levert, the Warriors pick, potentially the Minny pick, or Tyler Herro + pieces(given Shams rumor)
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:30 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:Not sure Pels would want to invest near-max money in Collins unless they feel he is the missing piece of a "Big 3" with Zion and BI. Also would mean that they have already decided Ball will not be part of the future. If Collins involved, I would think it would be to send him elsewhere for assets.
Maybe Collins is a guy that will play really well alongside Zion.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:31 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Problem being he will want a max deal after next season.
Well, he's basically taking the place of Jrue's contract so it's a bit of a wash
And no, Herro is not on the block
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:36 pm to Pelefraan 1
quote:And Jrue's contract is part of the reason he possibly is on the block. Pels are about to commit max deal to BI and have to decide what to do with Ball. Not sure they have space for another max deal.
Well, he's basically taking the place of Jrue's contract so it's a bit of a wash
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:36 pm to Pelefraan 1
Rest of the points still stand here, Herro or not, If the Hawks are a serious player they need to find a third team for Collins or be willing to part with Hunter or Reddish. Collins and Zion is not a realistic frontcourt(especially under SVG) and would get eaten alive.
Other rumored trades either offer proven talents like Levert or the potential of draft picks that allow us to dictate who we choose.
Other rumored trades either offer proven talents like Levert or the potential of draft picks that allow us to dictate who we choose.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:48 pm to Bronc
quote:
Collins and Zion is not a realistic frontcourt(especially under SVG) and would get eaten alive.
Why not?
quote:
Though not a go-to stopper, Collins has made tremendous progress at the defensive end after an ugly sophomore season. His career-high 1.6 blocks per game were tied for 11th-best in the league. Impressive, considering a below-average 6’11” wingspan on a 6’10” frame.
Opponents’ offensive rating dips 2.3 points when he’s on the court, holding individual matchups to roughly identical percentages compared to when guarded by someone else. His uber-athletic abilities make for an intriguing switchable piece defensively, even if he still has a ways to go in that area.
what are you envisioning next to Zion?
If you ask me, Zion needs to play the 5, and we need an athletic 4 that can switch anything, hit open 3's, and is a great rebounder. If Zion or the 4 can defend most of the 5's in the league, then that's our best bet b/c opposing teams 5 cannot defend Zion. We have to force other teams to play small with us.
You don't always need a great rim protector to protect the paint. Obviously it's better to have one than not have one, but having better perimeter defenders that can keep guys out of the paint is a much better defense than playing crappy perimeter defense and letting a guy like Gobert have to deal with guys coming at him all game.
The Warriors and Rockets have been playing most of their clutch minutes without a great rim protector, and their defenses are still legit. It's b/c they have a better defensive plan and perimeter defenders to limit open runs into the paint.
Is Jrue extended and Collins extended a fair trade if they are swapped? are other pieces needed in that? Kinda feels like that would be a clean swap of players. Honestly don't know if one side would feel they need more in that swap.
This post was edited on 11/9/20 at 3:52 pm
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:56 pm to TeddyPadillac
Zion is not anywhere close to being able to play the five full time, and I sort of think he never will be.
Playing clutch minutes is one thing, building a frontcourt around a length deficient and size deficient PF is another(on a SVG team no less). Neither are strong rim-protecting big men. And if you are going to max two frontcourt players(Collins and Zion eventually), they need to be natural fits. And they just aren't defensively. They compound one another's weak points, not compliment them.
Offensively it would be perfect, but it would be a sieve defensively with Ingram, Zion, and Collins as your front court, and like I mentioned a couple times, it does not feel like a team SVG would go for.
Playing clutch minutes is one thing, building a frontcourt around a length deficient and size deficient PF is another(on a SVG team no less). Neither are strong rim-protecting big men. And if you are going to max two frontcourt players(Collins and Zion eventually), they need to be natural fits. And they just aren't defensively. They compound one another's weak points, not compliment them.
Offensively it would be perfect, but it would be a sieve defensively with Ingram, Zion, and Collins as your front court, and like I mentioned a couple times, it does not feel like a team SVG would go for.
This post was edited on 11/9/20 at 3:58 pm
Posted on 11/9/20 at 3:58 pm to NOSHAU
quote:Money isn't the issue with Jrue, it's money in conjunction with fit (both skillset and age). The Pels can afford to pay another player the amount that Jrue is going to demand on the market, but only if that player fits with the team. Not saying that Collins is the answer here, but it's not that they can't afford to pay Jrue, if he were a better fit there would be no questions about paying him 30 mil or whatever.
And Jrue's contract is part of the reason he possibly is on the block. Pels are about to commit max deal to BI and have to decide what to do with Ball. Not sure they have space for another max deal.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:16 pm to Epic Cajun
Just able to catch up on everything, and seen the latest about Minny being hot after Jrue.
It's no secret, Charlotte is in love with Wiseman and wants to trade up for him.
What would everyone think about:
Minny: Jrue
Char: #1, James Johnson (they have to eat the salary as part of the move up)
NOP: #3, 21 Charlotte unprotected 1st, 23 Minny top 10 protected 1st (unprotected in 24)
We are still in position for Hayes, don't have to pay #1 pick salary, and have 2 future 1sts that are very good assets to deal if something comes up, along with opening 27 million in cap space.
It's no secret, Charlotte is in love with Wiseman and wants to trade up for him.
What would everyone think about:
Minny: Jrue
Char: #1, James Johnson (they have to eat the salary as part of the move up)
NOP: #3, 21 Charlotte unprotected 1st, 23 Minny top 10 protected 1st (unprotected in 24)
We are still in position for Hayes, don't have to pay #1 pick salary, and have 2 future 1sts that are very good assets to deal if something comes up, along with opening 27 million in cap space.
This post was edited on 11/9/20 at 4:18 pm
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:17 pm to Soggymoss
That would be interesting. That Charlotte 2021 pick in a much better draft would be pretty amazing asset.
I don't see Charlotte doing that to move up 2 spots.
I don't see Charlotte doing that to move up 2 spots.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:18 pm to Fun Bunch
I don't know, they are apparently enamored with Wiseman and want to do whatever possible to get him.
They may want to protect it top 3, which I would be ok with.
They may want to protect it top 3, which I would be ok with.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:19 pm to Fun Bunch
Charlotte sounds like they want Wiseman. If that’s the case, I’ll be surprised if they don’t sit tight.
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:20 pm to Fun Bunch
I wonder if Charlotte does it if it’s top 3 or top 5 protected
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:21 pm to BallHawk
Top 3 makes it worth it. Top 5 is probably a deal breaker because Charlotte will be in the top 5 
Posted on 11/9/20 at 4:28 pm to Fun Bunch
Compromise, top 4 protected, since they now draw for the top 4 positions.
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