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Started By
Message
re: NBA Offseason officially kicks off, Ingram’s days in NOLA coming to an end per Stein
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:15 am to Pels_Yaz
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:15 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
Hmm ballstopping leading to being one of the best passers in the league?
He gets a lot of assists b/c of the ballstopping
People claim he's an elite passer b/c of the assists
3
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:16 am to 50_Tiger
quote:
Trae would be playing next to the best co-star he's ever had.
So he'll change his personality and finally play team ball?
And are we just abandoning point Zion?
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:16 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I used the Ringer rankings as a secondary source to show comparable values of BI, Trae, and Bridges. It's not the end-all, be-all.
You literally started your discussion based on the ringer rankings even stating Bridges ranking. Now you’re backtracking like its not the “end-all” but thats fine.
quote:
There are other options, like getting better value than we give out for guys who aren't over-priced like Murray or Garland (if this occurs).
Ok lets say we go that route what is the potential of that team moving forward? You think we have a chance to be a top team with those guys? Whats the goal here? We save assets and get Murray- so we could lose in first round?
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:16 am to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
I'm just not seeing it. Trae is one of the more notable ball-stoppers in the league, something that people on this board conveniently ignore in their love affair.
Well he's a PG, so he's not really a ball stopper, as he's the guy that has the ball in his hands from the start.
The guy that was 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 2nd, 2nd in assists the last 5 years is a ball stopper?
Let's use a different set of words for a PG that racks up that many assists, such as...an excellent creator of offense for both himself and others.
The guy has been around an ORtg of 120 (which is typically a top 5 offense) the last 4 years when he's on the court, and the offense drops off considerably when he leaves the floor.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:18 am to higgsBoson
quote:
I feel like people just want different things or think about things differently
Everyone does, but Trae isn't the only option.
Hell, we have 3 different pg options we could acquire this offseason, with Trae being the most expensive (based on this conversation).
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:18 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
He gets a lot of assists b/c of the ballstopping
So he plays hero ball and doesn’t play the PNR but can still accumulate a lot of assists?
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:20 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Ball stopper doesn't mean you always shoot. It means you always want to control the ball on offense.
So CP3 was a ball stopper, and that got damn John Stockton always had the ball in his damn hands. Biggest ball stopper of all time huh.
This post was edited on 6/26/24 at 8:26 am
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:20 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
He gets a lot of assists b/c of the ballstopping
What the frick is going on right now
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:22 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
What the frick is going on right now
When you really dislike a player you make up stuff to fit your narrative and then call other people “strawmen.”
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:24 am to SlowFlowPro
I be honest. The guard I want to grab is Tyus Jones who is UFA.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:24 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
You literally started your discussion based on the ringer rankings
A lie.
I started my argument with this:
quote:
Trae Young made one, 3rd team All-NBA in his apex year (21-22). Otherwise he's around the 30-40 range.
which confirms what I stated in the post you quoted (and ignored)
quote:
I started by saying he's not elite based on all-NBA appearances.
So you were just owned and your intellectual dishonesty was put on display...agian.
quote:
Ok lets say we go that route what is the potential of that team moving forward? You think we have a chance to be a top team with those guys?
We would be about as good with Trae, without the downside risk.
But we would still have assets to get that possibly elite guy down the road. We don't if we super overpay for Trae
quote:
We save assets and get Murray- so we could lose in first round?
As opposed to not making the playoffs with Trae?
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:26 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
The guy that was 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 2nd, 2nd in assists the last 5 years is a ball stopper?
Ball stopper doesn't mean he always shoots, and accumulating a lot of easy assists could be a function of hogging the ball. It doesn't disprove his ball-stopping status in any way.
quote:
The guy has been around an ORtg of 120 (which is typically a top 5 offense) the last 4 years when he's on the court, and the offense drops off considerably when he leaves the floor.
And how has his team performed?
How much worse was ATL this year when he missed an extended period of time?
What happened with their defensive rankings?
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:29 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
What the frick is going on right now
Trae holds onto the ball. He doesn't mind passing for easy assists, but the big issue is his counter is not caring if he throws up terrible shots if those openings don't occur.
That's why he's seen as an elite shooter when he's not an actually elite shooter.
If he accepted more of a secondary role and did what CJ did this year, I think that he could emerge as that elite shooter, but he has to give up being ball dominant and play within an offense. Kind of like BI but on steroids.
Again, ATL brought in Snyder to reign him in and play within an offense and it has been a disaster and they're now putting Trae on the block b/c of how bad that was.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:29 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
People claim he's an elite passer b/c of the assists
Have you watched him play? He's a very good passer.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:31 am to teke184
quote:
People complain about dinosaur bigs then want to throw money at a guy who has gotten played off the floor constantly for being too slow.
It’s taking a flyer on a #2 overall pick that can play, you trust your defensive minded coach to coach him up on playing better defense, then you have agood young player on a great contract that gives you another asset to send out in trades.
It’s moot now though, Detroit is renouncing his rights so they won’t be able to S&T him, so I would pivot to the CJ/Nance for Cam and Clax deal, still do the Trae deal. Send all those picks i don’t give a shite
This post was edited on 6/26/24 at 8:31 am
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:31 am to Epic Cajun
quote:
Have you watched him play? He's a very good passer.
I think what SFP is worried about is this will be Ingram 2.0 and he'll have the skills/ability to do what we need, but not the habits. It's a concern, but if Trae does what he does out of ego, he's never played with someone like Zion. They could have the top highlight on Sportscenter 3 nights a week.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:31 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
So CP3 was a ball stopper,
Yes, and there is a reason his style of play isn't winning anything and why PHO moved on from him after that one magical year.
quote:
and that got damn John Stockton always had the ball in his damn hands.
This isn't the 80s/90s anymore.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:32 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
And how has his team performed?
So when it's proven that he's a good offensive player you move the goalposts to the defensive side?
We are aware that he isn't good defensively, which is why we would have to keep Herb and also get a rim protecting center.
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:32 am to Soggymoss
quote:
you trust your defensive minded coach to coach him up on playing better defense
Did you not follow him in Detroit this year? That already failed.
quote:
Detroit is renouncing his rights
More argument why your hypothetical contract was insanity
Posted on 6/26/24 at 8:33 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I started my argument with this:
Yes but then you added 2 long paragraphs about ringer rankings but now you’re acting like its not important. You backtrack like crazy when called out. Majority if your post is using ringer rankings to make your point.
quote:
We would be about as good with Trae, without the downside risk. But we would still have assets to get that possibly elite guy down the road. We don't if we super overpay for Trae
Trae has gone to eastern conf finals with lesser talent than Zion but you ignore that as well. And you keep acting like some “magic” elite guy will be down the road while we tread the play-in.
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