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How Good Does This Team Have To Be For You To Accept Losing the 2022 1st?
Posted on 1/14/22 at 6:25 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 6:25 am
If this team stays healthy they are at least making the Play In and very well might make the Playoffs. If they make the playoffs then the 2022 1st round pick goes to Charlotte for Devonte Graham.
I know a lot of you have been dreaming of a top 4 pick, how good do they need to be for you to give up that dream? GOP threw out a scenario of making the 6th seed and getting paired against the Grizz who we match up well against and could beat in the 1st round. That would definitely make me feel better about losing a 1st.
I know a lot of you have been dreaming of a top 4 pick, how good do they need to be for you to give up that dream? GOP threw out a scenario of making the 6th seed and getting paired against the Grizz who we match up well against and could beat in the 1st round. That would definitely make me feel better about losing a 1st.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 6:26 am
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Posted on 1/14/22 at 6:30 am to TigerinATL
I want this team to continue to grow and improve. If we make it to the play in games and some how get into the playoffs it is worth it. The experience of winning would do way more for this team than a draft pick. Plus if Zion does not come back this season , he will be adding to a playoff team
Posted on 1/14/22 at 7:19 am to TigerinATL
This team is what, half a game out of the play-in with a combination of the following:
1. 0 contribution by our superstar who the whole team is built around.
2. A terrible start that put us in the hole.
3. A gaping void of alleged flexibility (trad exception, Sato, etc.) that is supposed to be a contributing player.
I don't know if we have a choice about the 1st. We get Zion back and a contributor like Powell and we're a playoff team
1. 0 contribution by our superstar who the whole team is built around.
2. A terrible start that put us in the hole.
3. A gaping void of alleged flexibility (trad exception, Sato, etc.) that is supposed to be a contributing player.
I don't know if we have a choice about the 1st. We get Zion back and a contributor like Powell and we're a playoff team
Posted on 1/14/22 at 7:56 am to TigerinATL
We’re an above avg PG and Zion away from being scary.
If Herb continues his trajectory our starting 5 of
PG
Herb
BI
Zion
JV
6th Man
Graham
Gives us about as best a shot at anything considering how the NBA operates.
If Herb continues his trajectory our starting 5 of
PG
Herb
BI
Zion
JV
6th Man
Graham
Gives us about as best a shot at anything considering how the NBA operates.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:13 am to TigerinATL
Making the playoffs is worth the pick going to Charlotte. Most of these guys have never sniffed playoff basketball, and all it takes is one time to unlock a hunger to return over and over.
That's far more valuable than a dice roll draft pick
That's far more valuable than a dice roll draft pick
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:16 am to Split2874
quote:
want this team to continue to grow and improve. If we make it to the play in games and some how get into the playoffs it is worth it. The experience of winning would do way more for this team than a draft pick. Plus if Zion does not come back this season , he will be adding to a playoff team
yep. every word.
if im tdgm i buy a pg now.
let the chips fall where they may but i take a swing.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 8:19 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:21 am to TigerinATL
I know we’re playing really well right now, but this upcoming stretch is gonna tell a lot. Nets, Celtics, Knicks our next 3.
The next step is to see this team win against some playoff level healthy squads.
The next step is to see this team win against some playoff level healthy squads.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:26 am to TigerinATL
To me, losing a play-in game is not worth a first-round pick.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:33 am to Mulkey Man
quote:
losing a play-in game
If this happens, then we keep the pick. The pick only conveys to Charlotte if we are one of the 8 teams in the west that makes the playoffs.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:34 am to Mulkey Man
quote:
To me, losing a play-in game is not worth a first-round pick
Pretty sure if we lose the play-in then we keep the pick. We only lose the pick if we “make the playoffs” as in get into the top 8 by winning the play-in. Correct?
ETA: Thanks Soggy Moses
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 8:35 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:40 am to Mulkey Man
People that bring up the play-in conveniently leave out that the current ten seed is sitting at 39% win percentage.
The west takes a big dip after the top 4 and is downright dreadful after the top 6. I’m not sure, outside of self desire to see the team be there, what magical situation makes 1 or 2 games plus getting waxed by the Warriors or Suns is going to achieve?
This team is also not just marginal improvement away from being a contender, they need another high level, synergistic piece to push a healthy BI/Zion squad up into the upper echelon and basically the only way to get that will be the draft. Even if it’s just to turn around and sell that pick for, say, a Damian Lillard or Beal.
To me it’s very simple, this core with a top 4 pick that lives up it’s billing >>> a Zion/Bi and pieces core, and no amount of playoff experience is going to outdo that. So there is really no realistic circumstance where I’m ok with losing the pick for a guy that should honestly be coming off the bench.
The west takes a big dip after the top 4 and is downright dreadful after the top 6. I’m not sure, outside of self desire to see the team be there, what magical situation makes 1 or 2 games plus getting waxed by the Warriors or Suns is going to achieve?
This team is also not just marginal improvement away from being a contender, they need another high level, synergistic piece to push a healthy BI/Zion squad up into the upper echelon and basically the only way to get that will be the draft. Even if it’s just to turn around and sell that pick for, say, a Damian Lillard or Beal.
To me it’s very simple, this core with a top 4 pick that lives up it’s billing >>> a Zion/Bi and pieces core, and no amount of playoff experience is going to outdo that. So there is really no realistic circumstance where I’m ok with losing the pick for a guy that should honestly be coming off the bench.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 8:45 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:51 am to Bronc
quote:
The west takes a big dip after the top 4 and is downright dreadful after the top 6. I’m not sure, outside of self desire to see the team be there, what magical situation makes 1 or 2 games plus getting waxed by the Warriors or Suns is going to achieve?
a. It signals to the team (esp Zion) that winning matters.
b. It's good experience. We're not just going to appear and be a top 4 seed. We're young and need to get playoff experience when we can.
Also, once we're out of the top-6 or so, the 1st loses a lot of value. Outside of the top 10, it's a legit crap shoot. Our roster is going to be pretty full and if we're not getting a LEGIT bona fide player, that middle-round 1st isn't going to be very valuable.
quote:
This team is also not just marginal improvement away from being a contender
This is the NBA, not the NFL. We likely never will be a contender. If we do, it will be a 1 or 2 year window and then we'll be under water (like Cleveland after they won it with Lebron).
We will never be attractive to the cheap veteran pieces that we will need to be a contender if we don't take winning seriously.
quote:
and basically the only way to get that will be the draft.
That window is likely closed. With Zion this is a playoff team. We will only get the shot at those types of talent via Lakers or Bucks picks down the road.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:56 am to SlowFlowPro
I AM frickING SICK OF LOSING ... Do whatever you can to win something of meaning that is not the lottery.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 8:59 am to saints5021
Also a few more losses to being in top5
Tank unless Zion comes back, which he won’t.
Tank unless Zion comes back, which he won’t.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:02 am to Bronc
quote:
This team is also not just marginal improvement away from being a contender, they need another high level, synergistic piece
Do they? That's part of the point of this thread. How much do they have to win for you to feel it's not Fool's Gold? If they get the 6 seed they'll have done more than play .500 ball like they're currently doing.
I'm not saying a top 4 pick wouldn't help, but look at Ingram's improvement as a playmaker. He also is defending with a lot more effort and effectiveness, I think partly because the offense is easier for him, something you've long speculated would happen.
Now imagine the same improvements and easing of the offensive load for Zion. It makes me wonder if we still do need a high level lead guard. Crunch time against good teams will probably change my mind, but Zion/BI/JV is an All NBA player, an All Star player and a fringe All Star player, the amount of top talent you want to build around.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:03 am to SlowFlowPro
None of that is going to make this team better over the next 2-5 years vs landing a top 4 talent that we hit on, either via trade or drafting that pick and developing them.
Our roster is not full either, a good chunk of the players we currently have getting minutes wouldn’t get minutes on a good playoff team. We basically have no starting caliber guards right now outside of arguably Hart, who I also think is better as a sixth man.
Honestly, a lot of this conversation and thread feels like deja vu from the Demps era. Where everyone kept trying to convince themselves that a poorly constructed and incomplete roster was better than it was and just needed health and would sell themselves on rather marginal upgrades and season milestones over the obvious path, which is to see a lost season as an opportunity to get the roster better, not desperately try and achieve what is ultimately, long term, a meaningless milestone, which won’t make up for the lack of talent in the long run.
It’s clear we aren’t going my direction at this point, which would be winning, sure, but coequally focus on conserving the health of our best players by not piling on too many minutes and developing our young guys. We’d likely still have nice wins but slip comfortably into the early lottery and have something to actually use long-term…but you play in pumpers are gonna get your wish it seems barring injury…we’ll get a play in berth, either lose or get the privilege of being a warm up series for GS or Pho. Neither of which is going to alter the perception of this franchise much, but will cost a first rounder or put that first rounder at a point in the draft it lacks much value or upside probability given how front loaded this draft is
Our roster is not full either, a good chunk of the players we currently have getting minutes wouldn’t get minutes on a good playoff team. We basically have no starting caliber guards right now outside of arguably Hart, who I also think is better as a sixth man.
Honestly, a lot of this conversation and thread feels like deja vu from the Demps era. Where everyone kept trying to convince themselves that a poorly constructed and incomplete roster was better than it was and just needed health and would sell themselves on rather marginal upgrades and season milestones over the obvious path, which is to see a lost season as an opportunity to get the roster better, not desperately try and achieve what is ultimately, long term, a meaningless milestone, which won’t make up for the lack of talent in the long run.
It’s clear we aren’t going my direction at this point, which would be winning, sure, but coequally focus on conserving the health of our best players by not piling on too many minutes and developing our young guys. We’d likely still have nice wins but slip comfortably into the early lottery and have something to actually use long-term…but you play in pumpers are gonna get your wish it seems barring injury…we’ll get a play in berth, either lose or get the privilege of being a warm up series for GS or Pho. Neither of which is going to alter the perception of this franchise much, but will cost a first rounder or put that first rounder at a point in the draft it lacks much value or upside probability given how front loaded this draft is
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 9:10 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:08 am to TigerinATL
If Zion isn't playing with them, then i'd rather not make the playoffs. If Zion is playing, then i 100% want to make the playoffs. They need the experience, but having that experience without Zion is kind of pointless.
And the fact that we have to have this conversation is stupid b/c we have a dumbass for a GM.
And the fact that we have to have this conversation is stupid b/c we have a dumbass for a GM.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:10 am to TeddyPadillac
Obviously the ideal situation if Zion doesn't return is to make the play in and lose. There needs to be progression.
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:19 am to Bronc
Go tell BI, Hart, Jonas and he'll even Herb that your plan is to limit their minutes and tank to try to get a better draft pick.
You will get 2-3 trade demands within minutes, which then sets you back 5 years, and really sets you back in trying to attract free agents ti play with the coach it seems you hit a home run on.
Tanking is not the answer, trying to win every single game we can, which will push Zion to work even harder than he already is, and you may have a legit top 8 team in the NBA, which will then start getting more guys to look our way in the offseason.
You will get 2-3 trade demands within minutes, which then sets you back 5 years, and really sets you back in trying to attract free agents ti play with the coach it seems you hit a home run on.
Tanking is not the answer, trying to win every single game we can, which will push Zion to work even harder than he already is, and you may have a legit top 8 team in the NBA, which will then start getting more guys to look our way in the offseason.
This post was edited on 1/14/22 at 9:20 am
Posted on 1/14/22 at 9:20 am to supe12sta12z
This team making the playoffs would be great no matter if it is with Zion or not. With Zion he gets experience, without he see they got there without him and they all will have experience.
Plus maybe making the playoffs will attract free agents since we are almost there.
I do not think this team is a finished product and we need better guards.
Plus trying to make the playoffs will instill some drive and passion for this team. If they don't make it is nit because they quit, which I think would be way worse for this team
Plus maybe making the playoffs will attract free agents since we are almost there.
I do not think this team is a finished product and we need better guards.
Plus trying to make the playoffs will instill some drive and passion for this team. If they don't make it is nit because they quit, which I think would be way worse for this team
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