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What is the worst that the NCAA could have done to us
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:26 pm
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:26 pm
If we had just kept Will Wade…
Because firing him seems like it’s going to set the program back as far if not further than any “sanctions” imposed by the NCAA.
Thoughts?
Because firing him seems like it’s going to set the program back as far if not further than any “sanctions” imposed by the NCAA.
Thoughts?
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:29 pm to Brobocop
I agree with you. We will fall back about 5 years now and Wade was building us up.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:35 pm to Brobocop
With a show cause (which is a foregone conclusion if you read the NOA), he would've been banned from coaching for anywhere from 1 to 5 years.
You have to understand, two of the charges against him deal specifically with him withholding information during the investigation.
It is alleged that, from the beginning of the NCAA investigation into the above allegations
and continuing to the present, Will Wade (Wade), head men's basketball coach, violated
the NCAA principles of ethical conduct and failed to cooperate in the investigation of
Allegation Nos. 4 through 8, as well as a number of other allegations the CCU was
ultimately unable to substantiate fully, when he refused to produce all records the CCU
requested from him. Specifically:
? Between December 2018 and February 2020, the NCAA made repeated requests for a
full and complete image of Wade’s digital devices. During these thirteen months, Wade
did not produce these records requested by the NCAA. Wade ultimately produced to the
NCAA only 60,000 of the estimated 130,000 records Wade’s counsel claimed had been
imaged.
? The NCAA referred this case to the CCU in the fall of 2020. The referral letter describes
in detail Wade’s failure to cooperate in providing the records requested. Wade’s lack of
cooperation in producing requested documents continued during the IARP proceeding, as
the CCU attempted to obtain the approximately 70,000 digital device records Wade
withheld from the NCAA. Specifically, over the course of several months, including on
December 30, 2020, and February 19, March 19, March 25, April 23, and July 29, 2021,
the CCU renewed the request for these records. Each time, Wade refused to produce the
documents. Only after being ordered by the IRP on August 20, 2021 to produce the records
did Wade finally produced a portion of the requested digital device records – nearly three
years after the NCAA initially requested them. Wade’s delay in producing the records was
unjustified and obstructed the CCU’s ability to investigate several allegations that had
surfaced publicly in the media.
? On December 30, 2020 (and additionally on September 9 and November 1, 2021), the
CCU made a request for bank records from Wade which were needed to verify or refute
allegations of payments made by Wade to family members and associates of potential
student athletes. Despite the obvious relevance to the CCU’s investigation, Wade failed to
produce financial records for the “joint account,” which is a bank account held in the name
of his spouse and mother to which a large percentage of his income was transferred. Despite
many communications between Wade and his spouse establishing Wade’s control over the
joint account, Wade repeatedly made the claim that his spouse “handled the finances” and generally claimed ignorance of or stated he did not recall the details of his financial affairs.
However, the existence of text messages between Wade and his spouse contradicts and
belie Wade’s statements. Furthermore, in lieu of providing records for the joint account,
the CCU requested information on the ultimate disposition of funds transferred from
Wade’s account to the “joint account,” which Wade also failed to produce (or produced
only in part).
This is like running from the cops after being pulled over. Regardless of how serious the original charge was, this is an absolute idiotic move on his part that sealed his fate.
You have to understand, two of the charges against him deal specifically with him withholding information during the investigation.
It is alleged that, from the beginning of the NCAA investigation into the above allegations
and continuing to the present, Will Wade (Wade), head men's basketball coach, violated
the NCAA principles of ethical conduct and failed to cooperate in the investigation of
Allegation Nos. 4 through 8, as well as a number of other allegations the CCU was
ultimately unable to substantiate fully, when he refused to produce all records the CCU
requested from him. Specifically:
? Between December 2018 and February 2020, the NCAA made repeated requests for a
full and complete image of Wade’s digital devices. During these thirteen months, Wade
did not produce these records requested by the NCAA. Wade ultimately produced to the
NCAA only 60,000 of the estimated 130,000 records Wade’s counsel claimed had been
imaged.
? The NCAA referred this case to the CCU in the fall of 2020. The referral letter describes
in detail Wade’s failure to cooperate in providing the records requested. Wade’s lack of
cooperation in producing requested documents continued during the IARP proceeding, as
the CCU attempted to obtain the approximately 70,000 digital device records Wade
withheld from the NCAA. Specifically, over the course of several months, including on
December 30, 2020, and February 19, March 19, March 25, April 23, and July 29, 2021,
the CCU renewed the request for these records. Each time, Wade refused to produce the
documents. Only after being ordered by the IRP on August 20, 2021 to produce the records
did Wade finally produced a portion of the requested digital device records – nearly three
years after the NCAA initially requested them. Wade’s delay in producing the records was
unjustified and obstructed the CCU’s ability to investigate several allegations that had
surfaced publicly in the media.
? On December 30, 2020 (and additionally on September 9 and November 1, 2021), the
CCU made a request for bank records from Wade which were needed to verify or refute
allegations of payments made by Wade to family members and associates of potential
student athletes. Despite the obvious relevance to the CCU’s investigation, Wade failed to
produce financial records for the “joint account,” which is a bank account held in the name
of his spouse and mother to which a large percentage of his income was transferred. Despite
many communications between Wade and his spouse establishing Wade’s control over the
joint account, Wade repeatedly made the claim that his spouse “handled the finances” and generally claimed ignorance of or stated he did not recall the details of his financial affairs.
However, the existence of text messages between Wade and his spouse contradicts and
belie Wade’s statements. Furthermore, in lieu of providing records for the joint account,
the CCU requested information on the ultimate disposition of funds transferred from
Wade’s account to the “joint account,” which Wade also failed to produce (or produced
only in part).
This is like running from the cops after being pulled over. Regardless of how serious the original charge was, this is an absolute idiotic move on his part that sealed his fate.
This post was edited on 3/14/22 at 2:37 pm
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:40 pm to Brobocop
They could have hit LSU with sanctions so heavy that the basketball program would have been left with no coaching staff and no scholarship players.
Wait...that is likely going to be the end result WITHOUT formal sanctions?!!!
I'm not saying Wade's firing was unjustified. Just that in this age of player mobility it is likely going to result in a mass, if not complete, exodus of every player on the current roster with eligibility remaining.
Wait...that is likely going to be the end result WITHOUT formal sanctions?!!!
I'm not saying Wade's firing was unjustified. Just that in this age of player mobility it is likely going to result in a mass, if not complete, exodus of every player on the current roster with eligibility remaining.
This post was edited on 3/14/22 at 2:45 pm
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:42 pm to Brobocop
The NCAA would have made sure Wade never coached here again.
I do agree though, prior to putting much thought into it, keeping Wade and just dealing with the penalties seems like the best case.
I do agree though, prior to putting much thought into it, keeping Wade and just dealing with the penalties seems like the best case.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:44 pm to Brobocop
We will find out. Because we did keep Will Wade -after this originally surfaced a few years back. And he kept cheating. So I guess we will find out after additional violations and potentially pulling football into it.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:45 pm to Basura Blanco
quote:
Wade ultimately produced to the
NCAA only 60,000 of the estimated 130,000 records Wade’s counsel claimed had been
imaged.
He shoulda wiped it, with a cloth.
Fight like you work for the FBI.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:48 pm to Basura Blanco
Question, what information did Bill Self, Roy Williams, Coach K, John Calipari, John Thompson, withhold from the NCAA over the last 20 plus years.
This post was edited on 3/14/22 at 2:49 pm
Posted on 3/14/22 at 2:48 pm to Basura Blanco
He knew he would be fired with the NOA came out.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:00 pm to Basura Blanco
The show cause doesn't prevent a school from hiring OR retaining a coach that has one. It entails having to go before an NCAA panel twice a year to show how the school and coach are doing everything possible to remain compliant. And any sanctions resulting from further cheating are dealt with more severely.
This of course, is assuming that the NCAA has any teeth left in them, and I bet they don't. Especially with a football blue blood that I would imagine wouldn't have to do a whole lot to cajole the top 30ish programs from breaking away from the NCAA and forming their own league.
That is how I would have approached this if I was Woodward. I would have hounded them relentlessly about how they ignore the Dukes and UNCs of the world and hammer us. Then I would threaten them with the super league in football that would be the end of the NCAA.
Woodward didn't do this for one of two reasons: His relationship with Emmert caused him to back off of the NCAA, or he truly is the pussy liberal that some on here claim he is.
This of course, is assuming that the NCAA has any teeth left in them, and I bet they don't. Especially with a football blue blood that I would imagine wouldn't have to do a whole lot to cajole the top 30ish programs from breaking away from the NCAA and forming their own league.
That is how I would have approached this if I was Woodward. I would have hounded them relentlessly about how they ignore the Dukes and UNCs of the world and hammer us. Then I would threaten them with the super league in football that would be the end of the NCAA.
Woodward didn't do this for one of two reasons: His relationship with Emmert caused him to back off of the NCAA, or he truly is the pussy liberal that some on here claim he is.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:00 pm to Brobocop
quote:5 year no postseason and minus 5 scholarships each year. We would be like a good prep school in the SEC lucky to win games against local directional school.
What is the worst that the NCAA could have done to us
And Wade would get a 10 year show cause so he couldn't be the coach anyway.
So yeah, a lot worse.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:05 pm to tigahlovah
quote:Some of you guys give the worst advice. You would be fired within the day.
That is how I would have approached this if I was Woodward. I would have hounded them relentlessly about how they ignore the Dukes and UNCs of the world and hammer us. Then I would threaten them with the super league in football that would be the end of the NCAA.
ETA: You aren't going in front of the NCAA without running your "plan" by Tate. And after your little rant you aren't getting out of the room.
And if you did this without permission, it would take a single phone call from the NCAA to Tate and you would be fired with cause.
This post was edited on 3/14/22 at 3:08 pm
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:06 pm to texastigerr
quote:
Question, what information did Bill Self, Roy Williams, Coach K, John Calipari, John Thompson, withhold from the NCAA over the last 20 plus years.
Withholding information in itself has nothing to do with this current situation. I am sure there is a shite ton of information that Wade and every other NCAA coach has with held as well.
Having been caught on an FBI wiretap alluding to improper payments, which results in having the NCAA request your phone and bank records, and then making copies of the requested records with your attorney present, and then refusing to turn over half of those copied records until a secondary investigative division of the NCAA gets involved is what the issue is. And that's just 1 charge of 6.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:08 pm to tigahlovah
quote:
Especially with a football blue blood that I would imagine wouldn't have to do a whole lot to cajole the top 30ish programs from breaking away from the NCAA and forming their own league.
This might be the most myopic post I have ever read on here.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:16 pm to CP3forMVP
Right, somebody that really knows, what would’ve happened worse than what’s to come, if he kept coaching us thru the tournament. When they throw the book it will have a few pages missing or did SW try to save the football program some face.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:18 pm to Brobocop
Wade will not be eligible to coach college basketball for at least 3 years.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:19 pm to kciDAtaE
quote:
Because we did keep Will Wade -after this originally surfaced a few years back. And he kept cheating
There is zero evidence (in the NCAA's hands) that he continued to pay players after the first time.
Everyone obviously knows that he was, along with every other staff in America, but the NCAA has proved none of that and have concluded their investigation. All of their allegations come from that 2017-2019 timeframe.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:24 pm to mmcgrath
5 year no postseason and minus 5 scholarships each year.
--------------------------------------------------------
So, EIGHT rostered scholarship basketball players on the team.
Can NIL be used to cover sufficient dollars for a player to WALK ON?
Apparently, the NCAA allows a roster up to 16 including three walk ons.
--------------------------------------------------------
So, EIGHT rostered scholarship basketball players on the team.
Can NIL be used to cover sufficient dollars for a player to WALK ON?
Apparently, the NCAA allows a roster up to 16 including three walk ons.
Posted on 3/14/22 at 3:25 pm to PP7 for heisman
quote:
There is zero evidence (in the NCAA's hands) that he continued to pay players after the first time.
Everyone obviously knows that he was, along with every other staff in America, but the NCAA has proved none of that and have concluded their investigation. All of their allegations come from that 2017-2019 timeframe.
I believe this is correct. What the NCAA does have though are two Level 1 violations by Wade charging that he hindered the investigation by not turning over documents. I have no idea how this compares in seriousness to the actual paying of players, but I would imagine pissing off your judge, jury, and executioner is not a good gameplan.
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