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re: Dorsey and Bowe struggling in KC
Posted on 8/13/09 at 8:59 am to simmons2112
Posted on 8/13/09 at 8:59 am to simmons2112
quote:
Ellis was no more of a factor than Dorsey last year.
he had 4 times the sacks (per espn) and 5 times the passes defensed
for 2 DTs who are small and pass rushers, that is a big difference
quote:
It seems you can't admit that and love banging on Dorsey.
if you want to see banging, read whitlock's comments on dorsey last year
he was not good last year. i thought he'd be a lot better and thought the chiefs did awesome getting him
now dorsey is a man without a position on the D and likely will be traded within the next 18 months for his own sake
2
Posted on 8/13/09 at 9:02 am to SlowFlowPro
at anyone who think Dorsey played good last year, and could they really trade him in the immediate future? I'm sure he got alot of guaranteed money coming his way. That would be one hell of a cap hit.Posted on 8/13/09 at 9:03 am to josh336
quote:
Dorsey signed a five-year, $51 million deal Saturday morning that includes an option year and more than $22 million in guaranteed money.
thats a lot for KC to eat..
Posted on 8/13/09 at 9:04 am to simmons2112
quote:
First of all this is a ridiculous statement. Tackles for a DT when the RB is running right past you on virtually every running play is pretty damned important. If the DT made the tackle then the RB was generally stopped at the line of scrimmage.
Ellis was no more of a factor than Dorsey last year. It seems you can't admit that and love banging on Dorsey. Good for you. But the honest opinion is Dorsey was just as effective as Ellis but Dorsey played on the last ranked D in the league.
Ellis was more effective than Dorsey last season. Dorsey was suppose to be this guy who came in and demanded double teams letting the rest of the Dline have it easier...didn't happen. He is rarely double teamed.
He really didn't tackle much better than Ellis either, but Ellis did manage to get to the QB and knock some passes down. Ellis had a pretty good rookie year
Dorsey needs to get healthy, and now he needs to be traded. Unfortunately, things aren't looking too great for him
Posted on 8/13/09 at 9:06 am to josh336
KC is paying the bulk of his guaranteed money this year i believe so any team getting him would be getting a good deal
generally now you get a decent signing bonus and a HUGE roster bonus in year 2 and that forms the bulk of your "guaranteed" money
signing bonuses are spread along your cap for the life of the deal, but cutting/trading the guy accelerates the hit to the year you cut/trade him. the money has already been paid though. roster bonuses are like salary, but once they're paid, they hit the cap of the paying team and the team acquiring the guy is off the hook (both financially and int erms of cap hit)
if dorsey has a big roster bonus NEXT year, it could kill any potential trade
generally now you get a decent signing bonus and a HUGE roster bonus in year 2 and that forms the bulk of your "guaranteed" money
signing bonuses are spread along your cap for the life of the deal, but cutting/trading the guy accelerates the hit to the year you cut/trade him. the money has already been paid though. roster bonuses are like salary, but once they're paid, they hit the cap of the paying team and the team acquiring the guy is off the hook (both financially and int erms of cap hit)
if dorsey has a big roster bonus NEXT year, it could kill any potential trade
Posted on 8/13/09 at 9:13 am to simmons2112
Yeah SFP, I don't think you can say tackles are irrelevant for a DT.
Dorsey is a DT on a bad team with only Tyler and Johnson being the only other talented players on that D. He's waaaay out of place in the 3-4 and will look really bad this year.
As for Bowe, he's one of the top WRs in the game right now, and that's with really crappy QBs. He'll be fine, although he will likely get extra attention now that Tony Gonzales is gone.
Dorsey is a DT on a bad team with only Tyler and Johnson being the only other talented players on that D. He's waaaay out of place in the 3-4 and will look really bad this year.
As for Bowe, he's one of the top WRs in the game right now, and that's with really crappy QBs. He'll be fine, although he will likely get extra attention now that Tony Gonzales is gone.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 9:30 am to Suntiger
Plus, people forget that Lane only taught our DLinemen ONE move:
BULL RUSH and that's it. They all have shite for technique. Thank God we have a new DL coach now.
BULL RUSH and that's it. They all have shite for technique. Thank God we have a new DL coach now.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 10:10 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
in the 12-13 KC games last year i watched
I would never readily admit this. Former Tigers or not.
This post was edited on 8/13/09 at 10:11 am
Posted on 8/13/09 at 10:21 am to Moustache
quote:
people forget that Lane only taught our DLinemen ONE move:
this is very true and very sad
Posted on 8/13/09 at 10:21 am to iknowmorethanyou
quote:
I would never readily admit this. Former Tigers or not.
my friend is a huge KC fan and we go watch games at BWW together. it has nothing to do with LSU
we've been doing this for years
Posted on 8/13/09 at 10:23 am to SlowFlowPro
Even more shameful.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 12:05 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
in the 12-13 KC games last year i watched i never saw dorsey get double teamed
double teams against sub 340-lb DTs are very rare in the NFL
Well you're a fricking expert on everything anyway. I went to several and yes, he got double teamed. So eat a dick.
quote:
2nd easiest behind RB
No. You're wrong again. You're a complete dumb arse, SFP. Just shut the frick up.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 12:08 pm to brad8504
quote:
he got double teamed
if he did, it was rare
double teams for ANY DL are rare unless you're a 2-gap monster (like haynesworth or sean ellis) or you're a speed DE
why would any team waste a blocker on dorsey when by week 4 he had shown he wasn't going to penetrate against a single blocker?
quote:
No. You're wrong again.
you can be a retard and play DT in the NFL. DT is all about physical tools and technique.
the gap guys have when going from college to the NFL is mental. DT requires almost no mental ability
Posted on 8/13/09 at 1:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
If you're such an expert, why aren't you scouting for an NFL team? You seem to know all there is.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 1:17 pm to bmy
New coaches
Posted on 8/13/09 at 1:56 pm to PAtiger21
The KC Star reported this morning that the coach was impressed with Bowe's improvement in the last few days. Dorsey has been hurt, is out of shape somewhat - he may no longer be a fit with the new D. Tyson Jackson has signed and is in camp the past week - it will be interesting to see Dorsey and Jackson work together once again. I think KC will be better, but not great this year. KC.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 2:46 pm to brad8504
quote:
As for being "too big" to play DE, that's a dumb arse statement. You want a big DE in a 3-4 scheme. If he's going to play a 5-tech and and plug the "B" gap between guard and tackle, you want a guy with his size. Height doesn't have shite to do with it.
Doesn't go a bit further than that? I refer to Warren Sapp in the following article:
Guide to NFL Defenses
(NOTE: Dorsey is not Sapp..yet. Just used for comparison)
Just because the player has the physical make-up of a prototype DT, NT, DE, 3-4 weakside DE, or whatever, it goes deeper than just physical. It takes the right set of mental skills and I am not just referring to brain power.
Besides all the physical attributes to make a perfect left tackle, the player has to be smart and possess a certain passive aggressive nature. Many times, this nature is not learned, it just "is."
A standard 3-4 DE is there to protect the LBs and jam up the line more than anything else. Regardless how much you pay someone, to change that person nature is not just a matter of flicking on a light switch.
Rookie DTs in the NFL need time to adjust. They have to get bigger and quicker and that can take more than just one year. The mental pace of the game is different and the competition is certain an entirely different level. Each week, you are playing the best of the best from college. Tricks of the trade and experience takes time to learn, especially in the trenches of the NFL.
Then there are the different sub-types of the 4-3, 3-4, and zone blitz schemes. A Miami 4-3 (over) players are different (on paper) than a 4-3 under-Tampa 2.
Bottom line: It has more to it than just being "big."
Posted on 8/13/09 at 2:53 pm to SlowFlowPro
I'd take Dorsey for a 2nd round pick or straight up for Meachum.
Posted on 8/13/09 at 3:54 pm to SNAPPERHEAD
there was a lot of smoke that he was on the block for a mid-1st last draft
Posted on 8/13/09 at 4:27 pm to Alltheway Tigers!
quote:
Alltheway Tigers!
Excellent post. Finally someone has some rational thought behind a post, other than some bullshite opinion that SFP provides us.
3-4 D-Linemen protect the LBs more than anything. Usually it's your LBs that lead the team in tackles when running that scheme, especially at the professional level.
This post was edited on 8/13/09 at 4:30 pm
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