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Started By
Message
re: TOPS Needs To Go
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:13 pm to Buck Wylde
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:13 pm to Buck Wylde
quote:
TOPS, by name would suggest a reward of sorts for the best and brightest. It isn't anymore. It's a huge handout as payment for making mediocre grades.
The min standard for TOPS is so low, that if you can't meet it, you shouldn't be going to a 4 year college right out of HS.
Thus, in LA, we basically have a de facto Bernie Sanders free college education program. It's not exact as you still have to pay for some fees and books, but it's damn close.
0
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:22 pm to MC5601
TOPS would be fine if it drastically upped its standards. Keep the brightest here, regardless of income level. Make the mediocre pay.
Minimum ACT should be 27 and no gpa lower than 3.5
Minimum ACT should be 27 and no gpa lower than 3.5
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:24 pm to CarRamrod
Not average as a school that tells the story
It is the percent of graduating class
Good school top ten percent student needs wayyyy more than that probably need 4.3 gpa or better to be in top ten percent
Not so great city school or country top ten may be 3.4
Yes the guy with 3.4 goes and the guy with 4.3. But the guy with 4.1 at the real good school gets to go to a feeder university
look at mode versus mean for the Stats
Texas has screwed up our system with top 7.5 percent rule. Louisiana has caused problems there with tops
Both were excellent ideas but unfortunately politicians got involved and screwed up both efforts
It is the percent of graduating class
Good school top ten percent student needs wayyyy more than that probably need 4.3 gpa or better to be in top ten percent
Not so great city school or country top ten may be 3.4
Yes the guy with 3.4 goes and the guy with 4.3. But the guy with 4.1 at the real good school gets to go to a feeder university
look at mode versus mean for the Stats
Texas has screwed up our system with top 7.5 percent rule. Louisiana has caused problems there with tops
Both were excellent ideas but unfortunately politicians got involved and screwed up both efforts
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:27 pm to Mingo Was His NameO
quote:
20 on the ACT and a 2.5 high school GPA?
Is that the current standard? I remember having to get at least a 27 for TOPS 11 years ago.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:32 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
The requirements are laughably low. Lump the Opportunity Award (20 ACT) in with the Tech Award (17 ACT), that applies to 2 year schools. Lowest level for a 4 year university should be the "Performance Award", which is 23 ACT minimum.
Is this true or are you speculating?
Do people with a 23 and below really receive state funds to post high school schooling? Tops is supposed to be for best and brightest. This is jotnit at all
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:47 pm to BigB0882
quote:
TOPS needs to be a loan that stays a loan unless the student graduates with a degree within 4 years while maintaining a minimum set GPA. If you need a semester or more off there needs to be a process to get a waiver. Take more time than allowed, drop out or fail out then you must pay back the loan. The ones who play by the rules have the loan forgiven upon graduation
TOPS is already limited to 8 semesters with minimum GPA and semester hour requirements. Taking more time than allowed is irrelevant bc tops only covers 8 semesters. Student loans are already a beast of a burden and I don’t think looking to more loans is an appropriate answer esp if its based on graduation. Requiring graduation isn’t a great solution because there are other colleges (DVM, NP, PA, etc) that will accept applicants without degrees as long as they have pre-reqs.
Raising TOPS standards is appropriate. But its a really beneficial program for public higher ed in LA, getting rid of it would put LA further behind. Maybe a community service requirement added.
The real problem is lack of opportunity for those with higher ed to make a decent living in LA. I got full TOPS graduated in 4 years with STEM degree and ended up leaving LA for other opportunities I couldn’t take advantage of in LA.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:51 pm to AMS
quote:
Raising TOPS standards is appropriate. But its a really beneficial program for public higher ed in LA, getting rid of it would put LA further behind. Maybe a community service requirement added.
No it wouldn’t. What it would do is ensure only college appropriate kids actually go to college
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:53 pm to The Dudes Rug
Not sure about act, but gpa was 2.5 in 1998 if i recall when it first began. Its never been a high standard.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:53 pm to The Dudes Rug
quote:
20 on the ACT and a 2.5 high school GPA? Is that the current standard? I remember having to get at least a 27 for TOPS 11 years ago.
I may be mistaken but 20 ACT, 2.5 GPA is the lowest tier of TOPS, this is not a full tuition scholarship, it might be like 33%-50%.
When I got the top tier TOPS it was something like a 28 ACT and 3.0 for full tuition. I believe it is still similarly tiered at the top, but the lower tiers were expanded.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:55 pm to Oilfieldbiology
quote:
No it wouldn’t. What it would do is ensure only college appropriate kids actually go to college
... your argument is that reducing the number of TOPS recipients would not reduce TOPS spending?
Posted on 7/30/19 at 2:59 pm to tigahbruh
There is a growing mindset that wants to convert TOPS to a means test.
Only those with income below a certain level would receive it
Only those with income below a certain level would receive it
Posted on 7/30/19 at 4:12 pm to AMS
No I’m arguing that raising the standards does not make LA further behind in terms of higher education.
Making sure smarter kids go to in state schools makes the schools better. Average students shouldn’t be getting TOPS. Above average to exceptional students should be
Making sure smarter kids go to in state schools makes the schools better. Average students shouldn’t be getting TOPS. Above average to exceptional students should be
Posted on 7/30/19 at 4:54 pm to Oilfieldbiology
Lol why did you disagree with what I said then? I think you must’ve misread what I said originally. Which was getting rid of TOPS altogether would put LA behind. Raising standards would decrease the cost burden.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 5:24 pm to AMS
My daughter had a 4.0 and 29 ACT. She received highest level of TOPS and Academic scholarship. I am paying her fee bill tomorrow and it’s 7300 for one semester.
So 15k a year is not a free ride. Most of that is freshmen mandated campus housing and meal card plus fees.
Should the requirements be increased? Yes. Is it a middle class handout? Yes. But let me ask you this, would taxes be immediately reduced when TOPS is eliminated?
So 15k a year is not a free ride. Most of that is freshmen mandated campus housing and meal card plus fees.
Should the requirements be increased? Yes. Is it a middle class handout? Yes. But let me ask you this, would taxes be immediately reduced when TOPS is eliminated?
Posted on 7/30/19 at 5:28 pm to geauxtigersgirl
quote:
It should be income neutral and dependent on grades and test scores.
It is
Posted on 7/30/19 at 5:32 pm to The Dudes Rug
quote:
I remember having to get at least a 27 for TOPS 11 years ago.
No u didn’t
20 was the highest it has been to get the opportunity award.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 5:35 pm to rotrain
quote:
Not sure about act,
It was 19 when it first began
Posted on 7/30/19 at 5:41 pm to Cold Drink
quote:
if you stay in Louisiana and don’t drive your UHaul to Texas immediately upon graduation.
I already had a job, so I wrote a letter, and skipped graduation, My diploma was delivered to my Dallas apartment by UPS.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 6:38 pm to AMS
quote:
Lol why did you disagree with what I said then? I think you must’ve misread what I said originally. Which was getting rid of TOPS altogether would put LA behind. Raising standards would decrease the cost burden.
Absolutely misread your statement then. I thought you were saying that cutting the amount of kids receiving tops would hurt LA universities. I was arguing that giving Loren money to higher achievers and cutting out not college worthy kids would help them.
Posted on 7/30/19 at 6:40 pm to chinese58
quote:
My diploma was delivered to my Dallas apartment by UPS
Thought they used the pony express back then
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