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2
Posted on 9/30/16 at 5:33 am to SportTiger1
quote:
O needs to go be the HC of a mid-major for a few years and prove himself, if he wants to run a big time program again.
And he wasn't even given that opportunity in his year off. After USC, he sat around for an entire year before we hired him as our defensive line coach.
Why wasn't he offered a head coaching position during that time? Why didn't USC offer him the head coaching role?
Posted on 9/30/16 at 5:39 am to boweswi05
quote:
USC saw something in him that was HC material they would have kept him
I bet they wish they could get that one back. What they had was better than what they got.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 6:00 am to frankenfish
I'm with frankenfish. If Fisher and Herman off the table and coach O shows us good results which I expect he will then go with the Louisiana Man who bleeds purple and gold.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 6:40 am to bencoleman
quote:
I bet they wish they could get that one back. What they had was better than what they got.
Winning a few games in one season is a whole lot different that running a program year in and year out. He has done nothing to deserve this job in his past and nothing he will do this year in these few games will change that. He is a great choice to finish this thing out this season but would be a horrible choice for the full time job, if he wasn't a coonass from Louisiana NONE of you would want him and that's a pretty dumb reason to give someone a job
Posted on 9/30/16 at 6:40 am to TrueTigerTale
With the right defense co., could Kliff Kingsbury be LSU's best hire?
Posted on 9/30/16 at 9:16 am to Tom Bronco
quote:
The thing that Ogeron said that impressed me the most is when he said that at Ole Miss he did the same thing but when he was interim head coach at USC he learned to delegate.
A head coach that let's his coaches do their job is basically an inspirational leader, who can help recruiting, and bring the hammer down when needed.
You want a head coach who doesn't organize and strategize with his coaches? You want a figurehead with little to add to the game plan?
What?
The best leaders know when and where to add their expertise, how to coach their coaches into being better (the entire idea of a coaching tree), how to adjust when they believe something is wrong, how to coach players and get the best out of them. Not just motivate people. Being a great head coach is way more complicated than being an inspirational leader who helps in recruiting, and discipline. That's absolutely insane if you fire Miles to replace that.
Just because Miles was too much of a tinkerer doesn't mean we need to go the complete opposite direction and get someone who doesn't want to have a say.
I want a Head Coach who 1) Hires the best people 2) Understands how to get the best out of them and help them succeed 3) Understands how to construct game plans 4) How to adjust and mitigate inputs from various coaches 5) How to take all of that information and build strategy for a team and around opponents side by side with his coaches 6) How to challenge his coaches to be better 7) How to understand his players capabilities and get the best out of them 8) How to recruit....etc.
There's a reason the truly "great" coaches have a "coaching tree" attached to them. Making the people around you better, and NOT just by lame motivation, is the #1 quality. Understanding and critically thinking about your resources and how to deploy them is paramount to everything else. This is why great coaches are great. They know when to challenge, when to adjust, when to critique, when to give freedom.
They don't just "inspire."
Are we going to need a #NeverO group so that people don't think everyone loves CEO regardless of record? He's, at best, 12-15 on the coaching target priority list, and with a 7-1 finish, maybe #7.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 9:21 am to bencoleman
quote:You know who else went 6-2 as an interim coach at USC? Clay Helton, USC's current coach who has them at 1-3 right now.
He went 6 & 2 with USC after kiffen left. He's learned from his mistakes.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 11:09 am to Just_Fight_Baby
I get all of that, but Coach O is unproven, at best. Even after the next 8 games he will still be unproven compared to others we will pursue for the HC job.
It's not a knock against coach O, but a shout out to the strength of the LSU football program. Coach O is not proven. After 8 games he won't be proven either. We need someone who is or has much bigger upside,imo.
I truly hope he does great and lands a HC job somewhere else. Just not at LSU atm. I could be totally wrong on this, but i think coach O is too risky.
It's not a knock against coach O, but a shout out to the strength of the LSU football program. Coach O is not proven. After 8 games he won't be proven either. We need someone who is or has much bigger upside,imo.
I truly hope he does great and lands a HC job somewhere else. Just not at LSU atm. I could be totally wrong on this, but i think coach O is too risky.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 2:40 pm to SportTiger1
quote:
My issue is, I don't think these next 8 games will tell us much about orgeron. They should win 6 games and I wouldn't be surprised if they win more. His history shows me way more than winning with someone else's all star team. .
This is a very confusing statement. It seems to be saying that it doesn't matter who the head coach is that we would win 6 games regardless. Really? So why would it matter who was head coach next year, or for the next five years? Did you think we would beat Wisconsin and Auburn before the season started? How do you know how many games we "should" win going forward?
Then you really head onto shaky ground and imply that all of our players were recruited by Les and that the assistant coaches had nothing to do with it. If there is one thing that everyone, except you, agree on is that Oregon is a great recruiter who we want to retain under a new head coach for just that ability.
So to say that he would win with "Les's players" but couldn't recruit his own is just bs of the highest degree. I am accused of wanting a "figurehead coach" but you guys want football genius's. How many of these head coaches succeed because they hire great assistant coaches and then let them do their thing without interference? Les did hire great assistant's but then he would try to control them to carry out his philosophy which was wrong headed.
What makes Tom Herman so great? Is he calling the plays in Houston? Did he personally recruit all the good players he has? Would those players have not gone to Houston if Herman was not the head coach? Do any of us have those answers? No we don't. Has any "first tier" coach with a great resume gone to another school and failed? Does Spurrier at South Carolina ring any bells?
This post was edited on 9/30/16 at 2:43 pm
Posted on 9/30/16 at 4:08 pm to Tom Bronco
quote:
What makes Tom Herman so great?
There's a few threads already dedicated to that topic alone.
For one he took a WR and made him in to a top qb. He also took a 3rd string QB and helped win a NC with him as OC of tOSU. He also beat Jimbo and FSU in the peach bowl. He also beat Stoops and OU this year. He also is able to recruit most of his guys from within a 25 mile radius of Houston.
I mean the list goes on and on. I would love it if CEO stayed when he hired a new HC, but assuming they do well going forward another team needing a HC will likely snag him. That's great for him too.
Your last paragraph seemed like you were very frustrated, but I'm not sure at what or who. Maybe i missed it but i dont think anyone wants to just kick CEO to the curb at the end of the year. Just saying him being HC is slim, and if he isn't then he will likely move on.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 4:13 pm to TrueTigerTale
quote:
With the right off.-coordinator, could Orgeron be LSU's best hire.
Could he? I guess anything's possible but I'd rather not take that chance.
With the right offensive coordinator, would Herman be a better hire than Orgeron? If the answer is yes, why are we even having this discussion...
Posted on 9/30/16 at 4:30 pm to Tom Bronco
quote:
This is a very confusing statement. It seems to be saying that it doesn't matter who the head coach is that we would win 6 games regardless. Really? So why would it matter who was head coach next year, or for the next five years? Did you think we would beat Wisconsin and Auburn before the season started? How do you know how many games we "should" win going forward?
This team is more talented than 7 out of the next 8 teams we play. Fact. Les' gameplans sucks, thats why they lost, so one would assume a little improvement in that area would go a long way. No?
quote:
Then you really head onto shaky ground and imply that all of our players were recruited by Les and that the assistant coaches had nothing to do with it. If there is one thing that everyone, except you, agree on is that Oregon is a great recruiter who we want to retain under a new head coach for just that ability.
O is a great recruiter, but there is more to it than that.
quote:
How many of these head coaches succeed because they hire great assistant coaches and then let them do their thing without interference? Les did hire great assistant's but then he would try to control them to carry out his philosophy which was wrong headed
The best HC's in the game today are specialist in one area. Saban, Meyer, Fisher, Chip Kelly, Harbaugh, Petrino. The only highly successful figurehead i can think of is Stoops, and thats kind of a reach. Fact.
quote:
What makes Tom Herman so great? Is he calling the plays in Houston? Did he personally recruit all the good players he has? Would those players have not gone to Houston if Herman was not the head coach? Do any of us have those answers? No we don't. Has any "first tier" coach with a great resume gone to another school and failed? Does Spurrier at South Carolina ring any bells?
Herman built the offense at Ohio St and Houston, not sure if he calls all plays or not. Spurrier was FAR from a failure at SCar. He has several 10 win seasons. Fact.
You are working purely off emotion and not from facts and evidence.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 4:38 pm to SportTiger1
quote:
You are working purely off emotion and not from facts and evidence.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 5:01 pm to The Godfather
quote:
He has done nothing to deserve this job in his past and nothing he will do this year in these few games will change that.
Wrong! Orgeron has been successful as an interim head coach., he's also recruited and is developing great defensive tackles at LSU, before Orgeron, great defensive tackles were as scarce as great QB's and time management skills at LSU games. He's also chosen to be a interim head coach again, to prevent our programs decline and bring noticeable changes to LSU's football team and manner of coaching.
To say Orgeron's done nothing is the height of ignorance and stupidity, but it's what I've learn to expect from some LSU fans.
This post was edited on 9/30/16 at 5:05 pm
Posted on 9/30/16 at 5:58 pm to SportTiger1
quote:quite possibly the stupidest statement on here. Les Miles was a hack that got by and fooled a lot of people, including the state of Louisiana. He won a national championship with players he inherited. His best team quite possibly was 2006. Should have won the national championship that year if it were for his 7-3 stinker against auburn. I would love to have coach o if Herman wasn't available. I think he's the best option out there if he can keep this season alive and get them through this
You don't fire les miles and pay him $13m buyout, then promote your dline coach.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 7:02 pm to Patch
quote:
I would love to have coach o if Herman wasn't available. I think he's the best option out there if he can keep this season alive and get them through this
Coach Orgeron only asked for a fair shake in LSU's coaching hire, that is not too much to ask. LSU fans could be disapointed in coach O or pleasantly surprised this season. I do know destroying Alabama in Tiger stadium would certainly erase many doubters.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 8:11 pm to boweswi05
quote:
You mean the same way he did at Ole Miss?
No like he did at USC.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 8:14 pm to Corch Urban Myers
If you can't see the difference with taking over a team midseason on an interim basis and taking it over completely, I don't know what to tell you.
Posted on 9/30/16 at 8:20 pm to bencoleman
quote:
I bet they wish they could get that one back. What they had was better than what they got.
Winning 6 games or however many he wins at LSU rest of year doesn't justify giving him the HC job when we know he sucks at being a HC.
Might as well bring back Dinardo or Curly Hallman. I'm sure they have learned from their mistakes too.
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