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What does NVDA do differently than other processor manufacturers?
Posted on 5/30/23 at 7:53 am
Posted on 5/30/23 at 7:53 am
Intel and AMD have dominated the processor space but NVDA became the choice for graphics, then crypto mining and now AI. What are they doing differently and how much of a moat do they actually have?
I know nothing about processors or processing. Just curious how they’ve taken such a strong lead in these emerging areas given the competition.
TIA.
I know nothing about processors or processing. Just curious how they’ve taken such a strong lead in these emerging areas given the competition.
TIA.
This post was edited on 5/30/23 at 7:54 am
10
Posted on 5/30/23 at 8:02 am to SquatchDawg
They have the best performance as a brand. Their high end is unmatched, and they have consistently pushed the limits and led the way in performance. AMD and Intel are better price to performance. But growth categories like crypto and AI and high end graphics like gaming all push for sheer power, not price value. The semiconductor industry is one of the few that haven’t shifted towards cost cutting yet. Nvidia is still the “growth” winner.
That said, I know nothing about how much research and technology truly separates them from Intel and AMD, but the history shows they’re staying ahead consistently as long as that industry doesn’t shift to value
That said, I know nothing about how much research and technology truly separates them from Intel and AMD, but the history shows they’re staying ahead consistently as long as that industry doesn’t shift to value
Posted on 5/30/23 at 9:23 am to SquatchDawg
NVDA like AMD has no foundry business they are not a manufacturer. They only design the chips.
Nvidia "AI" lead is loosely based on their Jetson platform which is basically an ARM processor running linux paired up with a beefy GPU to do the heavy math.
They made it into a small form factor which is fairly power heavy.
The secret is the form factor with a good GPU but the software support they have built up over the years is the real secret to their widespread use. Companies do not have to do much to tap into the various libraries that are available for anyone to use. Whether or not this is a wide moat and won't be copied is yet to be seen. AMD does not seem to want to go down this path leaving only Intel as their competitor int he space.
That being said Intel as a foundry is far behind what NVIDIA gets from TSMC. TSMC is world leader in manufacturing and has really driven the recent success of AMD and NVIDIA.
Nvidia "AI" lead is loosely based on their Jetson platform which is basically an ARM processor running linux paired up with a beefy GPU to do the heavy math.
They made it into a small form factor which is fairly power heavy.
The secret is the form factor with a good GPU but the software support they have built up over the years is the real secret to their widespread use. Companies do not have to do much to tap into the various libraries that are available for anyone to use. Whether or not this is a wide moat and won't be copied is yet to be seen. AMD does not seem to want to go down this path leaving only Intel as their competitor int he space.
That being said Intel as a foundry is far behind what NVIDIA gets from TSMC. TSMC is world leader in manufacturing and has really driven the recent success of AMD and NVIDIA.
Posted on 5/30/23 at 10:34 am to SquatchDawg
They don't. Someone is pumping the stock. AI is being used as the excuse for needing more computing power, but many of the bitcoin and other crypto farms are closing down and dumping all their high powered equipment on the market. That all could be sucked up by AI companies, so yeah, seems very "virtual".
I am still happy for my family and friends that have Nvidia. I hope it keeps going up for them, or they get out at the right time.
I am still happy for my family and friends that have Nvidia. I hope it keeps going up for them, or they get out at the right time.
Posted on 5/30/23 at 11:32 am to UltimaParadox
quote:
NVDA like AMD has no foundry business they are not a manufacturer. They only design the chips. Nvidia "AI" lead is loosely based on their Jetson platform which is basically an ARM processor running linux paired up with a beefy GPU to do the heavy math. They made it into a small form factor which is fairly power heavy. The secret is the form factor with a good GPU but the software support they have built up over the years is the real secret to their widespread use. Companies do not have to do much to tap into the various libraries that are available for anyone to use. Whether or not this is a wide moat and won't be copied is yet to be seen. AMD does not seem to want to go down this path leaving only Intel as their competitor int he space. That being said Intel as a foundry is far behind what NVIDIA gets from TSMC. TSMC is world leader in manufacturing and has really driven the recent success of AMD and NVIDIA.
As a footnote, NVDA also has a massive warchest from the crypto mining glory days, even if they dont want to admit it.
Posted on 5/30/23 at 12:03 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:
What are they doing differently and how much of a moat do they actually have?
They play the narrative game better than the others. It attracts the most capital flows.
Posted on 5/30/23 at 12:39 pm to SquatchDawg
Google gpu benchmarks for language model learning. No one else is even close to H100 performance.
NVDA is tied to TSMC's ability to manufacture the chip for sure, but anyone who says they don't have anything different doesn't know wtf they are talking about. Qualcomm is the only other company that has a chip design that will even show up visibly on a chart if scaled with H100.
I'm not saying the valuation is justified, I'm not recommending you buy the stock, but I'm saying their chip design for machine learning is unparalleled; and that is what is going on.
NVDA is tied to TSMC's ability to manufacture the chip for sure, but anyone who says they don't have anything different doesn't know wtf they are talking about. Qualcomm is the only other company that has a chip design that will even show up visibly on a chart if scaled with H100.
I'm not saying the valuation is justified, I'm not recommending you buy the stock, but I'm saying their chip design for machine learning is unparalleled; and that is what is going on.
This post was edited on 5/30/23 at 12:42 pm
Posted on 5/30/23 at 5:36 pm to Pendulum
Thanks everyone. I’m not buying at these levels but was curious how they leap frogged everyone in this space.
Posted on 5/30/23 at 6:41 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:
how they leap frogged everyone in this space
No doubt they’re ahead and I learned a few things from this thread..
But so far the stock price leapfrog is a dose of hopium that it can grow at an exorbitantly fast pace over the next 5-8 years.
Any misstep and this valuation is a weak foundation to stock owners.
Price to sales on the S&P is around $2.25. NVDA P/S is $39. Not saying it won’t prove it… just facts.
Posted on 5/30/23 at 7:19 pm to SquatchDawg
AMD has similar offerings, so does intel.
It's a pump and dump.
It's a pump and dump.
Posted on 5/31/23 at 8:03 am to SquatchDawg
One interesting tidbit about nvda is that the S&P would be down this year if not for their performance.
Posted on 5/31/23 at 8:54 am to SquatchDawg
A bit of history as I understand it.
NVDA came from a group of employees who split off from SGI (Silicon Graphics) back a few decades ago. SGI was the preeminent graphics machine known for its speed using RISC processors. The RISC processers had a limited instruction set and were designed for speed and rendering computer graphic images.
NVDA cards today have a huge array of very limited instruction set processors that are very fast. My Nvidia graphics card has 2,000 CUDA while my computer's CPU has 12. Nvidia has focused on massively parallel processing since its founding in 1993. It can do things that general processors simply can't.
NVDA came from a group of employees who split off from SGI (Silicon Graphics) back a few decades ago. SGI was the preeminent graphics machine known for its speed using RISC processors. The RISC processers had a limited instruction set and were designed for speed and rendering computer graphic images.
NVDA cards today have a huge array of very limited instruction set processors that are very fast. My Nvidia graphics card has 2,000 CUDA while my computer's CPU has 12. Nvidia has focused on massively parallel processing since its founding in 1993. It can do things that general processors simply can't.
Posted on 5/31/23 at 11:18 am to j1897
quote:
AMD has similar offerings, so does intel.
>
Posted on 5/31/23 at 11:31 am to LSUcam7
quote:
Any misstep and this valuation is a weak foundation to stock owners.
Based on YT research, their newest GPUs have tanked in sales so next quarter's earnings may provide a major hit.
Posted on 5/31/23 at 12:21 pm to Pendulum
Posted on 5/31/23 at 3:53 pm to j1897
So the H100 is the best, k
I'm no expert on the difference between resnet50 and BERT; but I know BERT is what google uses, I believe that's basically most modern language models. RESNET 50 is older; but it looks like H100 is 244% better with BERT and 12% better with RESNET 50.
I suppose you cant be wrong because you didn't define "similar". I would think 244% difference in anything would exclude "similar".
Intel's May2022 chip is more similar to the chip NVDA released in 2020 than their March22 chip. Where's the chart for AMD's "similar" chip?
I'm no expert on the difference between resnet50 and BERT; but I know BERT is what google uses, I believe that's basically most modern language models. RESNET 50 is older; but it looks like H100 is 244% better with BERT and 12% better with RESNET 50.
I suppose you cant be wrong because you didn't define "similar". I would think 244% difference in anything would exclude "similar".
Intel's May2022 chip is more similar to the chip NVDA released in 2020 than their March22 chip. Where's the chart for AMD's "similar" chip?
This post was edited on 5/31/23 at 4:15 pm
Posted on 5/31/23 at 8:42 pm to SquatchDawg
Can anyone explain to me what is different about 'AI' processing? And hopefully that will explain what exactly makes AI AI, and not just a conversational Google search. What is the actual breakthrough in computational ability.
Posted on 5/31/23 at 9:45 pm to Auburn1968
quote:
SGI was the preeminent graphics machine known for its speed using RISC processors
SGI was founded by UNO alumni Jim Clark. After SGI, Clark founded another little company called Netscape.
Posted on 5/31/23 at 10:12 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Based on YT research, their newest GPUs have tanked in sales so next quarter's earnings may provide a major hit.
Are you saying NVDA’s GPUs have tanked in sales already? Like a week or so after their blow out revenue projections?
Posted on 5/31/23 at 10:30 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Based on YT research, their newest GPUs have tanked in sales so next quarter's earnings may provide a major hit.
Gaming has become an increasingly small percentage of their total revenue, and I say that with sadness as PC gamer.
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