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re: Those that want a change at OC - that means you want a different system right?

Posted on 12/22/20 at 7:56 am to
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
291652 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 7:56 am to
quote:

With Brennan the 2020 offense was a less efficient version of 2019 but still really good.


It was never good
Posted by The Egg
Houston, TX
Member since Dec 2004
83919 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:00 am to
Don't think playcalling was bad save for a few situations this year, I will say the flow looked to be disrupted at times when we went too heavy running or passing.

Running the ball looked to be like going head first into a brick wall at times and they kept on trying to do it. I get the need to establishing the run, but there's gotta be more creative ways to do it out of the limited sets that we employ.

Give me more mismatches with tight ends and linebackers, misdirection.

Hell gimme a 2 man cross route like bama does so well that nobody can apparently cover.
Posted by Tigers0891
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2017
7196 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:08 am to
Ensminger may have the play sheet and list but that doesn't mean he knows what to do with it. That is pretty obvious to me.

1) they hire someone to call third down and redzone...if E and the system are so great , why is this needed?

2) they lined up in the shotgun all year with spread personnel. That is a bonus from yesteryear with Miles , but often the plays were not the same as last years. Much slower

3) absolutely zero imagination in the run game. This is extremely aggravating

4)can't run a screen pass to save their lives

Posted by S
RIP Wayde
Member since Jan 2007
173709 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:12 am to
We need a run game coordinator
Posted by sicboy
Because Awesome
Member since Nov 2010
79737 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:12 am to
Play calling will only go so far with no help up front.
Posted by bstew3006
318
Member since Dec 2007
13059 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:13 am to
quote:

was basically the same system as the year before lol u people are silly



This was more 2018 SE offense than 2019 Brady.

How many times did you see the RB motion out of the back field, to help identify man or zone? Then realize LSU did this and went empty over 80% last year.

How many times did you see deep sideline routes or 5-10 out routes to the far side hash (NFL route)? SE loved it in 18.

Think back to Mizz game with MB. They kept blitzing and SE answer was to roll the pocket away from the blitz. That cut the filed down and limited play calling. Very similar to 18 vs Fla.

Offense has a few concepts from Brady, but 2020 was more in line with 18.

Posted by sicboy
Because Awesome
Member since Nov 2010
79737 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:14 am to
quote:

It was never good


Your disdain for Emsminger goes too far at times.
Posted by wildtigercat93
Member since Jul 2011
116455 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:16 am to
You’re out of your depth here if you think what we ran in 2020 was the same system we ran in 2019
Posted by bstew3006
318
Member since Dec 2007
13059 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:19 am to
quote:

Play calling will only go so far with no help up front.


I remember this in 2018 as well. It wasn’t SE offense/scheme or his Highly questionable play calling.. LSU needed a better line and better personnel.

I like SE, but he’s not the answer as the OC...that’s been evident not only in 18 & 20 but throughout his career as an OC. Hell, he even admitted he couldn’t modernize LSU offense bc he didn’t understand the new Schemes / concepts (just an important factor in being an effective play caller).

If your OC needs a PGC to call plays on 3rd and RZ...you don’t have an OC! How some of you don’t see this is baffling. Does sark, kiffin, Briles, Mullen, fisher etc only call 1st and 2nd down?
This post was edited on 12/22/20 at 8:26 am
Posted by Will2nd
Atlanta
Member since Sep 2009
4133 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:20 am to
quote:

I want an OC to run his system, know how to scheme,not only other teams but to scheme around LSUs weaknesses.


I want LSU to keep the system they have while working on making the running game more dynamic within that system. You don't wholesale change offensive systems that work and are this explosive in the passing game if you want a shot at competing for championships in two years. You want to evolve and not burn it all down. Wholesale changes also affect the QBs with having to learn a completely new playbook likely with new terminology. Brady built the playbook, but E decided which plays to run in certain situations this year which was the biggest glaring difference from Brady during the 2019 season.
Posted by sicboy
Because Awesome
Member since Nov 2010
79737 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:32 am to
I never took it that Emsminger needed someone to call 3rd down an red zone, was just an arrangement they came up with to give Brady play calling experience. LSU led the nation in yards on 1st down last year. This keeps getting ignored.

I assume they just kept the same arrangement when Linehan came in, and obviously he's no Brady. I felt they should have let Emsminger call all of the plays, but of course those that don't like him will assume it's because they didn't think he could handle it.
Posted by bstew3006
318
Member since Dec 2007
13059 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:38 am to
quote:

LSU led the nation in yards on 1st down last year. This keeps getting ignored.


If ppl believe SE called 90%, good luck with it. So Brady called 3rd / RZ and all empty...LSU tan empty 80% of the time. This keeps getting ignored. It was all Brady, not SE
Posted by sicboy
Because Awesome
Member since Nov 2010
79737 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 8:39 am to
Where is the empty narrative coming from?
Posted by oleheat
Sportsman's Paradise
Member since Mar 2007
14866 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 9:08 am to
O should go and talk to his buddy Sean in New Orleans. Maybe he has another Brady-type waiting in the wings....Doesn't hurt to pick the mind of a real offensive football guru- which Sean Peyton certainly is.
Posted by bstew3006
318
Member since Dec 2007
13059 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 9:38 am to
quote:

Where is the empty narrative coming from?


There was an Advanced stat article on 19 offense that broke down the personnel groupings, formations, etc and gave the %. I’ll see if I can find it and link.

Try to remember how many times you saw LSU empty, or 1 RB and the RB motioning out to empty set (get D to show man or Zone), bunch formations this year?

“ STEVE ENSMINGER: We talked about it before the game. I tell him, I know what my strengths are and I know what my weaknesses are. Joe is better with our compact packages. Joe is better at our empty package than I am. So I tell him, we talk about it before the game, Look, when I want to go empty, be ready. If it's third and whatever, and I have a call, I make it. If not, I tell him. He has it all highlighted. I'm like, Take it.

We can go to empty right now. I said, Joe, I'm going empty. Take it, he's ready for it.

Compact meaning our bunch packages, a condensed formation, stuff like that. He's better at that than I am. I know it. I tell him, Hey, I want to go whatever it is, bunch, pack 'em all in here. I said, Call it. He's ready for it.”
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
481186 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 9:51 am to
quote:

Do you remember what it was like all the years before? The amount of uncertainty from week to week as to how we were going to score enough points?

that's b/c of the OCs and offenses the HCs wanted to run

modern offensive coaches grow on trees. Miles and O just shied away from adapting a modern offense

we have one now, so i don't see why O would go backward
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
481186 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 9:53 am to
quote:

It was basically the same system as the year before

not really. it was like 75% of the Brady system. just much safer and more vanilla/telegraphed

the playcalling was inferior and the formations were a lot more vanilla/plain

E calls the game like an old school OC where he goes by gut thinking that he'll catch the right D and attack it with his playcall

what we missed was a philosophy of scheming guys open and into space. lots of creativity with formations left with Brady. we need that back
This post was edited on 12/22/20 at 9:54 am
Posted by SlowFlowPro
With populists, expect populism
Member since Jan 2004
481186 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 9:56 am to
quote:

How many times did you see the RB motion out of the back field, to help identify man or zone? Then realize LSU did this and went empty over 80% last year.

this and using the TE at the boundary are the 2 most obvious examples of how this wasn't even the same philosophy, let alone offense

the 3rd is how we used RPO

you take away those sorts of things and it's not the same offense. it may be from the same playbook, but the nuts and bolts are very different
Posted by Datbayoubengal
Port City
Member since Sep 2009
29391 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 10:25 am to
Man it's easy. Jeff Lebby from Ole Miss or Phil Longo from UNC. LSU could easily afford either one, and neither is tethered to their current school as an assistant head coach.

Lebby put up insane offenses at UCF, and then in year one at Ole Miss, their offense went from 81st in scoring and 26 in total the previous year, to 13th in scoring and 3rd in total offense this year. These are his leaders in offense

Corral 71% 3000 pass yards 10.6 ypa 27 TD 14 int, 470 rush yards 4 TD

Moore (only 8 games) - 86 receptions 1200 yards 8 TD
TE Yeaboh (only 8 games) - 27 receptions 524 yards 19.4 yards per reception, 8 TDs

Longo took a UNC offense that was 31st in total offense to 12th in 2019 and then 4th this year. He took a 78th scoring offense and turned into it 30th in 2019, and then 6th this year. These are his leaders in offense

Howell 69% 3352 yards 10.6 ypa 27 TD 6 int, 120 rush yards 5 TD

Carter 156 carries 1245 yards 8.0 ypc 9 TD, 25 rec 267 yards 2 TD
Williams 157 carries 1140 yards 7.3 ypa 19 TD, 25 rec 305 yards 3 TD

Brown 55 receptions 1120 yards 20.0 ypr 8 TD
Posted by Coeur du Tigre
It was just outside of Barstow...
Member since Nov 2008
5241 posts
Posted on 12/22/20 at 1:18 pm to
Ok, how are Lebby and Longo on 3rd down percentages and red zone TD's? Not arguing with you, but would like to see these stats as well.
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