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Why are european clubs so quick to fire managers?
Posted on 5/25/15 at 2:18 pm
Posted on 5/25/15 at 2:18 pm
So Ancelotti was sacked today, for those of you who don't know. One year after leading Madrid to ultimate glory.
It's like if Greg Popovich was fired for not winning an NBA title this year.
I don't see how you can fire a man as decorated as Ancelotti who won the title last season, just based on one year with not silverware.
It's like if Greg Popovich was fired for not winning an NBA title this year.
I don't see how you can fire a man as decorated as Ancelotti who won the title last season, just based on one year with not silverware.
3
Posted on 5/25/15 at 2:29 pm to benhamin5555
European sports are more American than American sports.
Posted on 5/25/15 at 6:12 pm to benhamin5555
Well Real is an extreme example but it boils down to how much there is to lose for a club. If you don't finish top 4 you miss out on a ton of money, same for the mid table clubs if you get relegated. It makes the people running the teams a lot more nervous because the bottom line is effected after a down season much more so than American sports. Hence the itchy trigger fingers.
It makes for a much better and more interesting campaign from the fans perspective than American sports really because here nothing matters until the playoffs.
It makes for a much better and more interesting campaign from the fans perspective than American sports really because here nothing matters until the playoffs.
This post was edited on 5/25/15 at 6:17 pm
Posted on 5/25/15 at 6:42 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
It makes for a much better and more interesting campaign from the fans perspective than American sports really because here nothing matters until the playoffs.
American pro sports systems are so much better than the financial trainwreck that is European football. MLB is considered to have the most messed up financial structure among pro sports league yet it has the draft and revenue sharing to allow small market teams to compete. There's also no transfer system which puts teams heavily in debt.
Posted on 5/25/15 at 6:43 pm to Bench McElroy
quote:
American pro sports systems are so much better than the financial trainwreck that is European football. MLB is considered to have the most messed up financial structure among pro sports league yet it has the draft and revenue sharing to allow small market teams to compete. There's also no transfer system which puts teams heavily in debt.
Take that commie talk somewhere else......
Posted on 5/25/15 at 9:20 pm to Bench McElroy
quote:
American pro sports systems are so much better than the financial trainwreck that is European football. MLB is considered to have the most messed up financial structure
so you root for profitability? quote:
among pro sports league yet it has the draft
You think forced servitude for players is a good thing? How would you feel if after graduation from Alabama someone walked up to you and said you would only be allowed to ply your trade in Milwaukee?
quote:
And revenue sharing to allow small market teams to compete.
Parity is extremely overrated. There is an entire chapter dedicated to this in Soccernomics. There is absolutely no correlation between parity and fan interest. The fact that the season actually matters unlike American leagues (even the NFL is trying to water their product down as much as possible) makes it a better system IMO.
It's a perfect system really. Everyone plays everyone home and home, whoever has the most points is the champ. It rewards quality over a 9 month period, not just who gets hot at the right time. Even the Champions League and cup competitions are spread out over a long enough period that you won't just have a team go on a run over a 4-6 week period. All of this is far more important than parity.
Like I said, It's a far superior system.
quote:
There's also no transfer system which puts teams heavily in debt.
It is a very different system, but teams rarely if ever go away due to debt. At worst they get relegated. Still not sure why profitability is important to anyone except the people who own the teams. Even then it's not like there is a lack of demand for people to buy soccer clubs so it doesn't seem like they care either.
This post was edited on 5/25/15 at 9:37 pm
Posted on 5/26/15 at 6:22 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
You think forced servitude for players is a good thing?
I don't think this means what you think it means.
quote:
How would you feel if after graduation from Alabama someone walked up to you and said you would only be allowed to ply your trade in Milwaukee?
You have a choice to choose a different career.
If you decide to accept the offer in Milwaukee you will get paid Hundreds of thousands or millions to play and if you do well you eventually qualify for FA.
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:15 am to Helo
quote:
You have a choice to choose a different career.
If you decide to accept the offer in Milwaukee you will get paid Hundreds of thousands or millions to play and if you do well you eventually qualify for FA.
You didn't answer the question. How would have felt if, upon graduation, you were told you must ply your trade in city x and you have no say in the matter?
How much they make is irrelevant.
And just saying "well go do something else if you don't like it" isn't sufficient either. It's a cheap and lazy argument.
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:19 am to Draconian Sanctions
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:26 am to Bench McElroy
quote:
MLB is considered to have the most messed up financial structure among pro sports league yet it has the draft and revenue sharing to allow small market teams to compete. There's also no transfer system which puts teams heavily in debt.
i have argued for years that the transfer system is perfect for MLB instead of revenue sharing
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:47 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
You didn't answer the question. How would have felt if, upon graduation, you were told you must ply your trade in city x and you have no say in the matter?
Answer: No idea how I would feel.
Answer2: Not relevant in pro sports.
quote:
And just saying "well go do something else if you don't like it" isn't sufficient either. It's a cheap and lazy argument.
It is an answer to your question. Lazy or not it is fact.
A cheap argument is saying pro players are in forced servitude
To get thread back on track, I think Euro clubs are very similar to NHL team in their willingness to fire managers quickly. Not sure why but if they had relegation in North American leagues, I imagine the firing would be quicker.
How Often did George Steinbrenner fire his managers during the season?
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:50 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
And just saying "well go do something else if you don't like it" isn't sufficient either. It's a cheap and lazy argument.
Not really. It's not like the draft is a process that is sprung on these guys at the end. They know exactly what they are working toward. Also, they have options to go play in Canada, Europe, or Japan depending on the sport if they don't like the situation they end up in. They know what they are signing up for and how much they make also isn't totally irrelevant either. If someone told me I had to go work in Milwaukee for a few months each year for three years and make like 20 million dollars doing it before I could go wherever I want I think I could be ok with that.
Plus you can always throw a Manning hissy fit and make sure you don't get drafted by a certain team if you really don't want to.
This post was edited on 5/26/15 at 8:05 am
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:58 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
so you root for profitability?
I don't understand this either.
quote:
Parity is extremely overrated
Is it though?
quote:
There is an entire chapter dedicated to this in Soccernomics. There is absolutely no correlation between parity and fan interest.
Maybe when talking about it from the perspective of people who grew up fans of certain teams but I think parity absolutely is a draw for new fans getting into the sport.
Why do you think the EPL is 100x more popular than other leagues in America? Real and Barca are generally always better than any team in the EPL and with bigger stars but very few people here care because it's boring. Bayern lately too.
I understand your points, and somewhat agree really, that trying to force parity isn't necessarily a good thing but I absolutely think it makes leagues more enjoyable and entertaining when it exists.
Posted on 5/26/15 at 7:58 am to RandySavage
I'm consistently amazed at how willing Americans are to defend a practice as unamerican as preventing two willing parties from contracting with each other. If I'd rather play for the Saints than any other team and they will have me, there's absolutely no reason we should be prevented from making a deal.
Posted on 5/26/15 at 8:17 am to Draconian Sanctions
Maybe but I'm glad it's not like that. Sports here would be terrible. Sometimes people are able to see the bigger picture.
Posted on 5/26/15 at 8:19 am to Dandy Lion
The managers at the top clubs make double what the top coaches do in american sports. But real is a diff animal when it comes to retaining managers.
Posted on 5/26/15 at 9:05 am to RandySavage
quote:
I understand your points, and somewhat agree really, that trying to force parity isn't necessarily a good thing but I absolutely think it makes leagues more enjoyable and entertaining when it exists.
Pure parity makes for boring leagues. Nobody stands out, there's no greatness. There are no heros and no villans.
The EPL has a degree of uncertainty which is not the same thing at all as parity.
This post was edited on 5/26/15 at 9:06 am
Posted on 5/26/15 at 9:06 am to RandySavage
quote:
Sports here would be terrible.
that's not true at all. Do you think the European setup is "terrible"? quote:
Sometimes people are able to see the bigger picture.
Yeah and in this scenario it's me.
This post was edited on 5/26/15 at 9:07 am
Posted on 5/26/15 at 9:44 am to dgnx6
quote:
The managers at the top clubs make double what the top coaches do in american sports
what soccer manager makes $18-20M/year?
Posted on 5/26/15 at 9:51 am to SlowFlowPro
I think Pep makes 17 mil euros per year....which is what about 18.5 mil dollars or so?
Is that right I think I heard that 17 mil Euro figure when he made the move to Bayern?.....could be wrong though.
Is that right I think I heard that 17 mil Euro figure when he made the move to Bayern?.....could be wrong though.
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