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re: The migrant situation in Europe is completely out of control
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:24 pm to Flats
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:24 pm to Flats
I think you’re being a bit generous to the OP.
That’s the post. You can extrapolate that comment into several directions, and it appears to me the post boils down to blaming the US for the immigration policy some European nations have adopted.
The post had nothing to do with intelligent policy crafting, the need for broader, international coalitions to deal with refugee crises, etc.
Also, I never said that nations should “self immolate”. I stated my experiences in Europe as being particularly not apocalyptic, on the contrary quite pleasant.
You chose to view it as a “countries should commit suicide” comment, but what I was attempting to convey was that Europe is a pretty fricking cool place and not the shithole many Americans would have you believe it is.
quote:
Over a million to Germany this year. Over 500,000 to Britain. They are fully under the boot of American policy. It's pure malice.
That’s the post. You can extrapolate that comment into several directions, and it appears to me the post boils down to blaming the US for the immigration policy some European nations have adopted.
The post had nothing to do with intelligent policy crafting, the need for broader, international coalitions to deal with refugee crises, etc.
Also, I never said that nations should “self immolate”. I stated my experiences in Europe as being particularly not apocalyptic, on the contrary quite pleasant.
You chose to view it as a “countries should commit suicide” comment, but what I was attempting to convey was that Europe is a pretty fricking cool place and not the shithole many Americans would have you believe it is.
This post was edited on 6/14/23 at 11:28 pm
2
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:34 pm to HVAU
If I could live anywhere and money was no object, it would either be Nice or Monaco. Rare to find places that beautiful and historic but yet not too touristy.
This post was edited on 6/14/23 at 11:36 pm
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:35 pm to concrete_tiger
I recently spent two months there. The immigrant situation is not ideal but I thought the cities would be completely overrun when in my opinion they weren’t. Still saw a lot more locals but maybe that changes in 50 years if there isn’t any backlash or more strict immigration limits. I will say that in France there were heavily armed police all over the place at airports, train stations and touristy areas. I guess they have served as a decent deterrent. The reality is most American cities are far far more dangerous. Still, I will always say that anyone who won’t assimilate should be expelled and fighting age men should be denied entry anyway.
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:37 pm to HVAU
quote:
but what I was attempting to convey was that Europe is a pretty fricking cool place and not the shithole many Americans would have you believe it is.
In your opinion, if the population of Europe were to be, say, 75% non-European, would Europe continue to be as nice of a place as it is now?
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:43 pm to Plx1776
quote:Honestly should have left Saddam alone and none of this shite would have happened but the Dick Cheney admin was in charge
The middle easterners who migrated have a legit excuse. We kind of directly and indirectly destroyed their own countries.
Posted on 6/14/23 at 11:44 pm to HVAU
quote:
and it appears to me the post boils down to blaming the US for the immigration policy some European nations have adopted.
The US part is moronic, but not unexpected based on his brief history. His history as Robb something or other is actually worse.
quote:
You chose to view it as a “countries should commit suicide” comment, but what I was attempting to convey was that Europe is a pretty fricking cool place and not the shithole many Americans would have you believe it is.
Is a cool place right now, yes. But as you acknowledge, it has some disturbing trends, and a lot of them are due to unchecked immigration from countries that are dramatically different. That’s not sustainable. Your “live and let die” comment implies that you think they’re obligated to accept these people regardless of the consequences, and I disagree.
Posted on 6/15/23 at 4:53 am to HVAU
quote:
Also, it appears France has a version of “stand your ground” laws that allows for reasonable use of force when protecting yourself and your property.
A buddy of mine is a farmer in Alsace who could have shot some thieves and didn’t pull the trigger out of fear of the law. They might have it in theory, but not in practice.
Posted on 6/15/23 at 5:35 am to BuckyCheese
I know a dozen or so Polish expats that live in the USA now. Most pretty hot if you are in to tall and thin.
Posted on 6/15/23 at 7:39 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
quote:
Most worried I have ever felt in traveling the world was Paris
You sound like a massive pussy.
Thanks.
My traveling partner was a small female. Walking down a street toward our hotel, there were arab men loitering on the sidewalk and at the doors to "businesses." As we walked by, more came out and began to point and taunt us. We picked up the pace and continued to the hotel.
Later that night, around 2am or so, my traveling partner called me saying there was banging on her hotel door. Inside a hotel where you'd have to get thru a lobby. I could hear the dirka dirkas on the phone. Went over there and whoever was there ran off. We told the front desk and they apologized but offered no information. We were only at that spot for a night, would never go back.
My point is I doubt you spend time in any of the areas like this. We traveled to call on retailers and part of the trip was to physically visit as many locations in market as possible on a trip.
Sorry I am not the man that you are. You probably would have stopped in the street and told those muslim men to frick off, right? 'Merica!
Posted on 6/15/23 at 7:57 am to tigerinmexico
quote:
In your opinion, if the population of Europe were to be, say, 75% non-European, would Europe continue to be as nice of a place as it is now?
I don’t know. I think I’d be curious what type of non-Europeans you mean. Are we talking culturally/historically or ethically/racially? Are we going by how long someone has been in Europe? Can we just go by looks? If you travel to Greece, the people there aren’t what you’d think of as typical Europeans, having more in common with peoples south and east of Europe.
Many parts of Europe are fascinating today because of the cultural ebbs and flows throughout history. Take the Acropolis, or any number of Ancient Greek sites, French sites too for that matter. They’ve served as temples to various Greek gods, Byzantine churches, Islamic mosques, military garrisons, and in the case of the Acropolis, a munitions storage facility.
There are other parts of Europe that been culturally homogenous for much of their existence. Their also fascinating.
As nice a place? I don’t know. Possibly just different.
Posted on 6/15/23 at 8:22 am to Flats
quote:
Is a cool place right now, yes. But as you acknowledge, it has some disturbing trends, and a lot of them are due to unchecked immigration from countries that are dramatically different. That’s not sustainable. Your “live and let die” comment implies that you think they’re obligated to accept these people regardless of the consequences, and I disagree.
I think it can be taken that way, “the live and let die“ comment. My intent was to say “what are they supposed to do” as a collection of decent people trying to behave in a collectively benevolent way. I respect their compassion, but I agree that it should have limits. A compounding issue is that some European and global neighbors aren’t willing to act as compassionately, and the burden falls on those that are. When the compassionate nation’s limit is reached what are they supposed to do? Nobody has asked me to be an expert on the topic so I haven’t studied it very intently, and I don’t know.
I did have a conversation with a friend about population density as it relates to impoverished Americans cities. They discussed the problem of “herding” the impoverished people into public housing complexes that were densely populated. This killed the local economies around the public housing complexes. We came to the conclusion that a better solution would be to spread those populations throughout a large city into individual, spaced out public housing units, thereby relieving stress on local economies, concentration of crime, educational decline, overworked police precincts, etc. The problem with this comes down to NIMBYism. Everybody sees the problem, and likely knows the solution to the problem, but doesn’t want to share in the solution. I’m not going to say that is bad and evil, it’s nature, because they’re being asked to look at this very large risk and take on a small share of that risk.
Europe seems to be dealing with the same issue. I don’t believe, as some have stated here, that it is because they’re letting in a bunch of “muzzies”, or this ethnicity or that. Europe is taking in a lot of poor people, and that comes with a lot of risk. Impoverished areas, regardless of ethnicity, have higher crime, lower education level, decreased upward mobility, lower property values, etc. It’d be great to see the xenophobic attitudes dissipate(and I don’t mean you Flats, because I don’t recall seeing anything specifically xenophobic in your comments), and see a broader collection of nations working to solve these problems more effectively.
San Francisco comes to mind as well, but I think I’ve said enough for now.
Posted on 6/15/23 at 8:46 am to concrete_tiger
quote:
My traveling partner was a small female. Walking down a street toward our hotel, there were arab men loitering on the sidewalk and at the doors to "businesses." As we walked by, more came out and began to point and taunt us. We picked up the pace and continued to the hotel. Later that night, around 2am or so, my traveling partner called me saying there was banging on her hotel door. Inside a hotel where you'd have to get thru a lobby. I could hear the dirka dirkas on the phone. Went over there and whoever was there ran off. We told the front desk and they apologized but offered no information. We were only at that spot for a night, would never go back. My point is I doubt you spend time in any of the areas like this. We traveled to call on retailers and part of the trip was to physically visit as many locations in market as possible on a trip.
You weren’t replying to me with this post, but your original comment I think was in reference to mine.
I had what started out to be a similar circumstance the first time we went to Athens. We came in from the airport to Omonoia at around midnight. The taxi dropped us off on the closest street he could, but our hotel bordered the central market between Athinas and Aiolou, which shuts down in the evening, but during the day is a major outdoor market.
So my wife and I are pulling our luggage up to the hotel, and we have to pass this junk shop before we get to the door. As we approach the junk shop two guys come out. I can’t tell if they’re Greek or Arabic or something else. Most people in that area have dark skin and dark hair, and it was late. Anyway, the men come out and eye us, and we pass by, but I keep my eye over my shoulder as a precaution. We got into our hotel, and that was it.
Turns out the guys at the junk shop work there, and because it’s overflowing there can lock everything up at night. A couple of them stay at night to prevent people looting their junk. I talked to them several times, and purchased some random souvenirs there. They were good people.
Posted on 6/15/23 at 4:35 pm to Motownsix
quote:
Most pretty hot if you are in to tall and thin.
I am.
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