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re: The Medium income Amercan Family now earns 1/2 the income needed to buy the avg home.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 9:58 am to Crimson Wraith
Posted on 3/13/25 at 9:58 am to Crimson Wraith
quote:
Owning acres is not living on the side of the street.
I'm talking about where we live. If you dont live in a neighborhood, which most have HOAs as a result, it's a house off a main street for most part.
We had friends who moved in a house off the street and their neighbor decided to throw up a huge trampoline on their side of the fence sideways with their band name painted on it so they could livestream concerts their band would play. There's nothing our friends could really do about a huge hideous sideways painted trampoline, but god did it look awful. They took like 6 months to sell that house in a HOT market still.
Yeah, no thanks
0
Posted on 3/13/25 at 9:58 am to thunderbird1100
quote:
We value neighborhoods with pool/tennis and other amentities. These are not free. Our landscaping is impeccable
Ah, yes. I remember these being big concerns of mine too when I was just starting out in life.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:00 am to DrrTiger
quote:
Ah, yes. I remember these being big concerns of mine too when I was just starting out in life.
We are hardly starting out in life, we're almost 40
not sure why you're trying to act like we're a young couple in our 20s, we are not
I am not making any arguments for our personal situation, just recognizing the current reality of things. It's literally the worst time to buy a house ever with the prices the way they are and the rates where they are it. People have less buying power than ever before. If you're a young(er) person or couple looking to buy for the first time, the reality is by far most of them cant with the way things are right now even if they have pretty well paying jobs in the mid-late 20s.
This post was edited on 3/13/25 at 10:03 am
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:02 am to thunderbird1100
Part of the issue not being discussed here is that home values are unlikely to appreciate like they have in the past long term. The birth rate is 1.66, we have a declining population. That number would be even lower if it was not propped up from low income immigrants.
Numbers wise, it makes more sense for most people to rent and keep their downpayment in the market than to buy at this point
Numbers wise, it makes more sense for most people to rent and keep their downpayment in the market than to buy at this point
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:03 am to RollTide4547
quote:
Another thing that would help is if YOU acquire a needed skill. Save your money and make sacrifices for your future.
I work in finance & make an extra $20k a year playing music gigs. I'm in the top 20% income in my area. Please don't say "lrn2code" and my blue collar friends only make money when they work a shitton of overtime.
I'd be house poor if I bought in a good area here, because home prices have increased by 50-70% in the good neighborhoods. I'd also be terrified of going underwater because values appear to be in a huge bubble.
I'd be great financially but time poor if I bought a trailer in the country, because everything would be a 45 minute drive away.
Most people around here are even worse off. Life isn't bad, but this is the reality of the situation
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:06 am to GeauxBurrow312
quote:
Numbers wise, it makes more sense for most people to rent and keep their downpayment in the market than to buy at this point
It's absolutely a horrible time to buy, no doubt.
We've been staying where we're at to hopefully let this storm pass a bit, we can definitely afford to move where we want, but prices just last year/year before got so insane despite interest rates skyrocketing up in the process it made no sense really.
The townhouses in our own neighborhood similar to ours were selling for $450k-$460k the last 2 years and sold for $300k just back in 2020-2021
This post was edited on 3/13/25 at 10:08 am
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:12 am to thunderbird1100
Another thing that is getting largely overlooked is the fact that it is a horrible time for the first time buyers that bought a home 7-10 years ago, that would normally be looking to upgrade from a starter home, as their family has grown, to do so. There should be a natural supply of starter homes that just isn't there, let alone the fact we are at some historically low levels of new home supply.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:12 am to thunderbird1100
quote:Maybe Calera is not desireable for you but I bet other people like it there. Myself, I've never been there. Have been to Atlanta and there is not enough money in the world to get me to live there.
its not a highly desirable area for most people to live in. The same exact house in most of metro ATL would go for about double that easily.
If you want something you're always going to have to sacrifice. You can sacrifice a couple hours commuting each day, live in a rural area and buy a nicer house. Or you can save those couple hours and not buy a house. In 2008, my wife and I bought a fixer upper on 1 acre for 80K, 60+ miles from my job. We fixed it up and sold it in 2011 for 110K. Used that money to buy our current house (67 miles from my job) on 54 acres at the time for 280K. Bought the 40 acres that joins us for 120K in 2014. The land alone is now worth close to a million and the insurance says the house would cost 380K to rebuild. Just the house alone near my job would be 600K today and we only paid 400K total for house and 94 acres.
quote:Same can be said for your point.
Thats fine if thats the life you want to live, but its not necessarily fit for everyone.
This post was edited on 3/13/25 at 10:17 am
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:14 am to HubbaBubba
quote:
The problem is, people are not willing to start at the bottom and work their way up.
(#1) My first place was a small cheaply furnished apartment over a garage that I paid $90 a month for with water, gas and electricity.
(#2) Second place was a used manufactured home that I purchased under a lease to own. Paid it off in three years.
(#3) When I sold that I purchased a 3br home in a rapidly deteriorating part of town for $36k, at 8% interest on a owner financed deal.
(#4) Next was a house at $87k that had a two car garage, two bedrooms and two baths.
(#5) Next was a home at $165k, that had four bedrooms, 2.5 baths and 2 car garage.
(#6) then the home I'm in now has 4BR, a media room, two living areas, large designer kitchen, 3 car garage and a pool for $365k. That was in 2001.
The span of time was 26 years.
The problem is, nobody wants to start at #1 anymore. Everyone thinks they should be able to start at #5. They aren't willing to build their future by starting small and move up as their income moves up. They want it NOW! NOW! NOW!
No, the problem is that #1 now costs $900/month instead of $90.
#3 is now $250k at 7%.
#5 is 500k, etc.
People are stuck at #2 and #3 because the cost of #4 is unattainable for most people.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:15 am to Bigdawgb
quote:
Please don't say "lrn2code"
Live in a rural area. Commute if you have to. More to life that virtual signaling to others with a fancy house.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:16 am to VADawg
quote:Nominal debt.
Related: Consumer credit card debt is at an all time high
Nominal credit card debt is at an all-time high.
But that can be a misleading stat.
Relative to consumer spending, debt is not at an all-time high.
It's relatively moderate compared to historical levels.
Consumers are not leveraging credit cards as heavily against spending as they did in prior decades. However, the ratio has been trending upward since 2021.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:17 am to thunderbird1100
quote:
We are hardly starting out in life, we're almost 40
I see. It’s interesting that all the people here bitching about how houses are completely unaffordable do, in fact, own a house.
It’s “other people” they know who can’t afford one.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:17 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
You're more familiar w/ La prices/value than I am, but here are some examples from there.
So 70607 typically isn't good. That one on Lakes Edge is in a lower-end area of new, large development (DSLD home, FWIW).
The 1912 Chandler drive appears to be a new tract home development but it's right next door to literally the worst area in LC.
The Thibodeaux Road is around the corner from this home.
23rd Street and 19th street are in Oak Park, aka ghetto. If you look at a map of LC, Oak Park + east to Highway 14, and a little north/south of the intersection of Highway 14 and Prien Lake Road = ghetto, and the dangerous kind.
The 3 developmental homes are in areas slightly south of this area, but still within the danger zone (Especially the Chandler address). You're going to be paying for private school or sending your kids to bad public schools.
The Sissy Ln is the other part of 70607 which is BFE almost to Cameron, south of the Airport. I don't know much about this area but I think their schools are the bad ones.
The Savannah one is probably acceptable (probably a DSLD or one of those types, if you can stomach it). Tried looking it up and I couldn't find it on the Assessor's site.
I looked up the Pleasant Dr. one, and it's fine. Your typical house that needs updating across the entire interior. I'll guess it's 220k because ie needs a new roof/AC to get a mortgage. stout could likely make a more educated guess, but this is your "old owner and fixer upper" example for a starter home. It's been on the market for 8 months now so something is likely prohibiting a sale.
Just FWIW
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:23 am to DrrTiger
quote:
It’s interesting that all the people here bitching about how houses are completely unaffordable do, in fact, own a house.
So, people that own a home can't be objective about the reality of the housing market currently? If they are looking at moving out of their starter home, they aren't in the same boat?
I find it interesting how defensive people get at the slight suggestion that things could be more difficult thanwhen someone else did something, even when every statistical measure proves that to be true.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:26 am to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
So, people that own a home can't be objective about the reality of the housing market currently? If they are looking at moving out of their starter home, they aren't in the same boat?
It's the worst sort of argument. They have no rational response and just refuse to budge an inch so they throw out the silliness.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:29 am to RollTide4547
quote:
If you want something you're always going to have to sacrifice. You can sacrifice a couple hours commuting each day, live in a rural area and buy a nicer house. Or you can save those couple hours and not buy a house. In 2008, my wife and I bought a fixer upper on 1 acre for 80K, 60+ miles from my job. We fixed it up and sold it in 2011 for 110K. Used that money to buy our current house (67 miles from my job) on 54 acres at the time for 280K. Bought the 40 acres that joins us for 120K in 2014. The land alone is now worth close to a million and the insurance says the house would cost 380K to rebuild. Just the house alone near my job would be 600K today and we only paid 400K total for house and 94 acres.
People keep posting shite like this like it’s possible to do now.
This post was edited on 3/13/25 at 10:30 am
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:30 am to RollTide4547
quote:
Maybe Calera is not desireable for you but I bet other people like it there. Myself, I've never been there. Have been to Atlanta and there is not enough money in the world to get me to live there.
Everything is different from one person to the next, but the point is housing is in very short supply nationwide, and the reason a brand new 1500sqft house can be bought in middle of nowhere Alabama is because it's not as desirable a place for most as say Metro atl is. There is more economic opportunity in large metro area than again, middle of nowhere Alabama. Thats the reason why you take the same houses selling for $225k in Calera Alabama and plop them in metro Atlanta they will go for nearly half a million in most places.
As much as you cant ever fathom living in a major metro area, there's 10x or maybe more people would never want to move to central Alabama 40 minutes away from the nearest city. If people were wanting to move there, the prices wouldnt be so cheap. Really that simple as it comes down to supply/demand ultimately.
quote:
If you want something you're always going to have to sacrifice.
We dont personally sacrifice anything, again just stating the reality of the current situation for first time home buyers who say, dont want to live in middle of nowhere Alabama and maybe have a degree they are trying to use in a good economic opportunity major metro area. On top of that, we have a lot of friends who have gone from their starter homes to larger single family homes over the last several years as their families expanded and all their mortgages basically doubled or in some cases more than doubled. Just the reality of the current housing situation. Nobody went out and got luxury new homes or anything, prices have just skyrocketed and rates are much higher now than previously.
quote:
You can sacrifice a couple hours commuting each day
Again, just isnt something a lot of people will live with. And its not just a long commute, but the area they live in specifically. Some people actually want stuff to do around their area they live. I get some people are totally fine with having to drive 20-30 minutes to a grocery store, an hour to go to a fun place, or go to the same restaurant every week because its the only good restaurant within 20 minutes of them...there's plenty of others who dont want that lifestyle and it doesnt suit them, simply put. We have 4 grocery stores within 10 minutes of us, a costco 10 minutes away, probably 100 or so restaurants within 10-15ish minutes of us, about 2 dozen daycares we could put our kid in within a 10-15 minute drive from us. These are nice to haves for us and wouldnt move an hour (with zero traffic) outside the ATL area in say Breman GA and our lifestyle is flipped to crap between my wife killing the both of us for a long miserable commute and nothing to do around town. But hey, we could live in mansion out there probably for the price of our townhouse, woohoo!
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:31 am to SlowFlowPro
It’s not just DFW it’s a problem in East Texas also. Even in a town like Tyler it would be hard to buy a house on a 100k salary. But it’s more manageable there.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:33 am to RollTide4547
quote:
Live in a rural area. Commute if you have to. More to life that virtual signaling to others with a fancy house.
You think people are moving in a place like This to "virtue signal".
Again, just the reality of the situation now, a house like that was less than $250k just a few short years ago. And again, a lot of people dont want to live their life in a car. People have hour+ long commutes and live in the suburbs in the ATL area. If you lived in rural areas your commute would be an hour and a half about each way probably. That's a miserable life to live.
Posted on 3/13/25 at 10:34 am to GeauxBurrow312
quote:My argument is that people need to grow up. This is the real world. If you want something you have to sacrifice. If you're not willing to sacrifice, do without it.
Baw, if your argument is that everything is fine, everyone just needs to spend 3+ hours a day commuting, thats a horrible argument. Not to mention wear and tear on car + gas from that shite
1) don't want to spend 3 hours a day commuting, don't and pay rent. We paid a total of 400K for our home and 94 acres. It's valued at 1.4 Million today. I've been commuting 15 hours a week (750 hours a year) since 2008. That's 12000 hours. Our home/land has increased 1 million. That's 83 bucks an hour. Not bad for driving.
2) car/gas -- I currently drive a 2011 ford fiesta manual transmission. It has 290K miles and gets 42 mpg. Bought it used with a little over 100K miles for 2800 bucks. Before that, drove a honda accord that got 35 mpg. Again, it's about sacrifices. If you don't want to make them, fine.
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