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re: The Fall of Douglas Murray
Posted on 10/11/25 at 7:44 pm to hogcard1964
Posted on 10/11/25 at 7:44 pm to hogcard1964
I guess in the era of mega-corporatism this is an issue we no longer care about.
A man who has claimed to be a journalist and independent thinker is being paid by a government, specifically to help them influence other governments. There was a time that was disqualifying. Whether you agree with his sentiment or not is not the issue. Can you really trust that what he says is not paid for? Forget about bias. We all have those.
Why do we have them? It’s because we listen to those we trust on certain topics. Most of us have never beeeeen to Gaza. We choose to trust certain voices on the topic. Can we now trust his?
THAT is the point. Not whether Jews or Muslims are more deserving of life.
A man who has claimed to be a journalist and independent thinker is being paid by a government, specifically to help them influence other governments. There was a time that was disqualifying. Whether you agree with his sentiment or not is not the issue. Can you really trust that what he says is not paid for? Forget about bias. We all have those.
Why do we have them? It’s because we listen to those we trust on certain topics. Most of us have never beeeeen to Gaza. We choose to trust certain voices on the topic. Can we now trust his?
THAT is the point. Not whether Jews or Muslims are more deserving of life.
0
Posted on 10/12/25 at 9:38 am to thenza
quote:
It isn’t an issue of his stance. It’s an issue of integrity.
Provided he is truthful in his reporting and believes what he says, I don't question his integrity.
I have no doubt that Murray hates Islam and it's impact on the west as much as he says.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 9:49 am to thenza
Is he a journalist? I always thought of him as more of a commentator.
The guy wrote a book about the slow death of Europe due to Islam migration. It’s not really surprising that’s he’d be hardcore on the side that Islam wants to wipe off the earth.
The guy wrote a book about the slow death of Europe due to Islam migration. It’s not really surprising that’s he’d be hardcore on the side that Islam wants to wipe off the earth.
This post was edited on 10/12/25 at 9:51 am
Posted on 10/12/25 at 9:56 am to thenza
Murray just evaporated into the Israel talks. Its become boring....Shapiro the same thing.
I support Israel over Hamas but man the obsession with Israel has become weird and I dont find Israelis care at all about the average American.
Im tired of supporting countries that would NEVER return the favor and outright expect support.
I support Israel over Hamas but man the obsession with Israel has become weird and I dont find Israelis care at all about the average American.
Im tired of supporting countries that would NEVER return the favor and outright expect support.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 10:01 am to stuntman
quote:
I'm still a fan of his on most other issues, but he's an Israel firster too.
If one is MAGA or pro-America, does an Israel Firster consider that one to be anti-Semite?
Posted on 10/12/25 at 10:03 am to thenza
quote:
Now, he’s apparently been a speechwriter for the Israeli government for some time now. And didn’t disclose
It was exceptionally blatant that he was on the take for Israel financially.
I also think a lot of the Israel Derangement Syndrome are on the take from Qatar, Hamas, etc.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 10:04 am to Gifman
quote:
The way he debated Dave Smith was pathetic. He basically challenged Smith’s credentials to speak about Gaza and Israel instead of debating him.
It’s a lazy and cheap way to avoid debating on substance.
I think Murray knew the issue was complex and gray rather than black and white so instead of having to grant points Israel wouldn’t accept he took the cowards way out.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 10:30 am to St Augustine
quote:
Is he a journalist? I always thought of him as more of a commentator.
Yes, he's authored numerous books and writes for the NY post, and was doing so long before making the rounds on YouTube as a political commentator was a thing.
His entire schtick is anti-islam, whether it's discussing the Gaza conflict or the self imposed destruction of England.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 10:35 am to tide06
quote:
I think Murray knew the issue was complex and gray rather than black and white so instead of having to grant points Israel wouldn’t accept he took the cowards way out.
I think that people like Murray, Shapiro, or Cruz are contractually obligated not to give an inch on Israel doing anything bad ever.
In that debate Smith gave that Hamas was awful, Oct 7 was a tragedy, and that Israel had the right to respond… thus giving Murray an off ramp to find common ground, but it almost seemed like he was incapable of taking it.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 12:06 pm to 3nOut
quote:
In that debate Smith gave that Hamas was awful, Oct 7 was a tragedy, and that Israel had the right to respond… thus giving Murray an off ramp to find common ground, but it almost seemed like he was incapable of taking it.
Hence the disappointment in this being leaked. To be strongly in favor of Israel is one thing. I get that. I’ve said before that Murray isn’t totally wrong in his stance.
But to “debate” the way he did. To not give a single inch. And to hear he’s paid by one side. It ends his credibility. He’s no different than the reporters who ran with Russia-gate.
Most of you agree with his stance, so you’re giving him the benefit of the doubt. And maybe that’s warranted. I don’t know everything about global politics. I’m just a simpleton from the south. I suspect you’d be outraged if it were Rachel Maddow or Joe Scarborough.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 1:22 pm to thenza
quote:
But to say you’re a journalist and be that involved on the inside. That’s tough for me to reconcile.
Agreed.
That’s a huge conflict of interest.
ETA: I’m an OG fan of Murray.
This post was edited on 10/12/25 at 1:23 pm
Posted on 10/12/25 at 1:29 pm to dgnx6
quote:
If disliking Islam makes you Israel first, does disliking Israel make you Islam first?
According to the logic, yep.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 1:59 pm to Gifman
quote:
The way he debated Dave Smith was pathetic. He basically challenged Smith’s credentials to speak about Gaza and Israel instead of debating him.
It was an awkward appearance, but Murray was making a broader point directly to Joe Rogan, whom he considers a good friend.
Yes, everyone can have an opinion on any topic and is free to give it, but not everyone who has an opinion is well versed in the topic. Why would Joe bring Smith on to give his opinion on a topic they all admitted was complicated even though Smith’s knowledge was very limited, even though hos opinion was strong.
Is there an ethical responsibility for a large platform to use balance and caution in presenting views on a very hot topic with huge moral implications?
Murray thinks so, and I tend to agree with him, even as I admit I don’t know exactly where the line should be drawn, or where extra caution is required.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 2:28 pm to tide06
It was the right approach because Smith is completely ignorant and does nothing but repeat falsehoods. Murray just fumbled the execution of how to do it properly.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 2:35 pm to thenza
I lsten to Douglas Murray on the topic of Britain's Decline, EU Globalism, and War on the West..
Voila, problem solved.
Voila, problem solved.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 2:47 pm to Madking
quote:
It was the right approach because Smith is completely ignorant and does nothing but repeat falsehoods. Murray just fumbled the execution of how to do it properly.
It’s very easy to humiliate someone who is unprepared and ignorant. JD Vance puts on master classes on how to do that all the time.
That’s not what was going on here.
Murray is a paid agent of the state of Israel. He didn’t want to address the realities of the war in Gaza so he flipped the table and rage quit rather than wade into a debate in which he knew he would have to acknowledge facts his employer wouldn’t accept him acknowledging.
“If you can’t pound the facts pound the table”.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 3:15 pm to tide06
“If you can’t pound the facts pound the table”.
You just described Smiths debate style to a T
You just described Smiths debate style to a T
Posted on 10/12/25 at 3:57 pm to Madking
You’re lying.
Just kidding. That’s just the perfect response to use back at you.
You are, however, completely wrong. I suspect just ill-informed. I would seriously suggest giving his podcast a few listens. You might change your mind about him.
Just kidding. That’s just the perfect response to use back at you.
You are, however, completely wrong. I suspect just ill-informed. I would seriously suggest giving his podcast a few listens. You might change your mind about him.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 4:03 pm to thenza
quote:
I have no problem with a person taking a stance either way on the Gaza issue. It’s complicated and both sides are right and wrong.
Not really. Hamas launched a brutal surprise attack on Israel, slaughtering innocents and taking hostages. Hamas should have received everything they have received and more. The inhabitants of Gaza should be pushed into the sea or other countries, and the land sowed with salt and sulphur. Islam is a death cult and Hamas is one of its vanguards. All that Hamas understands, or will ever understand, is the sword. That is their language, and it should be spoken to them so that they will understand it.
Posted on 10/12/25 at 4:07 pm to thenza
I’ve been knowing about him since he was on legion of skanks. The guy is a fraud, he did ok debating low level loud mouths but as soon as he stepped up a weight class he started getting 1st round TKO’d because all of his “facts” were debunked. He basically traffics if hyperbolic propaganda and is now getting embarrassed every time he debates someone.
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