re: Structural/Systemic Injustice

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The Sandy story was used to draw the reader in

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Emotion over practical solution?

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Some upper income urban dwellers, for example, may be aware that their decisions to buy condominiums in renovated center city buildings contributes to processes that displace lower income renters like Sandy. No one can say, however, that their decisions and actions have directly caused Sandy's landlord to sell the building to a condo developer, thus necessitating Sandy's apartment search."

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How is this an injustice?

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How is this an injustice?

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Based on the OP poster's opinion, emotion, rather than factual injustice, is the driver

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I’m not of the belief that it is necessarily government’s role to solve these things,

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In a perfect world, everybody would go to church and actually be a Christian. And the church would be able to take care of its people. In my opinion, none of these problems would exist if we all followed the teachings of Jesus Christ. I’m not preaching from my high horse- I suck too. I just believe that our “systemic” problems come from selfishness, laziness, and greed.

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A child born into the bottom 20% of household incomes has only about a 1 in 10 chance of reaching the top 20% as an adult.

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I’m surprised it’s that high. But, do the 9/10 that don’t make it- is that through no fault of their own?

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Around 40% of children born in poverty remain poor as adults

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Through no fault of their own?

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Why do you think this number is going up?

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Statistics can and are manipulated to support a narrative. But, let’s say they’re accurate. Lots of reasons. Affirmative action, lower college admission standards, lower expectations and standards across most institutions, reverse discrimination, etc.

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I think there is a lot of danger to telling people they are disadvantaged and can’t succeed,

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Not as much danger as there is in telling a ditch digger he can be an astronaut- and then lowering standards and expectations in the grown up version of “no child left behind” to ensure his “success” at the expense of the more qualified.

Life is harder for some than others. All that means is some have to try harder. There are no excuses- only successes and failures. I came from nothing- poor white trash. I recognized that I didn’t want to live like that. I analyzed the situation and made the necessary (and feasible) adjustments. I’m now doing quite well. My children will hopefully do much better. If you live in poverty, in America, you have no one to blame but yourself.

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Reality is a lot of people, mostly poor, don’t have access to high speed internet so in some cases it further exacerbates the problem.

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But they can get it through advancements in tech like star link. Where in some of these low income areas or rural areas they don’t have as many options for high speed internet.

Maybe some years ago it wasn’t even an option in a lot of areas.

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Based on the OP poster's opinion, emotion, rather than factual injustice, is the driver
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How did you draw this conclusion? I haven't referenced emotion at all.

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Because of repeated statements like this:
"mistakes that make her deserving of losing her housing."

or even this ... "lots of people still don't have affordable housing."

Define "affordable housing" unemotionally.

Even as expensive as things currently are (IMO we are probably in a housing bubble) in housing, US median home prices run ~$190/sq. ft. That's juxtaposed against $83,700/yr median HH income. In Europe median apt prices are ~ €339/sq. ft. ($390/sq. ft.). Meanwhile, median HH income there runs about $55K/yr. So housing costs in the US run less than half what it runs in Europe, while HH income here is 1 1/2 x more. Those are the simple facts.

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"mistakes that make her deserving of losing her housing."

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I'm not claiming she deserves to lose her housing. How are you calling me emotional for pointing out the arguments others are making?

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or even this ... "lots of people still don't have affordable housing."

Define "affordable housing" unemotionally.

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housing a person can reasonably afford in their community.

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Even as expensive as things currently are (IMO we are probably in a housing bubble) in housing, US median home prices run ~$190/sq. ft. That's juxtaposed against $83,700/yr median HH income. In Europe median apt prices are ~ €339/sq. ft. ($390/sq. ft.). Meanwhile, median HH income there runs about $55K/yr. So housing costs in the US run less than half what it runs in Europe, while HH income here is 1 1/2 x more. Those are the simple facts.

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Price per square foot doesn't determine what is affordable. The relationship between local incomes and local housing costs determines affordable housing. Affordability can't be applied globally. What is affordable in NYC relative to average incomes is likely not affordable for most of the rest of the country. Also simple facts.

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Our systems are flawed because the people who developed and perpetuate them are also flawed.

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Which systems are flawed? In what ways? Perhaps I should have been more specific in my earlier post. I blame:

Selfishness- across the board. This applies to all of us. Im not excluded. Neither are you. Whether it’s that we want more than we need/deserve, or we’re unwilling to share what we have- this hits home for all of us at some point. But that doesn’t excuse…

Laziness- 2 Thessalonians 3:6-12
6 Now we command you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is walking in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us. 7 For you yourselves know how you ought to imitate us, because we were not idle when we were with you, 8 nor did we eat anyone's bread without paying for it, but with toil and labor we worked night and day, that we might not be a burden to any of you. 9 It was not because we do not have that right, but to give you in ourselves an example to imitate. 10 For even when we were with you, we would give you this command: If anyone is not willing to work, let him not eat. 11 For we hear that some among you walk in idleness, not busy at work, but busybodies. 12 Now such persons we command and encourage in the Lord Jesus Christ to do their work quietly and to earn their own living.[d]

I don’t think that really needs an explanation, but since it’s you, I feel compelled.

We have an epidemic of able-bodied men and women of working age that refuse to work. Do you disagree? Im an electrician. I do a lot of work in low income areas (I also do a lot of work in high income areas— I do a lot of work). I see this firsthand, everyday. It used to infuriate me. Now, it saddens me. They are literally throwing their lives away. Are they being taken advantage of? Yes. Against their will? No.

Greed- 1 Timothy 6:10
English Standard Version
10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils. It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs.

Akin to selfishness, but geared more towards the control side of the situation. While it infects the rich and the poor, it is much more pronounced in the rich; as it drives the rich to do things to their fellow man that the poor will never have the opportunity to. Like, for example, to create and sustain a welfare system and destroy the family unit in order to gain a lifelong loyal voter base and remain in power. I assume this is your particular area of focus when discussing these perceived systemic injustices and oppression.

You’re not wrong, but I think you’re missing the fact that this isn’t forced- it requires willing participation from both parties. Neither party is excused by the other’s behavior, and neither party is solely responsible for the other’s behavior. It takes two to tango. If at any time either partner excuses themselves- the dance is over.

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You started this post talking about how we all need to be more Christ-like!

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We do. All of us. It’s the only way to fix all of our problems. I’m not on my high horse. I suck pretty bad at it (execution) most of the time. But the point is, that if we all were- there would be a lot less selfishness, laziness, and greed. No man made (secular) system is going to be anywhere near as effective as living by the acronym WWJD.

Is it just to confiscate the fruit of one’s labor and give it to another?