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Started By
Message
re: My problem with the Trump wall: it's solving an imaginary problem
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:55 am to mmmmmbeeer
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:55 am to mmmmmbeeer
quote:False premise. The cost of feeding, educating and providing medical care to poor and unskilled immigrants, both legal and illegal, is more than keeping them out.
On this board, you're dealing with faux-conservatives, not real conservatives. A lot of these guys are nothing more than Trump cultists. Showing a 75% decrease in a "problem" with a reasonable budget is not seen as success to faux-conservatives. They would prefer we spend billions more and literally have military families' lives frequently disturbed to go sit in a fricking desert to watch for something that is already under control. Incredible how these deficit hawks change their tunes when it's Dear Leader wanting to spend the money.
Now, I'm all having no wall or border security at all as long as you're willing to take every single benefit that immigrants of all types receive. That means no welfare, no food stamps, and no education for their children. That way they only people that are coming in are the productive ones who can provide for themselves and immediately contribute to society. Or perhaps a good kind hearted person or organization would be willing to sponsor these unfortunate souls until they can take care of themselves. Deal?
2
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:55 am to Zach
quote:
1. I think that number is a huge problem.
Well fortunately for you it is trending downward without a wall
quote:
How do we know the actual number isn't much larger?
How do we know anything?
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:55 am to Powerman
quote:
There is literally no other facet in your life where absolute zero is a logical acceptable outcome
Why do you apply it here?
and even it it were possible, we'd essentially have to become East Berlin to make it happen. Is that really what people want?
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:55 am to Powerman
quote:
There is literally no other facet in your life where absolute zero is a logical acceptable outcome
So let’s just stop trying.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:55 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
75% decrease trend
When you selectively pick 2000 to say a 75% decrease trend and act as though that’s going to continue and ignore the trends from 2010 forward which suggest it’s leveled out, that’s not exactly being intellectually honest. Current levels are still too high and the trend does not suggest that number is going to continue dropping at a 75% rate.
This post was edited on 4/5/18 at 9:56 am
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:56 am to Damone
I don't understand why people get up in arms about a wall when we already have walls and fences. If walls and fences don't work then why do they exist?
It's just political BS from the left. They've supported walls and fences in the past and now they don't because of #resist.
It's pathetic.
Having said that, I'm only for walls and fences where the DHS thinks they need them and not a border to border wall. I'd prefer that anyone hiring illegals be punished severely but good luck getting the lefties to go along with that.
It's just political BS from the left. They've supported walls and fences in the past and now they don't because of #resist.
It's pathetic.
Having said that, I'm only for walls and fences where the DHS thinks they need them and not a border to border wall. I'd prefer that anyone hiring illegals be punished severely but good luck getting the lefties to go along with that.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:56 am to Powerman
quote:
Powerman
No offense, but you're a fricking idiot.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:57 am to Powerman
quote:
How do we know anything?
We dont and your numbers are most likely way off and there hasnt been a 75% decrease. Build the wall with M
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:57 am to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
The cost of feeding, educating and providing medical care to poor and unskilled immigrants, both legal and illegal, is more than keeping them out.
Certainly at some point there is a law of diminishing returns
If the illegal crossings dropped to 50K a year for instance would that number be acceptable? Or would you think that we would still need to ramp up costs and efforts? What about 10K? 5K? At some point you don't get any value in using more resources to keep illegals out.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:58 am to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Now, I'm all having no wall or border security at all as long as you're willing to take every single benefit that immigrants of all types receive. That means no welfare, no food stamps, and no education for their children. That way they only people that are coming in are the productive ones who can provide for themselves and immediately contribute to society. Or perhaps a good kind hearted person or organization would be willing to sponsor these unfortunate souls until they can take care of themselves. Deal?
They don't get those things, certainly not in any impactful sense. This is truly a big ole red herring propagated by right wing media pundits whose one goal in life is to piss you off to make you want to listen to them more.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:58 am to SDVTiger
quote:
We dont and your numbers are most likely way off and there hasnt been a 75% decrease.
So it's wrong because you just declared it to be wrong out of thin air?
frick it, while we're at it what else do you feel like making up?
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:58 am to roadGator
quote:
I'd prefer that anyone hiring illegals be punished severely but good luck getting the lefties to go along with that.
And those sorts of punishments can be eased when a democrat takes office. It’s a lot harder to send construction crews to the border to dismantle a wall and tacitly admit you want to allow illegals in.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:59 am to Powerman
quote:
How do we know anything?
Logic. If we identify 1,000 illegals in a city then we know that a LOT more than 1,000 illegals exist in the city. Hell, the shooting arrest rate in Shreveport is about 20%.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 9:59 am to Powerman
quote:
If the illegal crossings dropped to 50K a year for instance would that number be acceptable? Or would you think that we would still need to ramp up costs and efforts? What about 10K? 5K? At some point you don't get any value in using more resources to keep illegals out.
1. We can cross that bridge when we come to it.
2. The real solution is to eliminate the incentive for the leeches among them to come here but for now we need to keep the ones that are trying to come out and deport the ones that are already here.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 10:00 am to Powerman
quote:
My problem with the Trump wall: it's solving an imaginary problem
Um, this..
quote:does not =
Illegal crossings already lowest since 1971
quote:
imaginary problem
That's like saying "I have cancer but it's been reduced by 70%". Sure, that's good news, but you still have Cancer. I take note that your link wisely didn't apply raw numbers to the explanation. So, I looked them up.
quote:I recall a comedian once pointing out that a guy described Prep H as "shrinking swelling and he brought his hands from 2 feet apart to 1 foot apart. Comedian paraphrased said, "if 2 feet is your problem, 1 foot ain't no solution".
Illegal border crossings in the year 2017 : 310,531
quote:On what planet is 310K "solved"?
Trump is trying to solve a problem that has already been solved
"My wife used to cheat on me with 10 guys, now, she only fricks 2 of them..........solved!!!!"
Posted on 4/5/18 at 10:00 am to Jack Bauers HnK
Very true. I should add that there are interests on both sides of the aisle that don't want to see heavy fines for employers hiring invaders.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 10:00 am to ShortyRob
quote:
"My wife used to cheat on me with 10 guys, now, she only fricks 2 of them..........solved!!!!"
It's probably still 10
Posted on 4/5/18 at 10:00 am to Powerman
quote:
Certainly at some point there is a law of diminishing returns
Agree. But at 300,000 still coming annually, there’s still a lot of value in dropping this number more.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 10:03 am to Powerman
quote:Then you're fundamentally stupid. I mean, I don't know what else to say about that.
With a country of over 320 million people I don't consider it to be much of a problem
Over 10 years, we're talking 3 Million crossings which equals a bunch more sudden new "citizens" as a result of births. Almost all still located in a subset of states.
quote:
It's the trend that is important. The numbers are already trending downward without a wall and have been doing so for over a decade
The trend has literally nothing to do with any "solution" that's been imposed. There's nothing intrinsically keeping the number for being 2 million next year again. The driving factors have simply shifted. Were they to revert, the numbers would increase again.
Posted on 4/5/18 at 10:03 am to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
But at 300,000 still coming annually, there’s still a lot of value in dropping this number more.
And if the number continues to trend down as it has for the last decade naturally?
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