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Started By
Message
re: Is anyone here not happy that Maduro was removed?
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:50 am to lepdagod
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:50 am to lepdagod
quote:
Don’t be naive… every Venezuelan not welcoming us as liberators… history has showed us this
We will see. I don’t suspect you will see much hostile opposition to whatever sort of “occupying” we will do there, if any. This is the big difference in S America/Latin America and a place like the Middle East.
1
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:54 am to Y.A. Tittle
quote:
This is the big difference in S America/Latin America and a place like the Middle East.
Explain this difference… I keep seeing people say this… are the SA people more meek and willing to be ruled by an occupying force ???
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:56 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Removing Saddam and Ghaddafi were also great...in isolation.
quote:
Saddam
Yes. While he was the US's mechanism to bleed Iraq in the 80s, he had become a liability by the 90s when he invaded Kuwait.
quote:
Ghaddafi
No. He had already become friendlier (and more valuable) to the US and West relative to extreme Islam and its foot soldiers. Removing him was a mistake from the very start, pure and simple.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:57 am to Nosevens
quote:Or ... just maybe ... playing here is a form of recreation for SFP, and (as a self-employed person) he is able to schedule his day in such a way as to have time for BOTH recreation and meeting his clients' needs.
supposed lawyer who spends his time this heavily on social media, ... his time is not spent on clients needs.
Unlike (apparently) you, not everyone has a supervisor standing over his shoulder, controlling what he can do and when.
Crazy thought, right?
This post was edited on 1/4/26 at 11:03 am
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:57 am to lepdagod
quote:
are the SA people more meek and willing to be ruled by an occupying force ???
Not necessarily. I’m just not sure there is any fervent support for the status quo, as there rarely is there. You believe otherwise?
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:58 am to lepdagod
quote:But, but, but ... they are CATHOLICS, so they are just better people.quote:Explain this difference… I keep seeing people say this… are the SA people more meek and willing to be ruled by an occupying force ???
This is the big difference in S America/Latin America and a place like the Middle East.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 10:59 am to RelentlessAnalysis
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:00 am to lepdagod
quote:
Explain this difference… I keep seeing people say this
They shy away from doing anything except bringing up Muslims.
Central/South America has traditionally been an area of dictators and strongmen vacillating power. And this has been the case LITERALLY from the conflict of Cortez and the Aztecs
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:02 am to Y.A. Tittle
quote:
You believe otherwise?
I believe people will group up with people they don’t necessarily agree with on domestic issues …against an outside entity…
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:03 am to SlowFlowPro
I actually don't believe either one was great to remove in isolation or otherwise.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:08 am to lepdagod
quote:Because the underlying social fault lines are different. Sectarian violence isn’t about temperament or “meekness,” it’s about how power, identity, and legitimacy are structured.
Explain this difference… I keep seeing people say this… are the SA people more meek and willing to be ruled by an occupying force ???
South America is comparatively religiously homogeneous. The overwhelming majority of the population is Catholic or post-Catholic, with differences that are cultural rather than theological. There aren’t rival religious systems with mutually exclusive truth claims competing for state control. That alone removes one of the most explosive variables.
Ethnicity in South America is also highly blended. Centuries of intermarriage blurred rigid tribal or sect identities. You still get class conflict, race issues, and regionalism, but they don’t map cleanly onto sacred identity in a way that turns political disputes into holy wars.
It's not that South Americans are more submissive. It’s that they lack the combustible mix of sacred identity, zero-sum theology, and externally reinforced sectarian fault lines that make violence self-sustaining in parts of the Middle East.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:09 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Central/South America has traditionally been an area of dictators and strongmen vacillating power. And this has been the case LITERALLY from the conflict of Cortez and the Aztecs
Yes, and it rarely involves a lot of fervent militarized rousing of the populace, who more often seem conditioned to just go along to get along.
You believe any “occupying” we might do in Venezuela will face a lot of hostile opposition?
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:10 am to Bourre
quote:I have a history of advocating sensible, centrist positions that SEEM "leftwing" to a Far Right wingnut.
You have a long history of taking up leftwing positions.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:11 am to lepdagod
quote:
Explain this difference… I keep seeing people say this… are the SA people more meek and willing to be ruled by an occupying force ???
I don’t want speak for YA but I think the big difference between the ME and SA is having a history of understanding what democracy is. Countries in the ME, outside of Israel, had no concept of how democracies work. That was the problem with trying to nation-build in the ME. We were trying to introduce a completely new political system to a tribal society that valued religion and alliances over rule of law.
In contrast, SA countries have an understanding of what democracy means and aren’t as tribal as ME societies. That doesn’t mean some SA countries practiced democracy very well in the past or currently but they were at least introduced to it and understand it as a political system. Venezuela, in particular, was a thriving democracy 25-30 years ago. There are a lot of people in the population and in exile who know how to run a government based on constitutional principles
I think that’s the difference when comparing the 2 situations
This post was edited on 1/4/26 at 11:18 am
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:11 am to lurking
quote:
I’m reserving final judgment until we get more clarity on what comes next. As of this morning, I’m happy.
I think this sums up how most rational people feel.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:13 am to RelentlessAnalysis
quote:
I have a history of advocating sensible, centrist positions that SEEM "leftwing" to a Far Right wingnut
Sure, PedoHank, sure. Your support for pedos and drag queen story time aren’t the centrist positions you think they are
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:14 am to Y.A. Tittle
quote:"Hostile?" Possibly, especially from the ardant supporters of PSUV.
You believe any “occupying” we might do in Venezuela will face a lot of hostile opposition?
Armed/military? Probably not.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:16 am to RelentlessAnalysis
Hank, why don’t you say hello any longer?
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:17 am to Bourre
I would say it is more a combination of having some “understanding of what democracy is” coupled with a historic willingness to just generally go along with whatever “strongman” may be in power (or just generally perceived to be in power) at the time.
Posted on 1/4/26 at 11:18 am to Zach
quote:
The timing was perfect for me since I recently watched a long interview with an econ professor who fled Venezuela. Not knowing about Trump's plan he stated that if Venezuela ever became a free market democracy again it would become the strongest ecnomy in S. America. They have oil, sea ports, agricultural land and a lot of college educated professionals living abroad who may return home to help rebuild.
I visited Caracas for 3 days in 1987. It was awesome. Great restaurants, nice hotels, inexpensive. Took the cable car from downtown up to the top of the mountain between the city and the sea, where there were more nice restaurants. I felt safe walking between my hotel and restaurants. I didn't make it to Margarita Island, but I have heard it's beautiful. It's close to Curacao. My vacation was actually when I was living in the Dom. Rep. Flew from Santo Domingo, to Curacao, then Caracas. Caracas and Margarita Island could absolutely become an awesome tourist destination for Americans. I hope it does.
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