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Message
re: Interesting how "Evangelicals" are separating themselves from "Protestants".
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:06 pm to Champagne
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:06 pm to Champagne
quote:
We know that Protestants will never concede the point because of the Bible passage disparaging "man-made" tradition, so Protestants must "shoe-horn" Sacred Tradition into that Bible passage.
That's a very deceitful thing to do.
Also you:
quote:
Could we stop accusing, judging and ridiculing EOC and RCC doctrine around here please?
2
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:17 pm to EphesianArmor
quote:
Everything Jesus uttered was divine. Though we can be sure not every bit of wisdom or instruction was recorded -- unless He and our Father wanted them recorded.
Quite a bit of His instruction and wisdom was conferred and dispersed throughout the Old Testament and by His Apostles in the NT.
If the teachings were recorded, how can we be certain that all have made their way into the various translations?
Fascinating to think about what it was like for the Apostles to travel to the ends of civilization passing on the teachings of Jesus from just their memory and their notes, and ultimately how that came to form the canon of Scripture over the next few centuries.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:24 pm to Flats
quote:
Flats
While that is funny, we do have alot of Catholic bashing threads in the PT.
And I almost entirely sure its because we've got a frick ton of Baptists in the South
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:27 pm to GumboPot
I love these discussions. Catholicism is an absolute other world all together for me. I don't understand it. Most of it seems made up. Little of it prioritizes Christ. It's exactly what I expect a man made organization would look like over 1800 years.
Protestants are wild. Seems like anybody and everybody starts their own church. Some are more established...Methodist, Lutheran, etc.
Evangelicals I believe are those denoms that prioritize evangelism. I always believed it included Baptist, Pentos, etc.
Way I understood it is all Evangelicals are Protestant but not all Protestants are Evangelicals.
Protestants are wild. Seems like anybody and everybody starts their own church. Some are more established...Methodist, Lutheran, etc.
Evangelicals I believe are those denoms that prioritize evangelism. I always believed it included Baptist, Pentos, etc.
Way I understood it is all Evangelicals are Protestant but not all Protestants are Evangelicals.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:32 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
Not true. The first protestants were catholics who were trying to reform the catholic church. They initially had no intention of leaving. But when the catholic leaders cared more about money and influence than they did biblical truth, the reformers left, as they should have.
Fantastic.
When did this happen?
Where did this happen?
And, how did this happen?
quote:
Splitting in and of itself is not unbiblical
Where in the Bible does it say Jesus wanted his Church divided into thousands?
quote:
The office of pope is a stupid notion and this history of the office is littered with contradiction both internally and with conciliarism
Every Christian must agree that Jesus named Simon Peter as the head of His church. Saying that’s stupid is heretical.
quote:
The catholic church does all sorts of unbiblical things based on "tradition" which they wrongly claim is equal to scripture itself which is a hilariously laughable notion
Name them, and I can give you chapter and verse even limited to your mangled and amputated bible.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:38 pm to EphesianArmor
quote:
He certainly did.
When Jesus Ascended to Heaven, there was no New Testament. The authors of the New Testament were guided by the Holy Spirit when they decided to later write it. I mention this just to clarify.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:39 pm to DiamondDog
quote:
Protestants are wild. Seems like anybody and everybody starts their own church. Some are more established...Methodist, Lutheran, etc.
Evangelicals I believe are those denoms that prioritize evangelism. I always believed it included Baptist, Pentos, etc.
Way I understood it is all Evangelicals are Protestant but not all Protestants are Evangelicals.
That makes sense!
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:39 pm to GumboPot
As someone who grew up Protestant, non-denominational, lost my faith around age 21 and only came back to Christ on Aug 29th of this year...I've been feeling a pull to explore Catholicism and Orthodoxy. I'm so sick of all of the division in Protestantism, not to mention how Calvinism, although they prefer the label of "Reformed" because they don't like to be up front with their belief systems because they wouldn't be able to bring new members into their churches that way, but how much Calvinism has spread throughout Protestant denominations & churches.
Calvinism is probably the single most heretical thing I've ever read & I find it more morally repugnant than Communism.
But I'm going to an Intro to Othrodoxy class this Tuesday, have a meeting with a Protestant Pastor I met through a friend and really like on Wed, and I will be going to my first Orthodox service this Sunday. Now, I've just got to find a Catholic church to try the following week.
Calvinism is probably the single most heretical thing I've ever read & I find it more morally repugnant than Communism.
But I'm going to an Intro to Othrodoxy class this Tuesday, have a meeting with a Protestant Pastor I met through a friend and really like on Wed, and I will be going to my first Orthodox service this Sunday. Now, I've just got to find a Catholic church to try the following week.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:40 pm to EphesianArmor
quote:
We believe it alone is His instruction manual to be shared on faith, encouragement, living and enduring until we enter His Kingdom.
Yes, I understand what you believe. I respect that. I'm not trying to convert you or anyone. I'm just explaining the Doctrine of Sacred Tradition. If you don't believe it, that's fine with me.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:48 pm to gaetti15
GenX here and I’ve gotten to the point where the only music I want to hear in mass is Gregorian Chant, except when we’re leaving. I’m down if we just walked in with it, and went to communion with it. I listen to it in my house when I pray or read the Bible, and it soothes me. So good to put you in a state of prayer and reflection which is really what you’re supposed to be doing in those parts anyway.
I’m tired of girls as altar boys, and people in blue jeans giving out communion. Heck, I’m even cool if the priest faces the other way while blessing the Eucharist. Give me some incense and bells. It’s ok for it all to be mysterious - it’s a mystery after all.
Let us just talk along with the priest when it’s our turn. Why on earth am I trying to sing soprano with the responsorial psalm?
My church sings EVERYTHING. I just find the reciting part to be melodic in and of itself.
That said, I just left mass and some girl who was probably young enough for me to have birthed was in a full on veil and knelt on the floor when receiving communion. And I thought the same. That was definitely not what I was doing in college. I’m not that old school - but returning to some more traditional stuff would be good, I think.
I’m tired of girls as altar boys, and people in blue jeans giving out communion. Heck, I’m even cool if the priest faces the other way while blessing the Eucharist. Give me some incense and bells. It’s ok for it all to be mysterious - it’s a mystery after all.
Let us just talk along with the priest when it’s our turn. Why on earth am I trying to sing soprano with the responsorial psalm?
My church sings EVERYTHING. I just find the reciting part to be melodic in and of itself.
That said, I just left mass and some girl who was probably young enough for me to have birthed was in a full on veil and knelt on the floor when receiving communion. And I thought the same. That was definitely not what I was doing in college. I’m not that old school - but returning to some more traditional stuff would be good, I think.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:49 pm to Flats
Flats, I'm sorry that you took my post like it was an attack and an accusation of any person of being a person that is a deceitful person.
What I mean to say is that we may proclaim our interpretation of a particular Bible passage. But there is often an alternate interpretation that is reasonable. When a person continues to ignore that the reasonable alternative exists and insists that their interpretation is the only possible interpretation, that seems deceitful to me. The better word for me to use may have been "disingenuous."
What I mean to say is that we may proclaim our interpretation of a particular Bible passage. But there is often an alternate interpretation that is reasonable. When a person continues to ignore that the reasonable alternative exists and insists that their interpretation is the only possible interpretation, that seems deceitful to me. The better word for me to use may have been "disingenuous."
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:50 pm to Wednesday
Look into what is called The Liturgy of the Hours. You might find it to be interesting.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:53 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
A remnant of Christ’s Church will always remain. The Reformed Protestants will continue on.
I understand your point of view here, and I respect it. Although I disagree, I feel no need to ridicule or attack.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 6:59 pm to PastorJ
quote:
You're right, we should certainly look, for moral guidance and religious instruction, to a man who blesses a block of ice and embraces woke ideology.
Jesus took the five loaves and two fish, looked up toward heaven, and blessed them. Then, breaking the loaves into pieces, he kept giving the bread and fish to the disciples so they could distribute it to the people.
And yet you follow a man who blessed bread and fish?
Blessing people and things like a day of the week or a container for the commandments is extremely biblical.
quote:
Evangelicals we need to hold fast to the truth of the Word
Did the Spirit lead you to read the Bible independently and inspire you to these beliefs?
Or were you instructed by men whose beliefs are at most 500 years old, or often enough only a few decades?
Posted on 10/5/25 at 7:06 pm to GumboPot
What makes sense is that in a time where Christians of all stripes are facing both an organized religious threat from Islam and an secular political threat from godless progressivism that many are looking for a strong faith, strong traditions to help them out in a world geared against them and community that the Church provides.
I think this is why so many are exploring Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy Catholicism. Both provide these things but I think Orthodoxy does a better job of the first two, tradition and a strong faith....
Faith is a gift...it's important to understand this. Today's readings were about being crushed, as in the way a grape is crushed to make wine. That's a big part of what the living Gospel is about. God says to be patient. The vein that struggles makes the fruit and thus the best wine.
Protestants use to be a focused on this, the strong faith as a way of life. Lately, many of the mainline denominations of the protestant sect have moved toward the world and away from the idea that we must hold firm to the Word of God.
Roman Catholicism is facing this too but thanks be to God so far we have seen most of the 1970s ideas start to fade out and a return to a faith of the Word, life of the Gospel and love of tradition.
One thing I will say is that protestants do a better job of making the community into something deeper. I have always felt that the RC church would do well to create more opportunity for the faithful to come together, like in Sunday School or Wednesday services where we can act as a community. Too many Roman Catholics are in and out of Mass and do nothing outside of that. My parish has started to do Sunday School for kids, I'd like to see this expanded to young adults and married men and women.
I think this is why so many are exploring Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy Catholicism. Both provide these things but I think Orthodoxy does a better job of the first two, tradition and a strong faith....
Faith is a gift...it's important to understand this. Today's readings were about being crushed, as in the way a grape is crushed to make wine. That's a big part of what the living Gospel is about. God says to be patient. The vein that struggles makes the fruit and thus the best wine.
Protestants use to be a focused on this, the strong faith as a way of life. Lately, many of the mainline denominations of the protestant sect have moved toward the world and away from the idea that we must hold firm to the Word of God.
Roman Catholicism is facing this too but thanks be to God so far we have seen most of the 1970s ideas start to fade out and a return to a faith of the Word, life of the Gospel and love of tradition.
One thing I will say is that protestants do a better job of making the community into something deeper. I have always felt that the RC church would do well to create more opportunity for the faithful to come together, like in Sunday School or Wednesday services where we can act as a community. Too many Roman Catholics are in and out of Mass and do nothing outside of that. My parish has started to do Sunday School for kids, I'd like to see this expanded to young adults and married men and women.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 7:08 pm to TRUERockyTop
quote:I smell what you're stepping in brother. We commute almost an hour one way to go to our church. Not for nothing, but the average commute for parishioners at our blessed parish is just over an hour and a half. We have people that drive over 2 hours every Sunday to Divine Liturgy, so you're not being crazy thinking you should try to make the commute. As a father of 3 with a wonderful wife, we kind of like that commute: it's so hectic getting everyone ready, no matter what time service starts (our Divine Liturgy starts at 9:45 and ends at 11:45), that it's going to be chaos nonetheless, but that 1 hour drive time kind of brings every one back down to an equilibrium where we bond going to and from service. We make a day out of it.
That's wonderful news. I have found myself drawn into Orthodoxy over the last few years. I don't have any parishes within an hour drive so I haven't been able to attend a Divine Liturgy yet, but I'm hopeful that changes soon with the way our area is growing.
I was once an atheist, then agnostic for most of my life, but Holy Orthodoxy pulled it all together, glory be to God. All that to say: don't be distressed if the Holy Orthodox Church is calling you, but it's a long ways and you feel kind of foolish traveling from such long distances (I most certainly did). It is a common occurrence still while Orthodoxy is growing in the west, but you will not regret attending a Divine Liturgy (wear comfortable shoes).
quote:Absolutely. You hit the nail on the head. We long for it. Holiness doesn't go out of style. Orthodoxy is calling you - make no mistake. Make the drive. The edification is second to none. There's nothing like it. Glory to God.
I'm 35 and can only speak for myself, but anecdotally it feels like the younger generations are craving for a return to the timelessness & tradition the more that our eyes are opened to the godlessness of much of the West.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 7:19 pm to the808bass
quote:
They are what my Classical Greek professor referred to as quasi-Christian, along with 7th Day Adventists, and Jehovahs Witnesses (among others).
I don't think it's fair to lump Adventists in with the JWs, Mormons, etc.
Their silly take on the sabbath separates them from more mainstream denominations in practical, earthly ways, but theologically Adventists are pretty solid.
Other than the Mormons and Yahweh's Witnesses, I think the real kooks are the "Prosperity Gospel" types. Jesse Duplantis tells this story where Christ Himself gets depressed and comes to his office for a hug
Posted on 10/5/25 at 7:19 pm to DiamondDog
quote:
Way I understood it is all Evangelicals are Protestant but not all Protestants are Evangelicals
Bingo! Thank you.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 7:37 pm to Tom288
quote:
Calvinism is probably the single most heretical thing I've ever read & I find it more morally repugnant than Communism.
Amen to that. I didn't have the spiritual education necessary to put a name to it until pretty late in life, but when left Louisiana for college in Mississippi it was immediately obvious to me that there were some very strange things going on in those non-Catholic churches. Those people really do sit in those Baptist churches and think they're just better than everyone else because it was so ordained before time even began. If such people do engage in evangelism, it is by their own definition entirely performative in nature. If a Calvinist ever does preach the Gospel outside his own little church, or minister to the infirm or the unwashed, they're just going through the motions, by their own admission. It's a totally crazy belief system that explains so much of what is rotten about small town life in the Deep South.
Posted on 10/5/25 at 7:41 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:
Oh good lord
Do you know why I made that comment? Read my other posts and you'll start to figure it out
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