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re: Hypersonic missiles - you buying the US doesn’t have them or a defense for them?
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:16 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:16 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
Defending them I understand being much more difficult, but we might have a laser CIWS fielded by now???
we have a defense for them. it will not become public knowledge if we can avoid it, but we have a defense.
1
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:18 am to HubbaBubba
quote:
That said, we are still very vulnerable at this stage. Lots of work left to do.
That's the impression I get from an expert in the field. I get the optimism that people have because the secret squirrel world has pulled rabbits out of hats we didn't know existed before, but the MIC also produced the F35 and an F22 that starved pilots of oxygen. This hypersonic issue is a tough nut to crack.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:18 am to Yaboylsu63
Fear-mongering used to continue spending all the money on the MIC.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:18 am to AggieHank86
quote:
As a point of reference, we had the F-117 stealth fighter OPERATIONAL for almost a decade before the public became aware of it.
I can use Google Earth and count the number military aircraft on a runway Tehran.
NASA can see to the edge of time and space.
There is no telling what secret tech is being used by the IC a decade in front of civilian use.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:18 am to HubbaBubba
quote:
support a lot of scientific minds in the DoD and the physicists at Edward's, Vandenberg, China Lake, White Sands, Yuma, Redstone and the Atlantic Test Range. There is significant info that is classified and can't be addressed or even acknowledged.
However, there are multiple issues involved with tracking and interceptions of hypersonic missiles that are apparently problematic. A Hypersonic missile can travel between 1100-1200 miles in one minute. Not only that, it can also be maneuverable (hence: unpredictable). It could be programmed to fly into areas where land-based tracking systems can't see it. Even if it did, it would be so fast that a tracker can't possibly follow it fast enough before the missile is out of range.
The only way to really track and take down one is from space. Which, supposedly (wink*wink), is illegal, as space weapons are forbidden by treaty. So how can they be tracked and stay within the confines of our space weapons treaty?
In short, an effective missile would employ stealth technologies and make it difficult, if not almost impossible to track and intercept, but the achilles heel (there is one) of these is a physics phenomenon that DoD research (at Redstone Arsenal) has discovered and that is what would be exploited by sensors on satellites to track, triangulate and employ both air and ground-based systems to intercept these missiles. I can't tell you what it is, but I know that it is an amazing discovery that creates a signature so strong that it's a weakness we are able to exploit not only in tracking, but in how to avoid it in our own missiles.
100% this
quote:
That said, we are still very vulnerable at this stage. Lots of work left to do.
yes still lots of work, but i am about 99% sure we are very very far along on this. much further along that we are ackowledging and it should stay that away.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:20 am to Flats
quote:
That's the impression I get from an expert in the field. I get the optimism that people have because the secret squirrel world has pulled rabbits out of hats we didn't know existed before, but the MIC also produced the F35 and an F22 that starved pilots of oxygen. This hypersonic issue is a tough nut to crack.
i mean the f22 is based on late 1980s and very early 1990s tech and design
we do have work to do, but are much further along with the satallite tech than we let on.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:25 am to lsu777
quote:
i mean the f22 is based on late 1980s and very early 1990s tech and design
Why is that funny? I think it's embarrassing.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:29 am to Yaboylsu63
I wouldn’t be surprised if we have the technology or even a proof of concept prototype but it’s not available for mass production or use on a global scale.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:31 am to dmaginnisiv
Because every shred of empirical evidence we have proves that we have stayed decades ahead of everyone else in force projection. We spend more than the rest of the world combined. While we certainly waste more than them all combined, we also undoubtedly productively spend far more than China does. Theres no reason to believe anyone has leveled with us. There's no evidence for it. China is just now attempting to field planes and ships that can compete with our 70's airframes and whether they REALLY can compete or not is still up for debate.
We may not be as dominant as we were in the 80's and 90's, but we are still the only country who can project power globally.
We may not be as dominant as we were in the 80's and 90's, but we are still the only country who can project power globally.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:33 am to Yaboylsu63
I'm willing to bet that China and Russia don't have anything that will make a significant difference in a pro longed war.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:38 am to Flats
quote:
think it's embarrassing
Why? The planes are certainly significantly updated now versus when they first flew. We can actually forward deploy meaningful numbers of them and keep them operational. Its orders of magnitude better than the F15 in air to air combat, and the F15 is unmatched globally. We've had over 30 years to learn from that program and develop new tech.
A country who cannot field planes to compete with the F15 does not have better missile hardware than us, or ways to defeat our countermeasures for it. If China has hypersonic long range missiles, we have hyper-er sonic longer range missiles and lasers to track and shoot theirs down with.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:41 am to Yaboylsu63
quote:
Hypersonic missiles - you buying the US doesn’t have them or a defense for them?
I definitely don't think we have a defense (effective) for them.
I think we have them.
This post was edited on 8/2/22 at 11:42 am
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:53 am to Flats
quote:
Why is that funny? I think it's embarrassing.
what is embarrassing?
that the rest of the world cant compete with our 30 year old tech? or hell even the FA18 that is based on 1970s tech. hell they cant even really beat our pilots in F15s which tooks its first flight over 50 years ago.
its funny because people think we have fallen behind on tech. I mean china is just building its first air craft carriers this decade. Their so called elite subs are no match for our 60/70 era subs.
its laughable people think we have fallen behind and frankly embarrassing.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 11:54 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
Because every shred of empirical evidence we have proves that we have stayed decades ahead of everyone else in force projection. We spend more than the rest of the world combined. While we certainly waste more than them all combined, we also undoubtedly productively spend far more than China does. Theres no reason to believe anyone has leveled with us. There's no evidence for it. China is just now attempting to field planes and ships that can compete with our 70's airframes and whether they REALLY can compete or not is still up for debate.
We may not be as dominant as we were in the 80's and 90's, but we are still the only country who can project power globally.
quote:
Why? The planes are certainly significantly updated now versus when they first flew. We can actually forward deploy meaningful numbers of them and keep them operational. Its orders of magnitude better than the F15 in air to air combat, and the F15 is unmatched globally. We've had over 30 years to learn from that program and develop new tech.
A country who cannot field planes to compete with the F15 does not have better missile hardware than us, or ways to defeat our countermeasures for it. If China has hypersonic long range missiles, we have hyper-er sonic longer range missiles and lasers to track and shoot theirs down with.
:bow:Posted on 8/2/22 at 12:04 pm to lsu777
We have had the ability to track hypersonic misses since late 1999 to early 2000. We have deployed satellites since 2010. You don't really think that all these private companies pay for satellites all by themselves? After spaceX completed the first private rocket into space the company was broke. In comes the "Government" ie... Military funding and proof within 1.5 years he has billion dollar satellites in Space for internet.
Do we have the hypersonic missles? The better question is to We have some that we can atleast 90% control? Two companies come to mind that have the ability to build such a guidance system. LM and NG. Only 2 or 3 bases where they could test it. Edward's, Travis and white sands. Other than those would have to be tested from Sea vessels.
I know enough about physics to know it would cost an unfathomable amount of money to build and test. So yes we have them but how controllable are they and the best way to control them is to launch and track from space.
Do we have the hypersonic missles? The better question is to We have some that we can atleast 90% control? Two companies come to mind that have the ability to build such a guidance system. LM and NG. Only 2 or 3 bases where they could test it. Edward's, Travis and white sands. Other than those would have to be tested from Sea vessels.
I know enough about physics to know it would cost an unfathomable amount of money to build and test. So yes we have them but how controllable are they and the best way to control them is to launch and track from space.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 12:08 pm to Chazreinhold
My theory is that the Globalist has been using/teamed up with China and using them as their Proxy Superpower to infiltrate the USA for decades. They have all our secrets & have been stealing our parents for many years. And our leaders allowed it to happen & joined in on the Corruption.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 12:12 pm to Laugh More
quote:
I remember reading a while back that the tech the military has is usually a decade or so beyond what the public knows.
I don't know how accurate this is, but it wouldn't surprise me. Also, I read this like a decade ago, so it may be even wider of a gap as technology progresses exponentially.
Reminds me of the stealth blackhawk that crashed during the Osama raid. No one knew about those before the raid or have seen them since. We only know from the tail rotor that didn't burn up that is was probably cool as frick.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 12:14 pm to Westbank111
quote:
They have all our secrets
They certainly do not and even if they did, they do not have the ability to build or support the actual hardware.
Yall need to think about the logistical requirements of actually using all of this advanced shite. Look up the flight vs service hours for an F22. Its ridiculous, and you must have the trained manpower, the parts availability and the supply chain to support all of that. Keeping an aircraft carrier in service is a tremendous industrial endeavor in itself.
China is certainly on a trajectory to become a global super power, but right now they are the global dollar store. They are nowhere near there yet. If they were, they would have taken Taiwan long ago and dared the world to do something about it.
The ability to fire a missile that will fly hypersonic speed, they certainly have. The ability to actually effectively use them in a meaningful way? I think we are likely the only ones with that capability.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 12:24 pm to lsu777
quote:
what is embarrassing?
Because the life support loop in an aircraft isn't that complicated and they still screwed it up. My only point is that the same process that gave us the F-117 can also occasionally stub its toe. That doesn't mean the 22 isn't better than the competition, it just means that we don't alway hit one out of the park.
Again, I'm not an expert in this particular defense area, my friend is that I talk to regularly. I would describe his take on our ballistic defenses as "we ain't there yet". That does not mean we're behind anybody on ballistic defense, nor do I know what you're reading that gave you the impression that I thought that.
If people want to believe that because we produced the B2 that we also have a space-based iron dome around all our military assets that makes them impervious to missiles, it's no skin off my nose. An expert I've known for 30 years, who's worked on missile defense for nearly that long, seems to think we don't have that yet. I tend to believe him.
Posted on 8/2/22 at 12:30 pm to Yaboylsu63
quote:
buying the US doesn’t have them
I believe that we are behind both China and Russia in their development.
quote:
or a defense for them?
I believe that no country has a dependable defense for them. We have some mechanisms that will fill the air with munitions that theoretically would cause it to detonate before reaching the target, but nothing that can be depended on, at all. If Russia or China were to top them with a tac nuke, we'd be fricked.
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