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re: "Fiscally conservative but socially liberal"
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:40 am to Ex-Popcorn
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:40 am to Ex-Popcorn
quote:
See? That's exactly the problem. You believe in God. Great. But you are using your personal belief as justification for the role of government. That's just not a defensible position.
So are you. Your hyperlibertarian view of the role of government, which I'm not exactly at war with here - has very little precedent. It's a personal-preference influenced, idealized view of what American governance should look like.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:44 am to Ex-Popcorn
quote:
See? That's exactly the problem. You believe in God. Great. But you are using your personal belief as justification for the role of government. That's just not a defensible position.
What do you use to determine the role of government? The personal beliefs of someone else?
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:44 am to burger bearcat
Fiscally intelligent but socially retarded. This compromise is part of why we're fubar'd today.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:47 am to burger bearcat
quote:
Every government has some form of a moral framework. Where does morality come from? That can vary depending on that country. This doesn't mean you need to be a theocracy like Iran. But anyone who has read the founding documents would know the Constitution is based on a moral framework
that's just false. This country was founded on liberty and property rights. Legislating morality is what has happened over time...and it's flawed. It necessarily presumes that government exists to impose its moral will on its citizens.
That is precisely what led to the founding of this country...getting away from the "morality" being forced upon the founders by the Church of England/Monarchy
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:48 am to Ex-Popcorn
I know it's a pretty trite quote, but it's pretty applicable
quote:
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:49 am to Flats
quote:
What do you use to determine the role of government? The personal beliefs of someone else?
No. The objective nature of property ownership.
Like I said, I am *very* against lots of things that I think the government should not be touching with legislation.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:51 am to burger bearcat
The progressives aren't liberal. They are against free speech and for censorship and government intervention in everything. I am "liberal" on those three issues and vote republican because they are the closest to supporting them of the two major parties. The democratic party currently pushes an authoritarian progressive platform. Easy choice right now.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:52 am to Ex-Popcorn
quote:
The objective nature of property ownership.
I don't know how to break this to you, but the value you place on property ownership is a personal belief. Some people value it, some don't. Some think it's not "fair" and damaging to a culture.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:53 am to Flats
property ownership is a personal belief
C'mon...you are just being silly.
C'mon...you are just being silly.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:54 am to blackinthesaddle
quote:
Your binary thinking is what tears countries apart.
So how do you expect to pay for all this social liberalism if you are fiscally conservative?
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:54 am to Pettifogger
quote:Adams was one man among many who voiced opinio s at the time (Hell, he did not even attend the Constitutional Convention), and arguably the most-religious of the prominent Founders. His views are interesting, but hardly representative.
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other
This post was edited on 5/5/22 at 10:59 am
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:56 am to Ex-Popcorn
quote:
C'mon...you are just being silly.
No, I'm pointing out that you're not "objective" when it comes to values. Nobody is. Physics is objective; what you think about the role of government is not.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:57 am to burger bearcat
I want the government to GTFO of my wallet, GTFO of my family, and GTFO of my bedroom.
You say you oppose one or more of those things? Which one?
You say you oppose one or more of those things? Which one?
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:58 am to Flats
quote:
No, I'm pointing out that you're not "objective" when it comes to values.
No. Whether I own my body and the fruits of my endeavors is the very definition of objective.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:59 am to burger bearcat
quote:
Fiscally conservative
Which party is this supposed to be? Last time I checked they both piss money away left and right.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 10:59 am to burger bearcat
The funny thing is, it’s always conservative causes that get removed and replaced—when it goes back the other way, people lose their minds.
Liberals actually think they are morally superior for allowing babies to be removed from a womb. That’s where we are.
Liberals actually think they are morally superior for allowing babies to be removed from a womb. That’s where we are.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 11:02 am to Pettifogger
quote:
I know it's a pretty trite quote, but it's pretty applicable
quote:
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious People. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other
And what if the religion is one that you don’t agree with? Or the morals of one is unlike the morals of others? You want the government to only apply to your religion and/or your moral code?
This post was edited on 5/5/22 at 11:03 am
Posted on 5/5/22 at 11:05 am to AggieHank86
quote:
Adams was one man among many who voiced opinio s at the time (Hell, he did not even attend the Constitutional Convention), and arguably the most-religious of the prominent Founders. His views are interesting, but hardly representative.
I think "hardly representative" is a massive stretch. Most direct/somewhat confrontational, sure.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 11:10 am to Ex-Popcorn
quote:
Whether I own my body and the fruits of my endeavors is the very definition of objective.
Whether you own property is objective. Whether that's a good or bad thing is not; it's your personal belief.
If you'll re-read my posts I talked about the VALUE you place on property rights. You keep ignoring that and pretending that "property rights" is a value.
Posted on 5/5/22 at 11:11 am to Pettifogger
quote:the amazing thing is that Jefferson was at the OTHER religiosity pole, and the two of them became fast friends.
I think "hardly representative" is a massive stretch. Most direct/somewhat confrontational, sure.
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