- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: CDC just admitted 75% of counted Covid deaths weren’t caused by covid
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:21 pm to the808bass
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:21 pm to the808bass
quote:
That’s a point in time. That’s going to change over the next couple of weeks.
For breakthrough infections, the mortality is around 0.7%. Hopefully, Omicron is less deadly for the vaccinated than what we’ve seen to this point.
It’s not just a point in time, but I agree the time frame is shorter than the length of the entire pandemic. The 0.7% case fatality rate for breakthrough infections was still almost a 50% reduction relative to overall cases, but it is true that the vaccines ability to reduce the likelihood of testing positive was the greater contributor to the overall mortality reduction for the vaccinated. If that advantage is taken away by Omicron then we might start to see deaths in the vaccinated increase, but, again, an almost 50% reduction is still substantial.
A couple of points to consider are the inherent severity of Omicron and the degree to which it is limited in its ability to evade T cells and other immune responses after infection. Evidence so far is that Omicron may be as much as 90% less likely to cause severe disease and that its immune invasion only extends to antibodies and not secondary immune responses. If those hold true, I don’t think we’ll see anything like a 0.7% CFR for infections in people who are vaccinated. That said, the CFR should also go down materially for people with natural immunity as well (and even those with no immunity if the inherent severity is lower).
The next few weeks should tell us the story, but I am leaning toward believing the usefulness of vaccines has run it course for all but those in the highest risk categories. If current immunities (both natural and vaccine induced) continue to neutralize Omicron to the degree we are seeing in early results, then the best course of action going forward is to live in that stalemate with the virus, much as we do with other coronaviruses. If we fight too hard to prevent infection altogether, we risk inducing more severe mutations, much as antibiotics have created superbugs.
2
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:24 pm to MikeTheTiger71
quote:
an almost 50% reduction is still substantial.
In the macro, sure. For the individual, whose mortality risk might be 0.05%, there’s not a lot of compelling stories to get them excited about getting that risk to 0.025%.
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:28 pm to the808bass
quote:
In the macro, sure. For the individual, whose mortality risk might be 0.05%, there’s not a lot of compelling stories to get them excited about getting that risk to 0.025%.
I don’t disagree with that point, which is why my children are not vaccinated.
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:29 pm to MikeTheTiger71
And why my brother should have been vaccinated with a heart condition and morbid obesity.
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:40 pm to MikeTheTiger71
quote:
The data point he should have highlighted was the 0.003% mortality rate for vaccinated individuals. That’s infinitesimally small. That’s around a 99% decrease relative to the % of the overall population that has died in the pandemic. There are holes in the data that would need to be plug to more precisely calculate the risk reduction (age distribution, geography, timing, etc.), but those are really more a matter of degree. They aren’t going to explain away all of a 99% reduction.
Tell me this - what’s the mortality rate for vaccinated healthy/fit 20 year olds as compared to the mortality rate for unvaccinated healthy/fit 20 year olds?
Tell me the same for 30 year olds.
Tell me the same for 40 year olds. And 50 year olds. And 60 year olds.
Also, there’s a time element that would need to be considered if you wanted this assessment to be meaningful.
And keep in mind what the argument is - at least the rational one: nobody argues that the aged, obese and unwell shouldn’t be vaccinated. The argument is over whether a healthy/fit and not aged person is really benefited by being vaccinated, especially if they have natural immunity.
Last point - no Covid data is worth a shite. We can pretend otherwise, and from posts in this thread (and others) it appears there are many that are still pretending, but the fact is there is very little “Covid data” that is useful, and that’s by design.
Posted on 1/12/22 at 11:42 pm to FlexDawg
I don't think it's 75%.
But, it's sizeable.
It might be 75% for ppl under 28 or so.
But, it's sizeable.
It might be 75% for ppl under 28 or so.
Posted on 1/13/22 at 12:39 am to FlexDawg
Up vote because Tudor Dixon is hot!
Posted on 1/13/22 at 2:50 am to loogaroo
quote:
So it was on par with the flu.
If people were never told about Covid I’m guessing the overwhelming majority would have assumed they had the flu. But because the Deep State told them Covid was the devil, we’ve had to live with this bullshite for the last 2 years.
Posted on 1/13/22 at 4:29 am to Godfather1
quote:
I keep saying, I’m not sure which prospect is more frightening: the idea that the Democrats stole the 2020 election, or the possibility that 81 million people voted for Joe Biden & Kamala Harris.
This has been the bedrock of my opinion from the beginning - I cannot accept a reality where there are that many idiots.
Posted on 1/13/22 at 4:48 am to MikeTheTiger71
quote:
500k+ more people died in 2020 than in 2019. The vast majority of those additional deaths correspond with the increase in the number of people dying from pneumonia and respiratory distress/failure/arrest. I’m not saying no one died from pneumonia and respiratory problems pre-COVID. I’m saying that the number of people dying from those causes shot up materially at the same time as COVID arrived. Either some other unknown cause led to more deaths from pneumonia and respiratory issues or the virus that is known to cause pneumonia and respiratory issues is the cause. It’s really not rocket science.
I'm in the group that says "covid deaths" have been exaggerated for political purposes, but I have also struggled with the argument you presented above as well.
Very well stated =
Posted on 1/13/22 at 5:05 am to MikeTheTiger71
quote:
The next few weeks should tell us the story, but I am leaning toward believing the usefulness of vaccines has run it course for all but those in the highest risk categories. If current immunities (both natural and vaccine induced) continue to neutralize Omicron to the degree we are seeing in early results, then the best course of action going forward is to live in that stalemate with the virus, much as we do with other coronaviruses. If we fight too hard to prevent infection altogether, we risk inducing more severe mutations, much as antibiotics have created superbugs.
Just want to say thank you for the thought you put into your posts - I really admire that.
Being 84 with a immune system problems stemming from chemo treatments and a nagging respiratory problem for the past 5 years, I felt my comorbidities were enough to go with the vaccine === not too much swayed by possible 'future' bad effects that may come from the vax.
Thanks for your clear thinking on the topic.
Posted on 1/13/22 at 6:08 am to Stonehog
quote:
My brother in law is an ER nurse
Murse
Posted on 1/13/22 at 6:17 am to Stonehog
quote:
That’s not happening anywhere. If a person dies in a car wreck, they’re not waiting for a positive test and then filling out a death certificate with Covid listed as the cause of death.
What you’re talking about is a doctor lying on a death certificate for no reason.
Congrats. You're a damn liar or at best misinformed by your nurse relative who works at one tiny hospital in the sea of hospitals in this country.
My 21 year old son was involved in a hit and run accident in Harris County Texas on labor day 2020. He was dead on impact. The medical examiner had the nerve to tell me that they did test him for covid and found that test to be negative.
Page 7 of 7
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News