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Started By
Message
Where have all the heart attacks gone?
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:20 pm
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:20 pm
New York Times
Same situation that was posted in another thread.
Emergencies are down.
The question is, why?
quote:
Except for treating Covid-19, many hospitals seem to be eerily quiet.
quote:
I have heard this sentiment from fellow doctors across the United States and in many other countries. We are all asking: Where are all the patients with heart attacks and stroke? They are missing from our hospitals.
quote:
Yale New Haven Hospital, where I work, has almost 300 people stricken with Covid-19, and the numbers keep rising — and yet we are not yet at capacity because of a marked decline in our usual types of patients. In more normal times, we never have so many empty beds.
Our hospital is usually so full that patients wait in gurneys along the walls of the emergency department for a bed to become available on the general wards or even in the intensive care unit. We send people home from the hospital as soon as possible so we can free up beds for those who are waiting. But the pandemic has caused a previously unimaginable shift in the demand for hospital services.
quote:
What is striking is that many of the emergencies have disappeared. Heart attack and stroke teams, always poised to rush in and save lives, are mostly idle. This is not just at my hospital. My fellow cardiologists have shared with me that their cardiology consultations have shrunk, except those related to Covid-19. In an informal Twitter poll by @angioplastyorg, an online community of cardiologists, almost half of the respondents reported that they are seeing a 40 percent to 60 percent reduction in admissions for heart attacks; about 20 percent reported more than a 60 percent reduction.
quote:
And this is not a phenomenon specific to the United States. Investigators from Spain reported a 40 percent reduction in emergency procedures for heart attacks during the last week of March compared with the period just before the pandemic hit.
quote:
And it may not just be heart attacks and strokes. Colleagues on Twitter report a decline in many other emergencies, including acute appendicitis and acute gall bladder disease.
Same situation that was posted in another thread.
Emergencies are down.
The question is, why?
This post was edited on 4/12/20 at 7:21 pm
31
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:21 pm to Scruffy
What’s your take on this, Scruffy?
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:21 pm to Scruffy
People are at home, no in stressful commutes killing them selves at an office and eating fast food 3 times a day.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:23 pm to Scruffy
we had a drop early on but had a bunch of GIB, chest pains, and sepsis from wounds this past week.
I think people were kicking the can down the road because they didn’t want to go to the hospital but won’t be able to much longer
I think people were kicking the can down the road because they didn’t want to go to the hospital but won’t be able to much longer
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:23 pm to Scruffy
Heart attacks happen, I would think, when people are active and their heart rate is up.
People are getting a ton of sleep right now and are just hanging out all day.
People are getting a ton of sleep right now and are just hanging out all day.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:24 pm to Mo Jeaux
My opinion is that a lot of the projected strokes and deaths are coronavirus patients, which accounts for why not all hospitals are overrun and ICUs have not reached capacity.
I am curious as whether or not the initial models accounted for this by decreasing the numbers to account for those who would be replaced by coronavirus or if they double counted instead.
I believe they ended up double counting, which accounts for at least a portion of why the initial estimates were so high.
I am curious as whether or not the initial models accounted for this by decreasing the numbers to account for those who would be replaced by coronavirus or if they double counted instead.
I believe they ended up double counting, which accounts for at least a portion of why the initial estimates were so high.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:26 pm to LSU-MNCBABY
quote:
People are at home, no in stressful commutes killing them selves at an office and eating fast food 3 times a day.
quote:They referenced other stressors that are unique to the pandemic as well.
Also, times of stress increase the risk of heart attacks and strokes. Depression, anxiety and frustration, feelings that the pandemic might exacerbate, are all associated with a doubling or more of heart attack risks. Work and life stress, which also may be higher with the acute disruptions we’ve all been going through, can markedly increase the risk of a heart attack. Moreover, events like earthquakes or terrorist attacks or war, in which an entire society is exposed to a stressor, are risk factors for heart attacks. Finally, Covid-19 can actually affect the heart, which should be increasing the number of patients with heart problems.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:28 pm to Scruffy
Diabetes ate all the heart attacks
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:29 pm to Scruffy
Where is our food coming from at the moment. I know a lot of chicken is normally imported from China but there is no shortage of chicken. Did we change the sourcing?
I believe it is largely diet related that these incidents are down. Pinpointing exactly what it is will probably be difficult. Ive lost about 5 lbs just because I’m eating smaller portions than what I normally get at restaurants.
I believe it is largely diet related that these incidents are down. Pinpointing exactly what it is will probably be difficult. Ive lost about 5 lbs just because I’m eating smaller portions than what I normally get at restaurants.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:31 pm to Scruffy
Friend,
Life is less stressful. See the influence adding an hour to sleep and removing an hour of sleep with the biannual clock changes have to acute coronary syndrome numbers.
People are afraid to go to the hospital right now. Treatment is delayed, which could cause an uptick in the coming weeks of delayed treatment related complications.
Most people presenting with acute abdominal or chest pain do not have a life threatening illness. Perhaps life threatening conditions are overdiagnosed in the ED in normal times, but with fewer patients, fewer overdiagnoses.
A few thoughts.
Yours,
TulaneLSU
P.S. I disagree with the notion that deaths being attributed to Covid-19 are phantom MI or appendicitis deaths. Speak to some pathologists who have done autopsies on Covid-19 positive bodies.
Life is less stressful. See the influence adding an hour to sleep and removing an hour of sleep with the biannual clock changes have to acute coronary syndrome numbers.
People are afraid to go to the hospital right now. Treatment is delayed, which could cause an uptick in the coming weeks of delayed treatment related complications.
Most people presenting with acute abdominal or chest pain do not have a life threatening illness. Perhaps life threatening conditions are overdiagnosed in the ED in normal times, but with fewer patients, fewer overdiagnoses.
A few thoughts.
Yours,
TulaneLSU
P.S. I disagree with the notion that deaths being attributed to Covid-19 are phantom MI or appendicitis deaths. Speak to some pathologists who have done autopsies on Covid-19 positive bodies.
This post was edited on 4/12/20 at 7:35 pm
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:31 pm to WhiskeyThrottle
quote:You will not get a dietary-related change in social statistics in under a month.
I believe it is largely diet related that these incidents are down.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:34 pm to WhiskeyThrottle
quote:
I know a lot of chicken is normally imported from China
Wait, what?
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:35 pm to Scruffy
Maybe more people die BECAUSE they go to the hospital.
Healthcare workers dont actually save as many lives as they take
Healthcare workers dont actually save as many lives as they take
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:37 pm to Nado Jenkins83
quote:Sure, why not.
Maybe more people die BECAUSE they go to the hospital.
Healthcare workers dont actually save as many lives as they take
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:38 pm to Scruffy
Don't go to the hospital right now unless it is an absolute necessity.
Most are very understaffed and those that are there don't want to be there.
Most are very understaffed and those that are there don't want to be there.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:38 pm to Scruffy
I'm nor a doctor though.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:38 pm to TulaneLSU
quote:I don’t think they are “phantom other” deaths either.
P.S. I disagree with the notion that deaths being attributed to Covid-19 are phantom MI or appendicitis deaths. Speak to some pathologists who have done autopsies on Covid-19 positive bodies.
I think they would have been in the hospital anyway.
I believe the population that was hit the hardest are the ones that would be having the strokes and the MIs, among others.
The populations overlap, IMO.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:40 pm to Tiguar
quote:
I think people were kicking the can down the road because they didn’t want to go to the hospital but won’t be able to much longer
This for sure in my case. trying everything I can to keep fluid off.
Posted on 4/12/20 at 7:40 pm to Scruffy
Some 38 year old male in Seattle tested positive for Corona a few weeks back and tragically died in an automobile accident several days later. The family said the hospital listed his cause of death due to Corona. They had to fight them to fix it.
Absolutely no doubt the numbers are being inflated.
Absolutely no doubt the numbers are being inflated.
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