re: The South lost Stonewall Jackson on this day 163 years ago...

Of course the American Revolutionaries were rebels. But they were rebels who actually succeeded.

The Confederates were treated better than any other failed rebels in the history of the world. Like the American Revolutionaries knew and accepted that they’d be hung if they lost.

It's probably been decades since I've read journals and diaries from Civil War soldiers, but man, they were interesting. I remember one who was basically a kid fighting for the South. His unit was hiding in the woods to ambush union soldiers. He said he could see 100s or 1,000s of bluecoats but couldn't see a single Confederate soldier. He accepted he was dying that day; of course, he survived to write about it.

Read about a southern wife whose husband went off to fight in Vicksburg. He sent her a letter on how thankful he was to eat peas one day Her journal went from funny to heartbreaking. She told stories about their pig running away and her and the kids spending a day looking for it, finally wrangling it up. How they would get low on food, kids acting up on the farm, this was a family in a parish in north La, can't remember which one. Sadly, she got sick, and the author noted she died before her husband got home. There was an elderly man who tried to come and help her family, and there was also a young kid who died not long after the mom did. I wish I could remember the book; she had a wonderful way with words and writing.

quote:

---

Yes, so brilliant he got shot by his on troops accidentally after a flanking maneuver. Isn’t something taught in general school 101 about don’t put yourself or your troops in direct line of fire from your own army? Time to let this era RIP in peace!

---

Say huh?

You posted this so confidently and so arrogantly only to be completely wrong.

This is something that revisionist and what ifs forget to mention and it's seldom seldom discussed, but it was huge for the Union and it is something that Grant utilized very effectively in the West at Ft Donaldson,Vicksburg and Shiloh. Plus the traditional naval assets at New Orleans and Mobile.

Really, when you look at the advantages the Union had built in, Shelby Foote was right when he suggested that the Union fought the war with one arm tied behind its back.

Jackson would have kept Lee from the disaster of Gettysburg. However, there is still that little problem of Grant in the West, especially after he takes Vicksburg and Tennessee

quote:

---

But really, I maintain that Shiloh should have sent a message to the Confederacy that the effort was futile

---

It really wasn't that clear of a message. Well the battle itself.

They saw it the same way some argue over it today. What if it hadn't rained, the confederate army was 3 days earlier as planned, and it had been grant instead of Johnston that took a bullet while overseeing running ammunition to the front lines? Hell, Sherman himself briefly hinted at withdrawal after the first day.

I knew a chode would come along and fart onto his computer board a worthless comment…

Two of my ancestors served with Stonewalls brigade during the 1862 Shenandoah Valley campaign.

quote:

---

deltadummy

---

Boom!

kneejerk overreaction, then you hate shines through

quote:

---

The only real shot is at first Bull Run. There was a wide open approach to Washington after that battle.

---

Agree 100%. This was the single best opportunity the Confederacy had at winning the war and securing Southern independence.

I think another opportunity was in the opening stages of Lee’s Maryland campaign in 1862. I’m referring to Lee’s famous “lost dispatch” that fell into McClellan’s hands and gave him a full view of Lee’s intentions. This lead to the Battle of Antietam and checked Lee’s first attempt to take the war to the North.

Had Lee’s orders not fallen into Union hands, there is a good chance he could have succeeded in defeating McClellan in Maryland. Though it’s not certain he could have subsequently gone on to capture Washington DC. For that reason I believe the Confederates still had some hope in Sept. of ‘62, their chance of ultimate victory wasn’t nearly as good as they had in July of ‘61.

quote:

---

But really, I maintain that Shiloh should have sent a message to the Confederacy that the effort was futile. When your enemy can dump almost 70K troops feep into the heart of your territory, you should ask yourself better questions than Davis did.

---

True. But you have to look at the matter from their perspective based on their worldview. As I mentioned in an earliest post, the concept of a grinding industrial war of attrition really wasn’t something most military leaders really grasped jsit yet. They still had the belief in the “decisive battle” where wars, even ones going rather badly overall, can be won in one single decisive battle.