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Started By
Message
re: Sweden: No masks, no lockdowns
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:28 pm to SloaneRanger
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:28 pm to SloaneRanger
quote:and they have also had more people die per capita than we have. its a trade off and i dont know which side i fall on
This is true and you can argue it all day long. But the OP's point remains: By not going the full lockdown route Sweden has avoided a lot of damage to its society and economy and they are now done with Covid. All we have done with the shutdowns is prolong the pandemic.
4
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:29 pm to PorkSammich
quote:
Sweden: No masks, no lockdowns
And no fricks given. Amazing country and metal.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:30 pm to TH03
quote:
In before someone points out relevant data that shows they didn’t do better than anyone else?
Do masks and shutdowns are meaningless. Cool. Now compare the economic impact of the lockdown between Sweden and others.
It seems that they have chosen wisely.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:30 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
and they have also had more people die per capita than we have. its a trade off and i dont know which side i fall on
it's about time, specifically the time it will take for a vaccine to be created/distributed
after a certain point, Sweden will be correct. if the vaccine comes out before that point, they will be wrong
i'm guessing the tipping/flipping point may be by January 2021 or so
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:30 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
and they have also had more people die per capita than we have... to this point
FIFY. We won't know who did better on the deaths per capita front until this pandemic is "over" (whatevr that means)
Of course, you also have to consider the, let's call it questionable, accuracy in reporting of deaths here.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:30 pm to TH03
Their GDP actually increased in 2Q2020.
Compared to .....every other country in the world, that’s a check mark in the Win column.
Compared to .....every other country in the world, that’s a check mark in the Win column.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:33 pm to SloaneRanger
quote:
This is true and you can argue it all day long. But the OP's point remains: By not going the full lockdown route Sweden has avoided a lot of damage to its society and economy and they are now done with Covid. All we have done with the shutdowns is prolong the pandemic.
Anyone interested in this issue should do some research on Anders Tegnell, Sweden's equivalent of Fauci. Listen to some of this guy's interviews and draw your own conclusions about who has better served his country.
My counter argument to this would be roughly half of the United State population is obese, correct? If they're now saying there's a significant correlation between obesity and severity of COVID-19 cases what kind of economic hit we would've taken when those people were hospitalized for significant lengths of time or died? That's a good chunk of our economy's workers right?
I'm just glad I'm not in the position to make those decisions.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:34 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
and they have also had more people die per capita than we have.
I wonder what their average age of COVID-19 related death is? Ours is exactly 80 (per CDC at the end of July). And I’m sorry, but if we can avoid a modern day depression or another recession, I’m sacrificing your PapPaw and MawMaw’s.
This post was edited on 8/6/20 at 12:35 pm
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:34 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
and they have also had more people die per capita than we have. its a trade off and i dont know which side i fall on
Will this be the case when all is said and done? We'll see. Sweden has better per capita death numbers than many US states.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:35 pm to BluegrassBelle
yea. on one hand i see the benefit to what sweden did and how they are seemingly on the back end of this and how they didnt go through the draconian measures others have. but at the same time, i cant help but feel like going the sweden route would have led to completely unacceptable amount of deaths and medical system stress for us considering how unimaginably unhealthy we are as a country
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:37 pm to PorkSammich
That's nice. Isn't the argument always "We can't compare ourselves to those countries because they're so small and homogeneous. It would never work here." If we're looking to Sweden for direction, might as well look at their education, prison, welfare, and medical systems too.
But that would be too open minded. I'd rather keep my mind closed and only use them as an example when it benefits my bullshite political view.
But that would be too open minded. I'd rather keep my mind closed and only use them as an example when it benefits my bullshite political view.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:37 pm to TH03
lockdowns were NEVER solely about preventing deaths.
lockdowns were meant to ELONGATE the curve over a larger period of time, so that hospitals wouldn't get overwhelmed all at once.
Sweden has herd immunity that swarthy spain and italy do not have.
Sweden will be sitting pretty in the fall, while other euro nations see a 2nd wave.
FACT
SWEDEN'S HOSPITALS WERE NEVER OVERWHELMED.
lockdowns were meant to ELONGATE the curve over a larger period of time, so that hospitals wouldn't get overwhelmed all at once.
Sweden has herd immunity that swarthy spain and italy do not have.
Sweden will be sitting pretty in the fall, while other euro nations see a 2nd wave.
FACT
SWEDEN'S HOSPITALS WERE NEVER OVERWHELMED.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:39 pm to NotoriousFSU
quote:
There's no conversation to be had. We have way more deaths because we are a morbidly obese, diabetic society.
Yep, and whether we lock down, mask up, or hide under our bed, eventually almost everyone will be exposed. There is no stopping it and telling these obese people a mask will prevent it is a joke.
Like it or not, some decisions and life choices have consequences and no amount government intervention and stupidity is going to save you. If your immune system can't deal with covid, it is probably going to be tough luck at some point. Masks and all this other BS at best is just prolonging the inevitable.
They should be telling anyone in this category to clean up their diets and get in shape. But JBE is feeding them fried ckicken and quarter pounders...
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:40 pm to BluegrassBelle
quote:
My counter argument to this would be roughly half of the United State population is obese, correct? If they're now saying there's a significant correlation between obesity and severity of COVID-19 cases what kind of economic hit we would've taken when those people were hospitalized for significant lengths of time or died? That's a good chunk of our economy's workers right?
well what is the end game, then?
vaccines won't work that well on obese people, either
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:41 pm to SlowFlowPro
legitimately survival of the fittest out here. 
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:44 pm to NYNolaguy1
quote:
Yay socialism.
The inconvenient truth in that is one of the reasons Sweden has done as well as it has using a different approach is their universal healthcare. This makes it impossible to really compare death rates to places like Mississippi.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:51 pm to TH03
quote:
In before someone points out relevant data that shows they didn’t do better than anyone else?
Economically they did
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:52 pm to Obtuse1
quote:
their universal healthcare.
Eww, I’ll take my chances.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:56 pm to Obtuse1
quote:faulty logic.
The inconvenient truth in that is one of the reasons Sweden has done as well as it has using a different approach is their universal healthcare.
Studies have been done comparing medical outcome of americans of Swedish heritage and swedes themselves and found little difference.
Posted on 8/6/20 at 12:57 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
well what is the end game, then?
vaccines won't work that well on obese people, either
I honestly don’t know. Which is why I also said I don’t envy the people making those decisions.
Maybe we start trying to address the obesity epidemic here before a vaccine gets here? But then how do we do that on such a large scale? It’s all stuff I certainly don’t have the answer to.
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