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re: Sweden is moving away from its no-lockdown strategy amid rising coronavirus cases
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:50 pm to Salmon
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:50 pm to Salmon
quote:
lets see what the 2nd and 3rd spikes look like
I'm willing to bet that Sweden will be very low compared to Norway and Finland
Second spike is happening now.
They aren’t
1
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:50 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
Except that Sweden’s spike is significantly higher.
Go look at the numbers there is a HUGE difference.
Yes, because they chose to let the elderly die! That wasnt a lockdown mistake, that was because they honestly said "You're over 80? You're gonna have to ride it out on your own if you catch this thing. No hospital for you"
And they have admitted it was mistake. This has nothing to do with not locking down.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:50 pm to Street Hawk
Not sure the virus is more deadly, it’s just not been treated properly
One of the biggest success stories for the US is the survival rate for Covid. It’s amongst the highest in the world
One of the biggest success stories for the US is the survival rate for Covid. It’s amongst the highest in the world
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:57 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
Second spike is happening now.
They aren’t
we'll see
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:57 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
If you’re arguing they benefited from a free market shouldn’t they have actually benefited?
They did benefit. They had the choice. In their case, they made the choices to either stay home more, or to close their businesses. But it was THEIR choice, not the governments.
The default should always be individual choice, not government fiat.
quote:
If your population? Yes it is.
No, it's not. Here's a tip for you: You're going to die. Everyone you love is going to die. The average age of death in Sweden, as pointed out by others, is 86 years old. As Scruffy pointed out, it is no different than Triage. You should not make the overwhelming majority of your population suffer for the benefit of a fraction of a fraction of a percent of your population that has already lived a long and full life.
That's selfishness of the highest order.
quote:
I’m just smart enough to point out that this is a communicable disease.
That kills 0.05% or less of the population who are already at the end of their lives.
quote:
Spreading it to others isn’t an individual freedom. You’re right to swing your arm ends at my face.
This is a stupid fricking argument. You can't consciously stop the spread of a virus. And for you to even think to use this as an example demonstrates your blatant stupidity.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 1:58 pm to SlidellCajun
People seem to be ignoring that, according to Sweden's constitution, they cannot shutdown (take away people's migratory freedom) during peace time. The 50-people limit on gatherings had to be done legislatively and the rest is merely guidance. I'm not sure what steps they will be taking to change their constitution, but anything they chose to do won't be done lightly.
As far as the spread/deaths there, I'm curious how their mental health has faired compared to Norway and Finland. Being able to socialize is a big deal for stress/anxiety/depression. Is it worth a few thousand lives? And what was the true toll? How many of those people would be dead from other disease or tragedy or merely "old age"? We need to stop looking at Covid deaths in a vacuum as if it's not affecting people who are highly susceptible to life-ending situations to begin with.
As far as the spread/deaths there, I'm curious how their mental health has faired compared to Norway and Finland. Being able to socialize is a big deal for stress/anxiety/depression. Is it worth a few thousand lives? And what was the true toll? How many of those people would be dead from other disease or tragedy or merely "old age"? We need to stop looking at Covid deaths in a vacuum as if it's not affecting people who are highly susceptible to life-ending situations to begin with.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:01 pm to Centinel
quote:
Going from five to ten is a 100% increase. A HUGE difference.
Sweden has had over 100,000 cases and Close to 6000 deaths.
Denmark has had 35k cases 686 deaths
Finland has had 13,500 cases and 351
Norway has had 16,500 cases and 278 deaths
If you look at new cases Sweden is averaging more too.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:04 pm to Street Hawk
We also all know how fair and balanced Yahoo news can be 
This post was edited on 10/19/20 at 2:04 pm
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:04 pm to Centinel
quote:
This is a stupid fricking argument. You can't consciously stop the spread of a virus. And for you to even think to use this as an example demonstrates your blatant stupidity.
You’re a moron.
Of course you can slow the spread of a virus.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:05 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
But their economy isn’t doing better than their neighbors who did shut down.
Their economy is very different than their neighbors, which you’ve repeatedly failed to respond to
You quoted this too, answer it:
quote:
Why are other places seeing spikes? What is allowable and when do you stop shutting down the economy? How many outbreaks or spikes?
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:06 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
Sweden has had over 100,000 cases and Close to 6000 deaths.
Denmark has had 35k cases 686 deaths
Finland has had 13,500 cases and 351
Norway has had 16,500 cases and 278 deaths
If you look at new cases Sweden is averaging more too.
I don't give a flying frick about cases. They are irrelevant. The only statistic that matters is hospitalizations and deaths.
And 6k deaths is still only 0.05% of the population.
Denmark's deaths are 0.02% of the population.
HUGE increase going from a fraction of fraction to a fraction of a fraction.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:06 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
You’re a moron.
Of course you can slow the spread of a virus.
Slow is not the same as stop. What’s the end game?
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:07 pm to Centinel
quote:
And 6k deaths is still only 0.05% of the population.
Denmark's deaths are 0.02% of the population.
HUGE increase going from a fraction of fraction to a fraction of a fraction.
Denmark was only counting hospitalized deaths at least as of a month ago
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:07 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
You can't consciously stop the spread of a virus.
quote:
You’re a moron.
Of course you can slow the spread of a virus.
This post was edited on 10/19/20 at 2:08 pm
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:08 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
Of course you can slow the spread of a virus.
Thanks for proving your comparison was stupid.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:09 pm to BreesyInBigEasy
quote:There are HUGE disparities with how countries test, count cases, count deaths, etc. They also have different definitions of "shutdown." There are inconsistencies everywhere so comparisons can be defended and championed on both sides without getting anywhere relevant.
Denmark was only counting hospitalized deaths at least as of a month ago
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:10 pm to ell_13
I don’t think he even understands the point of “flattening the curve”. The goal wasn’t to stop the virus, the goal was to slow it down so resources and hospitals could catch up.
The total number infected was still going to be the same over time.
The total number infected was still going to be the same over time.
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:11 pm to ell_13
quote:
There are HUGE disparities with how countries test, count cases, count deaths, etc.
china has zero cases! great success!
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:11 pm to SammyTiger
That damned Sweden! Having the same amount of deaths as years past during a pandemic!
Posted on 10/19/20 at 2:14 pm to Sasquatch Smash
This graph pretty much proves my assumption that most of these deaths would be occurring anyway.
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