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Message
Some reasons the VA cant be abolished
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:31 pm
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:31 pm
Disclaimer: I am a physician at the VA
The VA serves other vital purposes that those of you looking from the outside don't understand when you call for the VA to shut down and allow veterans to go wherever they desire.
1) Major training grounds for future doctors, nurses, xray techs, physical therapists etc. The VA is one of the largest payers of medical training in the US. The private world simply cant absorb this as they are more focused on making money.
2) Major research activities. The VA funds and conducts important research projects that affect nonveterans and veterans alike.
3) Certain services just cant be provided as well like blind rehab, amputation services, etc.
4) The VA is an employer of people who might not be able to work in the private world. We employ blind veterans, mentally challenged/injured veterans and nonveterans, some with mental health challenges. Yes you may consider it welfare but at least they are working for the money.
Those are some of the important things that get left out of discussions.
Also many veterans (that come to the VA. Not all veterans) are challenging to care for to say the least. They are a special culture that demands a lot that private MDs just would not put up with and accept.
The VA serves other vital purposes that those of you looking from the outside don't understand when you call for the VA to shut down and allow veterans to go wherever they desire.
1) Major training grounds for future doctors, nurses, xray techs, physical therapists etc. The VA is one of the largest payers of medical training in the US. The private world simply cant absorb this as they are more focused on making money.
2) Major research activities. The VA funds and conducts important research projects that affect nonveterans and veterans alike.
3) Certain services just cant be provided as well like blind rehab, amputation services, etc.
4) The VA is an employer of people who might not be able to work in the private world. We employ blind veterans, mentally challenged/injured veterans and nonveterans, some with mental health challenges. Yes you may consider it welfare but at least they are working for the money.
Those are some of the important things that get left out of discussions.
Also many veterans (that come to the VA. Not all veterans) are challenging to care for to say the least. They are a special culture that demands a lot that private MDs just would not put up with and accept.
26
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:32 pm to TSS4LSU
The VA has been phenomenal for my Grandfather
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:33 pm to TSS4LSU
quote:
Also many veterans (that come to the VA. Not all veterans) are challenging to care for to say the least. They are a special culture that demands a lot that private MDs just would not put up with and accept.
They are just paying you back for them having to deal with the VA for so long.
ETA: I've only been discharged since 2009 and on more than a dozen times I've sat in waiting rooms for hours, i.e. 4-6+ only to be told I have to see someone else and need to reschedule for another appointment 2 months from that date.
I can only imagine the poor SOBs that have to deal with the VA since the 50's, 60's, and 70's. It's no wonder vets inevitably get called "disgruntled."
This post was edited on 2/15/17 at 12:36 pm
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:34 pm to TSS4LSU
Thanks for your service to our nations vets TSS 
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:34 pm to TSS4LSU
The VA's poor quality of care led to my grandfather developing bed sores that extended his hospital stay and recovery.
At the end of his life they tried to pressure him into signing a DNR on multiple occasions.
At the end of his life they tried to pressure him into signing a DNR on multiple occasions.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:35 pm to TSS4LSU
I don't think anyone wants to shut it down for some ideological reason. The leaders of the VA seem to be incompetent and inefficient when it comes to doing what they're paid to do - much like every other government entity.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:35 pm to TSS4LSU
Maybe I'm not watching the correct talking political heads, but I've never heard anyone call to abolish the VA. Honestly, the idea sounds fricking retarded.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:35 pm to TSS4LSU
quote:
The VA is one of the largest payers of medical training in the US
The federal government shouldn't be paying to train doctors. Locally and privately run hospitals are more than competent to do the same job.
quote:
The VA funds and conducts important research projects that affect nonveterans and veterans alike.
If the federal government is going to fund research, it could easily allocate the funds to private or state/university hospitals.
quote:
Certain services just cant be provided as well like blind rehab, amputation services, etc.
Are you saying that there are no private blindness or amputee rehabilitation services other than those in the VA? If that's the case how have non-veteran blind and amputees been getting along all these years?
quote:
The VA is an employer of people who might not be able to work in the private world. We employ blind veterans, mentally challenged/injured veterans and nonveterans, some with mental health challenges.
The federal government isn't a charity.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:37 pm to TSS4LSU
I respect what you do and say, but saying 'this is the one and only way' is both absurd and flat out wrong.
Add every patient the VA serves to another healthcare provider and most of what you said still happens. Furthermore, instead of the government sending a lot of that support to the VA they can send it to private companies with the lowest bidder.
I respect the VA a ton, but everything they do is additionally done somewhere in the USA privately. There are gunshots, PTSD, burns, amputees, etc. treated privately daily.
Simply saying this is the one and only way is wrong.
Add every patient the VA serves to another healthcare provider and most of what you said still happens. Furthermore, instead of the government sending a lot of that support to the VA they can send it to private companies with the lowest bidder.
I respect the VA a ton, but everything they do is additionally done somewhere in the USA privately. There are gunshots, PTSD, burns, amputees, etc. treated privately daily.
Simply saying this is the one and only way is wrong.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:37 pm to Bmath
quote:I am sorry for your grandfather but as a medical malpractice lawyer, I can confidently say we see way more decubitus ulcer cases from private nursing homes than from the local VA units.
The VA's poor quality of care led to my grandfather developing bed sores that extended his hospital stay and recovery.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:38 pm to TSS4LSU
as someone who is Cat 1 Service Connected Disabled, I will say that I've been reasonably pleased with VA care although there are things I won't let them do to me with a 50 foot pole...
the impact on medical training is the biggest thing in my mind...you WANT your future doctors trained at places like the VA and old Charity in NOLA, where they get to see stuff they wouldn't in a lot of places...
VA administration on the compensation and pension side can drive anyone up the wall...a lot of what kind of service you get depends on what regional office gets your case...
the impact on medical training is the biggest thing in my mind...you WANT your future doctors trained at places like the VA and old Charity in NOLA, where they get to see stuff they wouldn't in a lot of places...
VA administration on the compensation and pension side can drive anyone up the wall...a lot of what kind of service you get depends on what regional office gets your case...
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:38 pm to TSS4LSU
It probably shouldn't be abolished, but it damn sure needs an overhaul. In my experience of dealing with the VA, the problem really isn't the healthcare providers themselves. All the ones I've dealt with have been awesome.
The problem, as is the case with most bureaucracies in the US now, is the administration. Bureaucrats will always cover their own arse, and will always focus on expanding their little fiefdoms to secure more pay and future job promotions. The VA is no different. It's generally not the folks on the ground, interacting with Vets day to day (although there are exceptions). It's the higher ups that really don't give two shits about the vets, and only care about their careers.
The problem, as is the case with most bureaucracies in the US now, is the administration. Bureaucrats will always cover their own arse, and will always focus on expanding their little fiefdoms to secure more pay and future job promotions. The VA is no different. It's generally not the folks on the ground, interacting with Vets day to day (although there are exceptions). It's the higher ups that really don't give two shits about the vets, and only care about their careers.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:38 pm to TSS4LSU
Disclaimer: I am a physician that USED to work at the VA.
I agree it has some positives, but the negatives far outweigh them. The administration and staffing are so slow and incompetent you cannot productively serve patients at an efficient pace. (the physicians I worked with were excellent though)
too much waste.
I agree it has some positives, but the negatives far outweigh them. The administration and staffing are so slow and incompetent you cannot productively serve patients at an efficient pace. (the physicians I worked with were excellent though)
too much waste.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:38 pm to Damone
Damone...you have no clue: The government funds almost all of medical training (Medicare and VA funds) trains the majority if not all physicians.
Almost all state university hospitals are linked with a VA. The VA is just funding the research done mostly by dually appointed researchers.
The VA (and DOD like Walter Reed) is THE leader in blind rehab and amputee rehab.
Almost all state university hospitals are linked with a VA. The VA is just funding the research done mostly by dually appointed researchers.
The VA (and DOD like Walter Reed) is THE leader in blind rehab and amputee rehab.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:39 pm to TSS4LSU
Went with my Dad to his VA check ups. The front office staff is horrible. Once they left us , locked the doors and turned off lights with us still waiting to see the doctor.
This post was edited on 2/15/17 at 12:40 pm
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:40 pm to TSS4LSU
Also, I will saw that people aren't all bad, I met quite a few that cared, but that's not where the majority of frustration lies. People are pissed when there are executives of facilities with routinly extended wait times and PEOPLE DYING in their facility, and not because they were rushed there for an emergency or terminally ill, and the executives in charge still received substantial bonuses. Complete. fricking. Joke.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:42 pm to rantfan
I am amazed the lights were turned off....never happens here.
I agree with staff often not understanding the awesome duty they have to treat every patient with dignity and as if they were a family member.
I agree with staff often not understanding the awesome duty they have to treat every patient with dignity and as if they were a family member.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:43 pm to brass2mouth
People dying is sensationalism. That VA had an ER. The patients could have shown up there and been treated. To say they waited on some list and had no access to care is a lie.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:45 pm to TSS4LSU
quote:
Also many veterans (that come to the VA. Not all veterans) are challenging to care for to say the least. They are a special culture that demands a lot that private MDs just would not put up with and accept.
The staff that the vets see before they ever see a doctor are challenging to say the least. They are a special culture that private patients just would not put up with and accept.
Posted on 2/15/17 at 12:45 pm to TSS4LSU
As a non-veteran myself, I heard perhaps another benefit of the VA (despite all its shortcomings)
I was watching a history of the Marines documentary the other day and they had a small bit near the end about how places like the VA allow wounded troops to be around other wounded troops.
In that way it was a bit of a morale booster because perhaps a wounded Marine or soldier didn't feel so alone in their endeavor.
I have no idea if you've seen anything like that and I can sure as hell can't speak for how a wounded vet feels, but I found that to be interesting. And the wounded Marines on that particular doc. seemed to vouch for it.
I was watching a history of the Marines documentary the other day and they had a small bit near the end about how places like the VA allow wounded troops to be around other wounded troops.
In that way it was a bit of a morale booster because perhaps a wounded Marine or soldier didn't feel so alone in their endeavor.
I have no idea if you've seen anything like that and I can sure as hell can't speak for how a wounded vet feels, but I found that to be interesting. And the wounded Marines on that particular doc. seemed to vouch for it.
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