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re: Pic from the Battle of Stalingrad NSFW
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:01 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:01 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
England and France declared war on Germany on September 3, 1940.
No, it was on 9/3/39.
quote:
If he had spent all year anticipating and preparing for that, he could've taken out France before the end of '39 instead of dicking around during the Phoney War phase doing what he should've been doing in early '39.
When was he going to secure Poland, Denmark, Norway and the others? Hitting France first meant the English would not be on the continent. They only came over after Poland was invaded.
1
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:02 pm to doubleb
Considering the situation in August it made sense to press for a better position and not just stop at the Don. The mistake was not withdrawing back to the Don in late October once it became clear they wouldn't secure the Volga and Soviet strength was building on their flanks.
You are right about the entire operation, but then again the Ostheer no longer has the strength to achieve it's strategic goals since mid-October 41.
You are right about the entire operation, but then again the Ostheer no longer has the strength to achieve it's strategic goals since mid-October 41.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:11 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:
Never invade Russia in the winter…
Never invade Russia without proper logistical support.
I.e. trains of proper gauge, adequate oil supply, tanks that can defeat the T-34 before you start, cold weather gear etc.
Have a proper battle plan. If you need oil get that first.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:12 pm to Cfrobel
When you invade a country the size of Russia, and most of your artillery is being pulled by horses, you're going to have some problems.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:12 pm to Cfrobel
Yes. Barring a political collapse in Moscow the Germans had no shot after 1940.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:14 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
That's what we're taught, but the truth is that every beach except Omaha went pretty smoothly.
Beaches:
Utah - 21,000 landed, 197 casualties.
Gold - 25,000 landed, 1,000 casualties
Juno - 21,000 landed, 961 casualties.
Sword - 29,000 landed, 683 casualties.
Omaha - 34,000 landed, 2,400 casualties.
Airborne - 13,000 landed:
101st - 1,240 casualties.
82nd - 1,259 casualties.
A lot is made of the carnage at Omaha Beach, but it was the airborne troops that had the highest loss rates.
The most horrific fighting in Normandy actually happened in the days and weeks after D-Day. Few people seem to realize this but June 6, 1944, was merely day one of a campaign that raged all the way to the end of August. The Allies suffered 225,000 casualties in the fight for Normandy. Just 7,740 of those were suffered on D-Day.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 5:22 pm to bayoudude
quote:
Had hitler left mother Russia alone it would have been a different ballgame
That was the Soviet Union, not Russia. Hitler knew one day the Soviet Union would come knocking, along with the crazy ideas he had.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 6:08 pm to MadDogs
quote:
Come and See" is a great movie (drama) that covers the German invasion of Russia (mostly the Ukraine)
Reading about it it looks more concerned with Belarus.
Ukrainians at least in the western side wanted nothing to do with the red army and Stalin because of the holodmor less than a decade prior. Geography really screwed over that country putting them in between the friggin Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia.
Watch Mr Jones to learn about how much Stalin and Russia shite on Ukraine.
It’s astonishing how Stalins propaganda still lived on relatively. The fact that he’s not seen on a level of evil as WWII Germany is a testament to how much he bought off the New York Times.
This post was edited on 2/8/22 at 6:15 pm
Posted on 2/8/22 at 6:23 pm to Riseupfromtherubble
quote:
Russia just had far more manufacturing manpower and material and were churning out tanks and aircraft at a rate that vastly exceeded Germany.
Lack of a Heavy strategic bomber was the number one problem with Germany’s war efforts. Neither the HE-111’s nor the JU-88’s carried enough bomb payload to do the jobs needed.
Destroying Russian manufacturing of tanks, planes etc would have given Germany the “W” instead of trying to overwhelm them in battles along the front.
Huge reason behind our winning the War in Europe were attacks on German war manufacturing by heavy bombers (Shweinfurt/Regensburg/Ploesti) vs merely trying to take out German armor/aircraft after they were made.
That methodology cost Japan the war as well. Their subs concentrated on our warships instead of attacking much more vulnerable shipping of men/materiel.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 6:28 pm to Riseupfromtherubble
You touch on one of the issues facing the Axis was they were poorly coordinated if at all.
The Allies coordinated their efforts for the most part, esp the Western Allies.
The Allies coordinated their efforts for the most part, esp the Western Allies.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 6:44 pm to Adam Banks
quote:
Ukrainians at least in the western side wanted nothing to do with the red army and Stalin because of the holodmor less than a decade prior.
A lot of Russians and Ukrainians looked at the Germans as conquering heros at first. If Hitler had not gone all medieval on them he likely would have gained hundreds of thousands of allies in the fight against Stalin.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 7:00 pm to MeTarzanYouInsane
quote:
It does seem that most of what we learn about WWII in the US is about US vs. Nazi's and the holocaust but I'm sure there are many that would argue that the Eastern Front in Europe and some of the Pacific battles both had their moments of pure evil with lasting effects for decades.
Ya think?
FDR’s policy was to bleed the Brits and especially the Soviets. Give them munitions and equipment, but let them take the brunt of the German war machine. We finally invaded on D-Day because Stalin was screaming for another front and we didn’t want the Soviets to walk all the way through Germany.
When the war ended the British Empire was an American playground, and Russia was so weakened that they could not dream of exporting their revolution for another decade.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 7:13 pm to sledgehammer
quote:Or that he found him some tropical nookie and didn't want to return home to Japan.
The fact that the last Japanese soldier surrendered in the 1970s after being told by his commanding officer that the war was over speaks volumes to the dedication of the enemy
Posted on 2/8/22 at 7:25 pm to DavidTheGnome
My mom is from Volgagrad (I refuse to call it Stalingrad) and I use visit every 4 or 5 years to visit my babushka. My grandpa participated in this battle as a civilian and joined the Soviet military as soon as he turned 17 and spent a year fighting in Poland and East Germany.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 8:03 pm to DavidTheGnome
quote:
747,300–868,374 Casualties for the Axis
1,129,619 Casualties for the Soviet Union
Could have been avoided, Stalingrad should have been bypassed.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 8:24 pm to DavidTheGnome
My German ex-girlfriend's dad came back from the post-WWII Siberian labor camps a broken man. So sad he was a 16 year old pawn and came back a 40 year old invalid.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 9:03 pm to AUTimbo
quote:
Lack of a Heavy strategic bomber was the number one problem with Germany’s war efforts.
I agree and am surprised this point isn’t mentioned as much on the hypothetical germany/Russia eastern front discussions as other factors. Imagine the luftwaffe with a b-24 or b-17 type bomber to hammer the Russian t-34 at the plants or crushing huge Russian armament bunches before they can reach the front. Would have been a game changer for them to be able to push the supply game more to even numbers. They could have been used to blockade river transport at places like the Volga, stopped the Russian oil shipments from the caucuses, or added to the complete blockade of places like Leningrad or even Moscow.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 9:25 pm to TigerDog83
Regardless of the aircraft types available the Germans could not afford the attrition in aircraft and aircrew that would have come with an extended bombing campaign. The attrition of 39-41 was so bad they were having trouble providing tactical support by the fall of 41.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 9:51 pm to Cfrobel
Here is the pic of the Hooves... Remember the German Army was pulled mostly by horses... But that winter in the Kessel they had nothing to eat..
This is one of my favorites pic ever for some reason. You have to wonder where she was going as she walked by that plane.. To Work? To the Store? to her girlfriends house?
and here is the Volga River Map... The Germans had not yet made it to Moscow... Had they won at Stalingrad, all supplies, especially oil would be stopped from flowing up North to Moscow and other areas.
This is one of my favorites pic ever for some reason. You have to wonder where she was going as she walked by that plane.. To Work? To the Store? to her girlfriends house?
and here is the Volga River Map... The Germans had not yet made it to Moscow... Had they won at Stalingrad, all supplies, especially oil would be stopped from flowing up North to Moscow and other areas.
Posted on 2/8/22 at 10:08 pm to DavidTheGnome
quote:
Pic from the Battle of Stalingrad NSFW
The movie Enemy At The Gates has a very good opening to this battle. Very chilling at parts. I don’t want to give it away though but I highly recommend the movie in particular the opening.
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