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Message
re: Outside Counsel (lawyers) billing for service is so ridiculous
Posted on 8/22/25 at 6:57 pm to Macavity92
Posted on 8/22/25 at 6:57 pm to Macavity92
Some do it so well that firms won’t work for them. We’ve fired a bunch of them over the years (cordially of course).
1
Posted on 8/22/25 at 7:05 pm to sidewalkside
Then get off the hourly rate shite.
Posted on 8/22/25 at 7:37 pm to Pettifogger
quote:
Some do it so well that firms won’t work for them. We’ve fired a bunch of them over the years (cordially of course).
My form quit doing insurance defence work about 25 years ago when the Big 3 all tried to go to a set amount per case. The number would have turned us into the defence version of a settlement mill and would have lost money on any case we tried even a half-day damages-only case. We do an occasional case now but only if their exposure is high enough, so that they don't complain about the fees and costs.
Posted on 8/22/25 at 7:42 pm to sidewalkside
I bill out at $925/hr. I see the bills for my clients before they go out and also take off any legal research costs/time or remedial work. Hurts in the short term but pays off in the long term.
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:11 pm to Hou_Lawyer
925 frick I am not billing enough lol
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:19 pm to TutHillTiger
BigLaw BS. Rates are ridiculous but companies pay.
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:22 pm to Hou_Lawyer
I rarely do billable hours but damn I way too cheap
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:14 pm to sidewalkside
When I was outside counsel and got fairly basic questions (think 3-4/10 in terms of legal complexity), you better believe that I double and triple checked all my priors to make absolutely sure there hadn't been a recent legislative change, rule promulgation, or piece of potentially relevant jurisprudence that might affect the issue at hand.
So yeah, when a business asks me something that I'm 90% confident I know the answer to off the cuff, I take a little extra time to make sure that the 10% of uncertainty doesn't completely screw my client.
FWIW, I would love to be able to negotiate a "malpractice indemnity" rate where you pay me $90 per hour and get my "trust me bro" level of answer instead of my best professional legal opinion. I can honestly see where some businesses would be well-served with that level of advice/expense.
So yeah, when a business asks me something that I'm 90% confident I know the answer to off the cuff, I take a little extra time to make sure that the 10% of uncertainty doesn't completely screw my client.
FWIW, I would love to be able to negotiate a "malpractice indemnity" rate where you pay me $90 per hour and get my "trust me bro" level of answer instead of my best professional legal opinion. I can honestly see where some businesses would be well-served with that level of advice/expense.
This post was edited on 8/22/25 at 10:20 pm
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:38 pm to RanchoLaPuerto
I like court. Amazes me how much corporate lawyers get paid but are scared to death of court.
I wouldn’t mind spending all day in court if someone did all the clerical work.
I wouldn’t mind spending all day in court if someone did all the clerical work.
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:44 pm to sidewalkside
The real scam is 90% of attorneys have no idea wtf they’re doing and just play pretend
Posted on 8/22/25 at 11:02 pm to SECCaptain
quote:
The real scam is 90% of attorneys have no idea wtf they’re doing and just play pretend
Maybe I should start a firm suing lawyers for malpractice. I won’t get invited to too many social functions but I don’t give a frick.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 1:32 am to SECCaptain
This is really the truth. Most lawyers don't spot issues and don't know how to research or write. Many are also lazy.
Insurance defense gets harder to make profitable every year, by design, but I like the work. Most insureds have no idea that if they ever have a claim their insurer is usually looking for the cheapest counsel who will do the bare minimum while still making it look like a defense is being provided. Creativity, thoroughness, and talent are not valued by insurers unless the claim is really big.
Don't even get me started on staff counsel, or outside counsel selected by third parties focusing on DEI.
Insurance defense gets harder to make profitable every year, by design, but I like the work. Most insureds have no idea that if they ever have a claim their insurer is usually looking for the cheapest counsel who will do the bare minimum while still making it look like a defense is being provided. Creativity, thoroughness, and talent are not valued by insurers unless the claim is really big.
Don't even get me started on staff counsel, or outside counsel selected by third parties focusing on DEI.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 5:21 am to sidewalkside
Use CharGPT. It’s only $20/month
Posted on 8/23/25 at 5:46 am to UptownJoeBrown
quote:
Amazes me how much corporate lawyers get paid but are scared to death of court.
Uh, I don’t know what you mean by “scared to death”, but you do realize that us corporate lawyers aren’t litigators, right? Why would we want to be in court.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 5:59 am to sidewalkside
Thieves. AI can do the world a favor. Eliminate all the lawyers and politicians first.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:51 am to UptownJoeBrown
quote:
I like court. Amazes me how much corporate lawyers get paid but are scared to death of court. I wouldn’t mind spending all day in court if someone did all the clerical work
Wtf
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:54 am to sidewalkside
And they cranked out much of that work while you were chillin’ at happy hour one Friday…just so infuriating.
Posted on 8/23/25 at 6:58 am to Pettifogger
Wtf indeed. Imagine spending all day dealing with judges. I'd blow my brains out
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