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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 3/27/22 at 10:40 am to WeeWee
Posted on 3/27/22 at 10:40 am to WeeWee
quote:Unbelievable how this invasion has turned out & exposed Russia's military.
If Ukraine is able to complain the encircled of the Russian troops west of Kyiv, it will free up a lot of battle hardened Ukrainian troops fighting for their homeland. Plus it will free up a lot of Javelins and other ATGMs. If Ukraine retakes Kherson then they will have a direct line of advance to cut the Russian troops off from the Crimea.
The only thing that concerns me is that Russians truly believe that Crimea is Russia, Historically speaking. Privileged Soviet Union kids were sent to Camp Artek ( brainwashing) in Crimea & it's still a popular Russian vacation destination. They have built a bridge to connect it to mainland Russia. I'm not so sure that they will give up Crimea ( again) so easily.
3
Posted on 3/27/22 at 10:51 am to sugar71
quote:
The only thing that concerns me is that Russians truly believe that Crimea is Russia, Historically speaking. Privileged Soviet Union kids were sent to Camp Artek ( brainwashing) in Crimea & it's still a popular Russian vacation destination. They have built a bridge to connect it to mainland Russia. I'm not so sure that they will give up Crimea ( again) so easily.
Russia just absolutely refuses to abide by cooperative norms. The Kaliningrad Oblast is separated from Russia by the Baltic States. Thankfully, the Baltic States are in NATO and (probably) won’t be touched, but if they were never admitted to NATO, is there any doubt Putin would be gearing up for a tear-arse across the Baltics to link up with Kaliningrad by annexing the Baltics?
Russia’s economic growth had been severely choked off by its lack of warm water ports.
It’s a very toxic mix of a gigantic country that still sees itself as a superpower but doesn’t have its satellite puppet states with better natural resources to boss around anymore...add on top of that the nukes.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 10:55 am to sugar71
quote:
Unbelievable how this invasion has turned out & exposed Russia's military.
The only thing that concerns me is that Russians truly believe that Crimea is Russia, Historically speaking. Privileged Soviet Union kids were sent to Camp Artek ( brainwashing) in Crimea & it's still a popular Russian vacation destination. They have built a bridge to connect it to mainland Russia. I'm not so sure that they will give up Crimea ( again) so easily.
IMO Ukraine's best chance is to cut off eastern Ukraine from Crimea and then go to the negotiating table. Negotiate giving up claims to Crimea in exchange for Russia withdrawing its troops from eastern Ukraine and withdrawing its recognition of the LPR and DPR. Also negotiate a deal that allows Crimea to continue to receive water by the North Crimea Canal in exchange for Russia not interfering with with Ukrainian shipping as well as naval vessel movements through the Kerch straits and the Sea of Azov.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 10:55 am to sugar71
I don't see how Crimea goes back to Ukraine. It's historically Russian territory with ethnic Russians making up the majority of the population. They don't want to be part of Ukraine again and I don't think it's worth it for Ukraine to spend energy and resources to try to get it back.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:02 am to upgrayedd
quote:
I don't see how Crimea goes back to Ukraine. It's historically Russian territory with ethnic Russians making up the majority of the population. They don't want to be part of Ukraine again and I don't think it's worth it for Ukraine to spend energy and resources to try to get it back.
To be honest, as pro-Ukraine as I am in this conflict, Crimea is such a valuable piece to have and to offer for an end to hostilities. Not that I want to normalize the use of unprovoked war as a means to gain territory, but since Crimea is already a de facto Oblast of Russia right now, conceding it to Russia would show a good faith intent on the part of Ukraine to see peace.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:06 am to AU86
quote:Does Morsi being dead or not take away from the Cairo people recognizing Obama & Hillary occupying Cairo with staged color revolutions, staging a country for a regime change of their liking?
Morsi, the man that you are talking about is dead. He died in 2019. In fairness, why didn't you list pictures of Grozny or Aleppo after Putin got finished with it. What about the illegal invasions of Putin in Georgia (2008), Crimea and Donbass (2014) or Ukraine (2022)? What about Putin's involvement in Syria and Africa? Go check out the Central African Republic.
The Biden's are a crime family but Putin could give them lessons on stealing and corruption. Putin has stolen billions.
Or that the Cairo people massively protested them holding signs saying Obama & Hillary are terrorists?
Morsi was at first sentenced to death for brutal Christian killings, then a life sentence and he is reported to have died in 2019 in court. The point is the President of the United States, Obama and SOS Clinton placed him when it was none of their business.
Putin is no saint but actually watch the videos Oliver Stone documented. As well as read court documents that prove Oliver Stone's extensive finding that the USA caused the regime changes and placed neo nazi's under the guise of the Ukraine National Guard.
There is also CIA documents released that CIA USA did the same thing supporting and placing neo nazi's killing Jews in the 1970's. So a pattern is established.
quote:
Ret Col. Douglas Macgregor: Zelensky Is No Hero, He's A Puppet That Is Putting His Own Population At Unnecessary Risk
quote:
An unsealed FBI indictment of four American white supremacists from the Rise Above Movement (RAM) declared that the defendants had trained with Ukraine’s Azov Battalion, a neo-Nazi militia officially incorporated into the country’s national guard. The training took place after the white supremacist gang participated in violent riots in Huntington Beach and Berkeley, California and Charlottesville, Virginia in 2017.
The indictment stated that the Azov Battalion “is believed to have participated in training and radicalizing United States-based white supremacy organizations.”
After a wave of racist violence across America that culminated in the massacre of twelve Jewish worshippers at a Pittsburgh synagogue, the revelation that violent white supremacists have been traveling abroad for training and ideological indoctrination with a well-armed neo-Nazi militia should cause extreme alarm.
Not only are white supremacists from across the West flocking to Ukraine to learn from the combat experience of their fascist brothers-in-arms, they are doing so openly — chronicling their experiences on social media before they bring their lessons back home. But U.S. law enforcement has done nothing so far to restrict the flow of right-wing American extremists to Azov’s bases.
There is one likely explanation for the U.S. government’s hands-off approach to Azov recruitment: the extremist militia is fighting pro-Russian separatists as a front-line proxy of Washington. In fact, the United States has directly armed the Azov Battalion, forking over anti-tank rocket launchers and even sending a team of Army officers to meet in the field with Azov commanders in 2017.
This post was edited on 3/27/22 at 11:09 am
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:16 am to AU86
Put another way...
What would the USA do if a foreign leader/country placed, trained & funded---- militant radical neo nazi's such as The Azov Battalion on USA soil; under the guise of acting as our National Guard to: Cause chaos & change our leaders & President and place who they want?
Unsealed FBI indictment
What would the USA do if a foreign leader/country placed, trained & funded---- militant radical neo nazi's such as The Azov Battalion on USA soil; under the guise of acting as our National Guard to: Cause chaos & change our leaders & President and place who they want?
Unsealed FBI indictment
This post was edited on 3/27/22 at 11:29 am
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:17 am to UndercoverBryologist
quote:
To be honest, as pro-Ukraine as I am in this conflict, Crimea is such a valuable piece to have and to offer for an end to hostilities. Not that I want to normalize the use of unprovoked war as a means to gain territory, but since Crimea is already a de facto Oblast of Russia right now, conceding it to Russia would show a good faith intent on the part of Ukraine to see peace.
I don't think it's really much of a bargaining chip. Russia holds it and the people of Crimea overwhelmingly voted for it to be a Russian state. Even if you don't think that vote was legit, the sentiment of the people in Crimea is absolutely pro-Russia. It just doesn't make sense for Ukraine expend resources taking over an area that will resent it forever.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:22 am to upgrayedd
quote:
I don't think it's really much of a bargaining chip. Russia holds it and the people of Crimea overwhelmingly voted for it to be a Russian state.
Russia may already have it, but if they want the opportunity to get out of an Afghanistan-like quagmire in the rest of Ukraine, if Ukraine offered them the opportunity to claim victory by renouncing its claim on Crimea, Russia should take the W and end the conflict....no questions asked on the “demilitarization” issue or Ukraine’s right to join NATO.
This post was edited on 3/27/22 at 11:24 am
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:33 am to UndercoverBryologist
At least pre-war Crimea is as pro-Russia as it gets, or at least that’s what gets reported. There was a Reddit post the other day claiming to be a line of cars leaving Crimea since the men are likely to be drafted into this war.
I don’t know if having a bunch of their kids drafted into a war would move the pro-Russia/pro-Ukraine needle or not.
I don’t know if having a bunch of their kids drafted into a war would move the pro-Russia/pro-Ukraine needle or not.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:37 am to UndercoverBryologist
quote:
Russia may already have it, but if they want the opportunity to get out of an Afghanistan-like quagmire in the rest of Ukraine, if Ukraine offered them the opportunity to claim victory by renouncing its claim on Crimea, Russia should take the W and end the conflict....no questions asked on the “demilitarization” issue or Ukraine’s right to join NATO.
How is this a victory for Russia in anyway?
Ukraine joining NATO wasn’t ever a realistic scenario even before the war. It just wasn’t going to happen. It’s definitely not happening now. The best Ukraine can hope for is basically going back to the status quo prior to the invasion and even then they’re going to lose some territory.
This post was edited on 3/27/22 at 11:39 am
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:44 am to cajunangelle
quote:
Cajunangelle
What you’ve shown is the US sucks at nation building where cultures are both Muslim and dramatically different than our own.
We have a good bit of success with the former Soviet sphere of influence (Poland, East Germany).
Interestingly, going across ethnic lines, given enough time we seem to have Asia figured out as well.
Western sphere of influence countries (Japan, Singapore, South Korea, Taiwan) all do just fine. This is true even though Japan walked out of WWII with an Emperor in place, and post WWII South Korea and post Chinese Civil War Taiwan were every bit as autocratic as Russia is today.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:45 am to UndercoverBryologist
"Yeah, but Russia winning hurts Biden and the democrats. Millions of people in Eastern Europe having their freedoms forcibly taken is worth the tradeoff"
-SirWinston, probably
-SirWinston, probably
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:46 am to cajunangelle
now compare western europe to eastern european soviet bloc countries, israel to other levant countries, and south korea and japan to north korea
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:46 am to phunkatron
And this is why the Poli board is so pro-Putin these days. They'd like to see one of our biggest geopolitical foes get a W just to spite a man and an administration they didn't vote for.
This post was edited on 3/27/22 at 11:47 am
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:50 am to UndercoverBryologist
quote:
Russia may already have it,
They don’t have shite. Right now they look like a big fat bully that’s met it’s match and on it’s knees gasping for air. Kinda like the loser Russian supporters on this site
This post was edited on 3/27/22 at 11:51 am
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:50 am to RollTide1987
also, they have an obsession with rejecting literally anything put forth by our major, our apparently corporate, media. to the degree they are actively consuming and supporting straight up russian state media, all because its not ours and its saying what they want to hear
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:55 am to RLDSC FAN
Sanctions on Russia are a "hard lever" that should only be removed following a "full ceasefire and withdrawal" from Ukraine, the foreign secretary says.
Liz Truss told the Sunday Telegraph that Moscow would also have to commit to "no further aggression" or face the prospect of them being reimposed.
.....
The foreign secretary has previously said she believes the peace talks are a "smokescreen" designed to distract from Russia's actions and allow its armed forces time to regroup.
BBC Link
Liz Truss told the Sunday Telegraph that Moscow would also have to commit to "no further aggression" or face the prospect of them being reimposed.
.....
The foreign secretary has previously said she believes the peace talks are a "smokescreen" designed to distract from Russia's actions and allow its armed forces time to regroup.
BBC Link
Posted on 3/27/22 at 11:59 am to WestCoastAg
quote:
also, they have an obsession with rejecting literally anything put forth by our major, our apparently corporate, media. to the degree they are actively consuming and supporting straight up russian state media, all because its not ours and its saying what they want to hear
They traded one devil for another, and they don't recognize it.
Posted on 3/27/22 at 12:01 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
also, they have an obsession with rejecting literally anything put forth by our major, our apparently corporate, media. to the degree they are actively consuming and supporting straight up russian state media, all because its not ours and its saying what they want to hear
I take nothing at face value. Western media is absolutely attempting to Russia in the worst light possible and Ukraine in the best light possible. It’s absolutely a coordinated effort and the western governments are heavily involved in it. And it’s working remarkably well. It turns out western governments and western media are light years ahead of Russia when it comes to information warfare, or propaganda if you prefer that word. In fact, calling Russian media propaganda is an insult to real propaganda.
Acknowledging this fact does not make one a Russia or Putin supporter. I’m actually supporting Ukraine and am very anti-Putin but if I even acknowledge that the west is conducting a very effective propaganda campaign then I’m labeled a Putin cocksucker. People who say shite like that are absolutely no different than people who only believe Russian media and think Putin is the greatest.
Most of this thread is effectively no different than the poliboard supporting Putin. You’ve picked a side and don’t even bother see what’s real and not real. I pity people like that because they are ignorant.
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