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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Posted on 9/17/24 at 5:29 pm to
Posted by Auburn1968
NYC
Member since Mar 2019
26469 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 5:29 pm to
I don't think it is Trump's style to negotiate from a position of weakness.
Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
15671 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 5:29 pm to
quote:

Our guys were going to commandeer an oil refinery


It's never been a refinery. It's an NGL's fractionation plant. Separates ethane, propane, butane and pentanes+ out of a "wet" natural gas stream. Locals call it the refinery but it isn't Same thing for a plant I was at in NM. Locals call it the refinery since the early 1950's. Not a drop of crude oil has been to it.
Posted by Lee B
Member since Dec 2018
3945 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 6:21 pm to
quote:

The 2 useful idiot JRs fail to mention that russia is using iranian and north korea weapons for long range strikes to every part of ukraine.

Negotiate with Moscow to end the Ukraine war and prevent nuclear devastation

by Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and Donald Trump Jr., opinion contributors - 09/17/24 7:30 AM ET

The New York Times reported Thursday that the Biden administration is considering allowing Ukraine to use NATO-provided long-range precision weapons against targets deep inside Russia. Such a decision would put the world at greater risk of nuclear conflagration than at any time since the Cuban missile crisis.

At a time when American leaders should be focused on finding a diplomatic off-ramp to a war that should never have been allowed to take place, the Biden-Harris administration is instead pursuing a policy that Russia says it will interpret as an act of war. In the words of Vladimir Putin, long-range strikes in Russia “will mean that NATO countries — the United States and European countries — are at war with Russia.”

The Hill



Profiles in Chickenshitness...

the Kennedy Family probably won't let him be buried anywhere near JFK
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 6:34 pm to
quote:

And I'm saying I think some of them would be happy about it whether they said it or not.



Catching up on this thread and came across this gem. You are inventing a person and personifying them in a way which amplifies your anger. Just an incredibly odd way of operating in the world.
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 6:39 pm to
quote:

This affair will not be settled on the battlefield, at least not shy of WWIII and MAD. Reality does not sit well here, but facts are stubborn things.


This 'affair' is going to be a geopolitical flashpoint for a long time. There is no situation in which Russia can be integrated back into Europe without serious concessions on the Russian side. Thus the only thing to do will be to continue to fight to gain leverage for future negotiations. That's a more accurate description of reality than appealing for peace for its own sake.

Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 6:43 pm to
quote:

Iran literally shot rockets at a US military base



They did a lot more than that. The maximum pressure campaign was a complete failure.
Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
15671 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 7:28 pm to
Covert Cabal's latest satellite assessment. Russia's towed artillery all but gone from storage. Over 50% gone and lots of scrap remaining
LINK
This post was edited on 9/17/24 at 7:37 pm
Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
20967 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 7:30 pm to
The Iran policies of both Obama and Trump failed. Ultimately, that's because of Iran being Iran.
Posted by texag7
College Station
Member since Apr 2014
41304 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 8:13 pm to
quote:

The Iran policies of both Obama and Trump failed.


What are you talking about? Trump put like 1,500 individual sanctions on Iran and weakened them immensely.
Posted by StormyMcMan
USA
Member since Oct 2016
4669 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 8:21 pm to
ISW Update Sept 17th

quote:

Key Takeaways:

The Ukrainian Prosecutor General's Office opened an investigation into another case of apparent Russian abuse and execution of a Ukrainian prisoner of war (POW).

Leaked documents outlining large-scale Kremlin information operation campaigns targeting Ukraine and the West continue to demonstrate the Kremlin's commitment to leveraging its global information instruments to advance Moscow’s interests using social media.

Russian Security Council Secretary Sergei Shoigu arrived in Iran for an unannounced visit following recent visits to Syria and North Korea amid ongoing Russian efforts to secure military cooperation and support from non-Western allies.

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov met with North Korean Foreign Minister Choe Son-hui in Moscow.

Russian forces recently advanced near Toretsk and Pokrovsk and southwest of Donetsk City.

Ukraine's Main Military Intelligence Directorate (GUR) reported on September 17 that Russia continues to recruit citizens from Syria to fight in Ukraine.


Posted by GOP_Tiger
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2005
20967 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 8:22 pm to
No, Trump left Iran much, much further along in its nuclear weapons program that it was when he took office. Ultimately, the sanctions failed. Iran was not weakened, which is why they are stirring up more trouble than ever in Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Yemen, and (of course) Gaza.

If they had been weakened, Russia wouldn't be so eager for their latest weapons.
Posted by CitizenK
BR
Member since Aug 2019
15671 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 8:36 pm to
quote:

Ultimately, the sanctions failed.


Their oil went unhindered to China as well as Asian nations like Japan and South Korea which were exempt from the sanctions.

Also refined products from what amounts to a foreign trade zone here. A lot of lube oils went to the open market as being from UAE, as well as asphalt.
This post was edited on 9/17/24 at 8:38 pm
Posted by Bunk Moreland
Member since Dec 2010
68333 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 9:00 pm to
Good stuff from Jens.
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This post was edited on 9/17/24 at 9:06 pm
Posted by Chromdome35
Fast lane, behind a slow driver
Member since Nov 2010
8164 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 9:03 pm to
Hey Trinidad, how's Russia's counterattack in Kursk going?

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Posted by Lee B
Member since Dec 2018
3945 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 10:01 pm to
Not really on topic, but if these pagers were only in the possession of Hezbollah operatives...?

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Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 10:42 pm to
quote:

What are you talking about? Trump put like 1,500 individual sanctions on Iran and weakened them immensely.



He really didn't 'weaken them.' The Iranians have developed methods around sanctions and the point of that sanctions regime, which was to bring Iran to the table in order to include ballistic missile restrictions into the JCPOA, was a massive failure, as Iran never negotiated after Trump's exit from the agreement.

Iran was also selling Russia and its proxies missile systems as well as missiles and drones, which the West argued were in violation of UN Resolution 2231, which was a sanctions program attempting to limit the transfer of Iranian systems to other groups. Those sanctions expired on October 17th, 2023, and given that Iran has arguably amped up arms transfers to proxy group in spite of continued sanctions from the West, including the EU and the British, should undermine the notion that these sanctions really weakened them.

Furthermore, look at where we are today. Iran and Iranian proxies aren't weaker from the implementation of that sanction program till now. They still represent the same intractable geopolitical problem for US allies and for the US itself. Despite protests, and the same rhetoric from people insisting that the sanctions are just about to work and topple the Iranian regime, that regime remains resilient.
Posted by Auburn1968
NYC
Member since Mar 2019
26469 posts
Posted on 9/17/24 at 11:39 pm to
quote:

Covert Cabal's latest satellite assessment. Russia's towed artillery all but gone from storage. Over 50% gone and lots of scrap remaining
LINK


Russia's towed artillery is out ranged and out radar return fired. A lot of it is WW11 vintage artillery.
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
138801 posts
Posted on 9/18/24 at 12:12 am to
quote:

This 'affair' is going to be a geopolitical flashpoint for a long time. There is no situation in which Russia can be integrated back into Europe

(1) You don't know Europe.

(2) In all of Earth's history, Russia has never been fully integrated into Europe
Posted by NC_Tigah
Make Orwell Fiction Again
Member since Sep 2003
138801 posts
Posted on 9/18/24 at 12:19 am to
quote:

look at where we are today. Iran and Iranian proxies aren't weaker from the implementation of that sanction program till now.


no ... seriously

Posted by TigersSEC2010
Warren, Michigan
Member since Jan 2010
38444 posts
Posted on 9/18/24 at 12:58 am to
I have no idea what they hit but it looks like Ukraine smoked something massive based on random Reddit videos I’m seeing. Big big booms and smoke billowing as far as you can see.
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