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Started By
Message
re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:37 am to Palmetto98
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:37 am to Palmetto98
quote:
How can Russia lose if Zelensky can’t even touch a sq Ft of Russian territory?
Oh, you sweet summer child. Bless your little heart.
1
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:37 am to Palmetto98
So Britain didn't lose the Revolutionary War then?
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:39 am to Obtuse1
quote:
Oh, you sweet summer child. Bless your little heart.
I really want to try this kool aid y’all are drinking right now lmao
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:40 am to TigerDoc
quote:
So Britain didn't lose the Revolutionary War then?
Is Russia at war against NATO and Ukraine right now at a war across the Atlantic?
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:40 am to Jim Rockford
quote:
The question has to be asked, what next. Will this allow Russian reformers to come to the front, finally. Will Russia disintegrate into civil war.
Or Russia can just say nah we not done yet and stabilize the front line with tactical nukes, assuming they still have any that work. Then what will the west's response be.
I doubt Russia uses tactical nukes since multiple NATO nations have said that they would invoke Article 5 if nuclear fallout from a nuke or an accident at a nuke plant reaches their borders. I see it playing out in or two ways in the near future (6 months or so).
1. Russia retreating back to the pre-invasion lines or possibly a little closer back to Russia in the east and being driven to the mountains of souther Crimea. Then Russia entering a cease-fire with Ukraine while it rearms and regroups then trying again in 5-10 years if Putin or his successor is still in power.
2. Russia stabilizes the lines and the conflict returns to stalemate like it was from June to late August. Russia fills its ranks with hundreds of thousands of poorly trained and quickly gathered conscripts and foreign soldiers from countries like North Korea and parts of Africa. Meanwhile the Ukrainians continue to receive western aid including tanks, helicopters, fighter jets, and SAM systems and then thousands more die for the lines to move a < 10 km in one way or another.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:43 am to Palmetto98
Everyone regards Russia as losing the war in Afghanistan when they pulled their troops out of an occupation in the 80's. We lost in Viet Nam when we pulled out and the govt we supported fell.
Neither of those losing countries lost territory and they still lost.
Neither of those losing countries lost territory and they still lost.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:44 am to TigerDoc
quote:
Everyone regards Russia as losing the war in Afghanistan when they pulled their troops out of an occupation in the 80's. We lost in Viet Nam when we pulled out and the govt we supported fell. Neither of those losing countries lost territory and they still lost.
Well look at a map genius. What’s the difference between Vietnam & Afghanistan vs Ukraine?
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:45 am to Palmetto98
You tell me, baw.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:47 am to TigerDoc
quote:
You tell me, baw.
I’m not the one making shvtty comparisons
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:50 am to Palmetto98
quote:
How can Russia lose if Zelensky can’t even touch a sq Ft of Russian territory?
I seem to recall one of the pro-Russian posters (I cannot remember if it was you or LW) saying back in March that if Russia was driven back to the pre-invasion lines the it would be a huge Ukrainian win and a massive defeat for Russia. If Lyman falls then the Russians will have to choose between leaving Severodonetsk and the heights on the west side of the SD river or trying to defend the area during the wet season which will be difficult to do during when the ground turns to mud and the rivers swell and the currents become too swift for pontoon bridges. If the Russians are forced to abandon Severodonetsk then the only place they have to fall back to are the pre-invasion lines. So it is possible that using the pro-Russian poster(s) definition of defeat for Russia that Russia might be forced into such defeat in the near future.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:50 am to RLDSC FAN
Russia not ready for Ukraine's negotiating position – Podolyak
10.09.2022 16:34
Mykhailo Podolyak, an adviser to the head of the Ukrainian President's Office, has said that Russia is currently not ready for Ukraine's negotiating position, which is "absolutely normal."
He said that President Volodymyr Zelensky had repeatedly voiced Ukraine's negotiating positions.
"We formulate them as follows: please leave our entire territory, withdraw all troops not to the conditional borders as of February 23, but completely to the borders internationally recognized in 1991, including the Crimean peninsula, destroy all your illegally constructed objects, including the so-called Kerch Bridge. After that, we will sit down at the negotiating table," Podolyak said.
According to him, the Ukrainian side is ready to talk about three things: "The first is reparations from the point of view of all the losses that Ukraine has suffered. The second is how we exist, coexist, since you [Russia] are neighbors, from the point of view of security for of Ukraine. And the third thing is a certain legal responsibility that must be borne by a number of people, including those with Russian citizenship, who committed crimes in Ukraine," he said.
At the same time, Podolyak said that "today, Russia is not yet ready for an absolutely normal negotiating position of Ukraine."
UKRINFORM
10.09.2022 16:34
Mykhailo Podolyak, an adviser to the head of the Ukrainian President's Office, has said that Russia is currently not ready for Ukraine's negotiating position, which is "absolutely normal."
He said that President Volodymyr Zelensky had repeatedly voiced Ukraine's negotiating positions.
"We formulate them as follows: please leave our entire territory, withdraw all troops not to the conditional borders as of February 23, but completely to the borders internationally recognized in 1991, including the Crimean peninsula, destroy all your illegally constructed objects, including the so-called Kerch Bridge. After that, we will sit down at the negotiating table," Podolyak said.
According to him, the Ukrainian side is ready to talk about three things: "The first is reparations from the point of view of all the losses that Ukraine has suffered. The second is how we exist, coexist, since you [Russia] are neighbors, from the point of view of security for of Ukraine. And the third thing is a certain legal responsibility that must be borne by a number of people, including those with Russian citizenship, who committed crimes in Ukraine," he said.
At the same time, Podolyak said that "today, Russia is not yet ready for an absolutely normal negotiating position of Ukraine."
UKRINFORM
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:51 am to Palmetto98
quote:
How can Russia lose if Zelensky can’t even touch a sq Ft of Russian territory?
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:53 am to Palmetto98
You're the one saying Russia can't lose, but governments fall in autocratic countries over disastrous outcomes in wars without losing terroritory. In Russia, the Czar ended up dead over the failures in WWI.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:53 am to WeeWee
quote:
I seem to recall one of the pro-Russian posters (I cannot remember if it was you or LW) saying back in March that if Russia was driven back to the pre-invasion lines the it would be a huge Ukrainian win and a massive defeat for Russia. If Lyman falls then the Russians will have to choose between leaving Severodonetsk and the heights on the west side of the SD river or trying to defend the area during the wet season which will be difficult to do during when the ground turns to mud and the rivers swell and the currents become too swift for pontoon bridges. If the Russians are forced to abandon Severodonetsk then the only place they have to fall back to are the pre-invasion lines. So it is possible that using the pro-Russian poster(s) definition of defeat for Russia that Russia might be forced into such defeat in the near future.
Well if this happens then we can discuss this however, Russia is currently grinding down the Ukrainian army by letting them attack and also western aid/resources. The farther this earth is from NATO’s borders, the better.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:54 am to TigerDoc
quote:
You're the one saying Russia can't lose, but governments fall in autocratic countries over disastrous outcomes in wars without losing terroritory. In Russia, the Czar ended up dead over the failures in WWI.
Another shvtty meaningless comparison
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:56 am to Palmetto98
I'm sure others can up with plenty more examples of wars lost by countries that didn't lose territory by simply failing to meet their political objectives and making things worse at home, but I'm sure none will be good enough for you. 
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:57 am to TigerDoc
lets start that list
germany in ww1
germany in ww1
Posted on 9/10/22 at 11:58 am to cypher
quote:LINK
As a result of explosions in Melitopol on September 9, the United Russia headquarters was destroyed. The resistance forces also took revenge on three collaborators.
The Mayor of Melitopol, Ivan Fedorov, announced this
Looks like the Ukrainian people may be starting to rise up against the Russians.
Posted on 9/10/22 at 12:05 pm to TigerDoc
quote:
TigerDoc
Moved to the OT bc credibility
Posted on 9/10/22 at 12:05 pm to Palmetto98
quote:
Russia is currently grinding down the Ukrainian army by letting them attack and also western aid/resources.
You were the guy that told people in high school you were grinding the other guy down by beating their fists up with your face, weren't you?
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