re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

Russia to continue war against Ukraine until Putin's tasks fully completed, says Russian defense minister
5 July, 07:59 PM



The Russian Federation will continue the war against Ukraine "until the tasks set by President Vladimir Putin are fully fulfilled," Russian Minister of Defense, Sergei Shoigu said on July 5, Russia’s Interfax news agency reported.

"The special military operation will continue until the tasks are fully completed," Shoigu said.

Shoigu also said that "preserving the lives of servicemen and the safety of the civilian population are the main priorities of the Ministry of Defense."

In fact, the Russian army has suffered severe losses since it launched its aggressive invasion of Ukraine, and had caused thousands of civilian casualties among Ukrainians through the indiscriminate use of artillery, rockets and cruise missiles in residential areas.

The New Voice of Ukraine

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Don't care. This is Europe's problem to pay for, not mine. Why do people continually support welfare for European nations? Do y'all think Europe can't handle this?

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No, Europe can’t handle this on their own. In fact, no other country, other than the US, has the ability to try and reason when it comes to these conflicts. If we stayed out of Europe, they would nuke each other into oblivion. They all have a lot of history, and have always battled for lands that they believe to be theirs. There’s lots of hatred between countries in Europe, and they have a long history of fighting wars.

Now, we shouldn’t intervene in places, where it’s full of third world countries and animals, who still think we’re in the Middle Ages, like the Middle East. Those animals just need to be left alone. Europe I believe is one place where foreign aid is necessary. Now of course, this comes at a time, when we have very irresponsible spending in our government, and give money foolishly to countries who shouldn’t get it. Like giving millions of dollars for the gays in Pakistan. That’s BS. I get that, but I think the Ukraine conflict is one of those deals, where we’re better off trying to deal with this conflict, in this way, right now. History has taught us that staying too isolated from certain regions, is a bad thing.

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But that’s what I say too. I think you’re overblowing the start of World War II and not taking any other historical event into account. I sure as shite don’t see how this is equivalent to anything that happened in World War I. If anything World War I is the exact opposite of this scenario, because if Russia had minded it’s own business, then World War I would have never happened.

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I think a World War would break out, not from Russia starting to bomb a NATO country, or vice versa, but an uncontrollable Russian ally like Belarus, who has been very sketchy lately, doing something stupid. From what I’ve read, it seems that many countries like Poland, the Baltics, and others, don’t like the Belarusian people, and I think Belarus intervening militarily in Ukraine, could cause Poland, Finland, Sweden, or a Baltic State, to intervene in Belarus. That would drag Russia into defending Belarus, and there’s how Russia and NATO go to war with each other. Or Belarus doing something to Poland is possible. Is that not similar to how WWI started? It wasn’t the major powers going to war with each other, but the smaller ones who started all the fighting. I don’t think the powder keg is in Ukraine, but in the Belarus, Baltic, and Polish regions.

It just seems to me, that these former Soviet States, are not going to be controlled by Moscow ever again, and I think they would be the most eager to go to war with Russia or Belarus, than the rest of the NATO countries would be. All the former NATO countries, would rather be attacked before starting war with Russia. These former USSR countries, might would be the aggressors here, because they will not be under Russian rule again. They’ll fight to the death before being under Russian rule again. We don’t understand that.

It’s the same with the Jews in Israel. They will not be exterminated again, and if it’s going to happen, they’ll take the other guys out as well. Israel always acts before Iran or other countries even have a bomb. They’re not even going to allow themselves to be in vulnerable positions ever again.

I compare this to the start of WWII, by the motivation behind the rise of the Nazi empire, and why they wanted to go to war with the allies. End of WWI, the Treaty of Versailles ended up being what caused a lot of that motivation for the Germans. We learned, that making your enemy who you just defeated, more of an enemy, is never a good thing. Japan is one of our closest allies to this day, and our war with them was bigger for us, than fighting Germany in WWII.

After the fall of the USSR, we didn’t really give Russia a chance. Just kept them as an enemy for all these years, broke some unwritten promises, took some of their former states as allies. Now a lot of that, was self inflicted by Moscow, like former USSR states creating alliances with NATO and the West. But now look at what that has caused, basically a second period of being in a real Cold War with Moscow again. It’s just things like that where I find comparisons to the previous wars. I don’t think Putin is crazy like Hitler, or crazy like Stalin, or really anything like them, but I do think that he believes that Moscows influence, needs to be expanded, and that certain territories do belong to Russia. That is a problem, and history has taught us, it needs to be dealt with as soon as possible, because the longer you delay it, you’ll have to use worse and more consequential tactics to deal with the situation.

Uncontrolled wasn’t a good word to use, but I meant like more eractic, and quick to do things without thinking. I think at the end of the day, Russia would not engage in a war with NATO, because they know what would happen. No winners, and everyone loses. Belarus has a bunch of lunatics running the show. They have never really been an independent nation either, in the history of that region, until the USSR collapsed, so they don’t really understand how things work. I think they’re more like a Middle Eastern country. Just don’t know what to expect from them.

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No, Europe can’t handle this on their own. In fact, no other country, other than the US, has the ability to try and reason when it comes to these conflicts.

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Then those countries deserve to lose because their governments have failed them. If you refuse to fight for yourself, then you deserve to be ruled by people who will. Europe has acted like spoiled children for 70 years. They know that if they continue to act irresponsible that daddy America will bail them out and do the hard work for them. Just like kids refusing to do the dishes until the responsible adult does it for them, Europe is depending on America to bail them out. It is precisely this coddling which is WHY they're unprepared, and why they won't prepare themselves. Why would they do the hard work when America will do it for them?

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If we stayed out of Europe, they would nuke each other into oblivion.

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Okay...good. It's their continent. Let them do what they want with it. Why would I care if they nuked each other into ash?

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They all have a lot of history, and have always battled for lands that they believe to be theirs. There’s lots of hatred between countries in Europe, and they have a long history of fighting wars.

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Which lends itself to the theory that the U.S. acting as good cop isn't sustainable long-term.

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Now, we shouldn’t intervene in places, where it’s full of third world countries and animals, who still think we’re in the Middle Ages, like the Middle East. Those animals just need to be left alone.

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Sounds pretty racist. So, people aren't entitled to national sovereignty and self-determination if they have dark-colored skin?

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. Now of course, this comes at a time, when we have very irresponsible spending in our government, and give money foolishly to countries who shouldn’t get it. Like giving millions of dollars for the gays in Pakistan. That’s BS. I get that

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So you get why handing out $40 billion to The Ukraine while the U.S. is dealing with a serious supply chain crisis that's about to cause major food shortages seems like a bad idea? That $40 billion could be going to increasing oil and gas production, building out LNG export capacity, sourcing fertilizer component feed stocks, opening up more arable land for cultivation, building irrigation pipelines, upgrading ports and railroad terminals to ease bottlenecks, etc.

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but I think the Ukraine conflict is one of those deals, where we’re better off trying to deal with this conflict, in this way, right now

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Why is The Ukraine's border with Russia more important than the United State's border with Mexico?

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History has taught us that staying too isolated from certain regions, is a bad thing

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Has it? It seems to teach that when America entrenches itself into European politics and uses trade policy as a weapon to attempt to police foreign nations' behaviors, the U.S. gets dragged into conflicts it has no business being involved in.

It seems to me that when the U.S. maintains free trade all over the world, we see a lot more peace than when we try sanctions. Sanctioning Imperial Japan forced Pearl Harbor, as being cut off from the international market forced them to invade American, British, French, and Dutch colonies in the Pacific in order to unlock critical resources. If those resources were still being traded to them, they would not have needed to invade most of the Pacific.

The U.S. practiced the Monroe Doctrine for a long time, and it only enabled the U.S. to experience some of the fastest economic, population, and territorial growth in the history of the World going from a backwater to a World Power practically overnight. Let the Europeans do what they do, and let's do what we do here in America.

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I think a World War would break out, not from Russia starting to bomb a NATO country, or vice versa, but an uncontrollable Russian ally like Belarus, who has been very sketchy lately, doing something stupid. From what I’ve read, it seems that many countries like Poland, the Baltics, and others, don’t like the Belarusian people, and I think Belarus intervening militarily in Ukraine, could cause Poland, Finland, Sweden, or a Baltic State, to intervene in Belarus. That would drag Russia into defending Belarus, and there’s how Russia and NATO go to war with each other. Or Belarus doing something to Poland is possible. Is that not similar to how WWI started? It wasn’t the major powers going to war with each other, but the smaller ones who started all the fighting. I don’t think the powder keg is in Ukraine, but in the Belarus, Baltic, and Polish regions.

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Belarus joining the fight is a game changer. It is then a regional war and not a special military operation. If there are any people in Belarus who don't want this, I hope the CIA is working with them.

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It just seems to me, that these former Soviet States, are not going to be controlled by Moscow ever again, and I think they would be the most eager to go to war with Russia or Belarus, than the rest of the NATO countries would be. All the former NATO countries, would rather be attacked before starting war with Russia. These former USSR countries, might would be the aggressors here, because they will not be under Russian rule again. They’ll fight to the death before being under Russian rule again. We don’t understand that.

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If things escalate rapidly into regional war it will be because the Baltics and Polish push back. I don't know how the US can put that genie back in the bottle. The rest of Europe will be aghast when they realize they can't convince the Baltic/Polish to sit on their hands. Especially Poland because they are a large country.

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After the fall of the USSR, we didn’t really give Russia a chance. Just kept them as an enemy for all these years, broke some unwritten promises, took some of their former states as allies. Now a lot of that, was self inflicted by Moscow, like former USSR states creating alliances with NATO and the West. But now look at what that has caused, basically a second period of being in a real Cold War with Moscow again. It’s just things like that where I find comparisons to the previous wars. I don’t think Putin is crazy like Hitler, or crazy like Stalin, or really anything like them, but I do think that he believes that Moscows influence, needs to be expanded, and that certain territories do belong to Russia. That is a problem, and history has taught us, it needs to be dealt with as soon as possible, because the longer you delay it, you’ll have to use worse and more consequential tactics to deal with the situation.

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There was a little window where the Russians had a warm and fuzzy about their prospects as a free democratic country. Yeltsin died and our KGB guy rose to power. Game over. I don't think the Russians have any concept of how to be a free people. All they need is vodka and propaganda and they are good.

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Okay...good. It's their continent. Let them do what they want with it. Why would I care if they nuked each other into ash?

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king bob, as great a poster as you are and as easy as it was to say that, it is just your fantasy. A complete fantasy pipe dream.

The Russians captured a nuclear power plant and are holding the workers there hostage asking for a ransom from their families. They are also threatening to drain the cooling pools to the reactors because they think Ukrainians may have hidden weapons underwater in the cooling pools. I guess they don’t care about having another Chernobyl because without the water to cool the reactors then it can have a meltdown. Real professional soldiers those Russians……

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A complete fantasy pipe dream.

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It's also a complete fantasy that the European nations are going to start nuking each other. Nukes are the ultimate pyric victory. It's not going to happen. The Russia of 2022 is not Germany in 1939. They're not even the Soviet Union of 1989. They're barely a threat at all to any country that decides to have a backbone and resist. France is plenty combat ready to take on Russia if they choose to. Germany is re-arming. Poland has a very capable military. The Russian army that can't secure the Donbas isn't going to suddenly be able to blitzkrieg the Baltic states and parade tanks beneath the Arc de Triumph.

There's no Napoleon leading the Russian military right now. They suck at logistics, they're exhausting all of their modern equipment, and have spent months barely progressing a few miles against a completely "inferior" military. Europe doesn't need our help, and if they do, it's only because they're counting on us to do for them what they refuse to do for themselves.

It's time to be the adults and let the children deal with the consequences of their actions. It's time for Europe to learn how to do its own dishes and laundry again.

If we really wanted to help Europe, we would be working on opening up LNG facilities so we can ship them natural gas and bipass Russia's pipelines. We would be opening more oil exploration here so that Europe is no longer dependent upon Russian oil. We would be developing infrastructure for fertilizer and converting ethanol corn fields to producing wheat and food corn to ease the food shortage.

The issue is Europe wants to treat Russia as an antagonist while also being utterly reliant on Russia for fuel, and the Ukraine for food and fertilizer. The solution to the conflict goes beyond militarily stopping Russian expansionism in the region, but in making Europe no longer reliant upon Russian and Ukrainian imports.

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Sanctioning Imperial Japan forced Pearl Harbor, as being cut off from the international market forced them to invade American, British, French, and Dutch colonies in the Pacific in order to unlock critical resources.

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Your timeline is nonsensical. The embargo of oil was in response to Japan's moves in Southeast Asia, not due to them.

The 'Moral Embargo' started in 1938 due to Japan's use of airplanes against civilians in China. That embargo was non-binding and finally became official with the Export Control Act in July of 1940.

Japan began occupying French Indochina only after the French fell in Europe, which was in September 1940. The first official embargo didn't start until then and included oil, scrap iron and steel. Japan and the US were negotiating about sanctions during the spring of 1941, though the US was unhappy about the Tripartite Pact. When the Japanese moved into Southern Indochina after signing the Protocol Concerning Joint Defense and Joint Military Occupation with Vichy France was when the oil embargo began in full. The US was infuriated that it appeared the Japanese were not negotiating in good-faith.

The Japanese had already made the decision to move south after a battle in 1939 with the Soviets. This changed their 'Hokushin-ron' doctrine of northern expansion to the 'Nanshin-ron' of southern expansion. From that point, the Japanese had calculated that the US would be a major impediment to its goals in Southeast Asia, but they miscalculated at several steps.