re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

quote:

---

You poor little child. You lie, get called out and take your anger out on others.

Just admit the only border you care about is the one between Russia and Ukraine

---

Sometimes I find it hard to believe that you are a grown-arse man, Roger.

quote:

---

I figured you would just lie and say you respect the rule of law regarding borders, but you surprised me and are fighting tooth and nail, which is even more fun.

---

How can we even get to that part if you refuse to acknowledge the difference between moving a border and crossing one? I don't know whether you're too dishonest to stop conflating these topics, or too stupid to realize you're doing it.

quote:

---

Oh, so it’s a fair request for Zelensky to ask for SEVEN HUNDRED AND FIFTY BILLION DOLLARS and we should consider it. How much of that 750 billion dollars should we pay?

---

Do you think it will happen immediately, all at once? Do you understand how investments work?

quote:

---

Meanwhile it’s a shite show over here, especially with the border. Pure America Last with you bunch of LARPers.

---

It's myopia with you all the way through. We have to read through mounds of your hysterical arguments without you ever acknowledging any of the logical inconsistencies you've put yourself into.

Nations can do more than two things at once. If I could trade you for one of those immigrants, I'd do it in a second.

quote:

---

Taiwan being invaded will lead to societal collapse. It’s apples and oranges. We’re fricked either way with that.

---

We already established it won't. Why you won't acknowledge that Taiwan doesn't have some secret ability in terms of its chips, nor would an invasion occur in a vacuum, is more evidence that you are way out of your element here, and should focus on things you understand, like pop culture.

quote:

---

Wrong. You just don't want to stick to the actual meaning of the words you said.

Not my problem, Che. You have major communication issues.

---

Again, I can't help it that you don't understand meaning in context. Have you ever opened a dictionary? Did you ever notice that many words have more than one meaning? I feel like we need to start here at the kindergarten level before we move on to more advanced exercises like figuring out what "respect borders" means in the context of nations at war vs the context of immigration.

quote:

---

Well, you have to take into account how the world has fundamentally changed since the collapse the the Warsaw Pact and the Soviet Union. At that time you had two diametrically opposed ideologies, both wanting to to ultimately eradicate the other. Thankfully that opposition never metastasized into WWIII or we most likely would not be having this conversation.

As for my view of the Soviet Union, they were pure evil in the same way Nazi Germany was evil. I’m glad both were relegated to the dustbin of history.

Which that brings us to today. The USSR is gone and what we have now is the Russian Federation under Putin, who is for all intents and purposes has assumed dictatorial powers.

---

I meant more in terms to the validity of the threat. Clearly we took the threat of soviet military power very seriously during the Cold War, but I think the war in Ukraine has partly called that into question. Their traditional military forces have shown to be inefficient, clumsy, and seemingly vastly behind western weapons tech. Sure, after a lot of adjustments to align operational objectives with their supply logistics, they made advances in the East, but they were an abject failure in the first phase of the war biting off more than they could chew. But for 75 years we never would have batted an eye that their first phase was too much for them. In your view in particular given your closeness to Cold War and threat of Soviet military, do you think we gave them too much credit then? Did we in some sense, as a nation, buy into the propaganda too much then?

quote:

---

So that brings us to what we need to do. Again, the answers are simple, though not popular:

1. Convince Ukraine to sue for peace, even if it means giving over chunks of the eastern part of Ukraine. The longer the war goes, the more of Ukraine Russia will occupy. All that can be done now is to stop the bleeding. If Ukraine can be given time to recover her strength, she would be a valuable NATO ally, especially if she’s backed by a strong NATO force to back her up. At that point, Putin’s bluff will have been called. He’d know that any resumption in hostility would have little to no chance of success.

2. Build up American and Western energy production, particularly oil and natural gas. The more oil and natural gas we produce, the lower the price of these two global commodities will go. The lower the price of oil & natural gas on the global market, the weaker Russia will become. Russia is dependent on oil and natural gas exports. When revenue from these two are high, Russia flourishes. When the price of these two is close, Russia is weakened economically.

So, there’s your answer on how to stop Russia.

1. Stop the fighting in Ukraine and preserve as much of Ukrainian strength as possible.

2. Build up Ukraine as a strong NATO member while also backing her up with a strong NATO force.

3. Castrate Russia economically by driving down the global price of oil and natural gas.

In other words, welcome to the Second Cold War. Our only other option is to retreat into 1920s style isolationism. But the first step is to end this war ASAP. The only country benefiting from it is Russia.

---

Thank you for your response. I think this gives much more context to your opinion of it being better for Ukraine to sue for peace. In the grand scheme of things my opinion doesn’t matter, but I think you made good points that are much more thought out than most opposition points in here. To me this is the best sue for peace/stop helping Ukraine fight the war argument I’ve seen.

(no message)

quote:

---

Yes, but can we afford to invest?

---

Nope.

And no one knows what the return on "investment" will be. I imagine it will line the pockets of carpetbaggers from DC and NYC.

There are no fiscal conservatives anymore, evidently. Just throw money at emotional issues.

Military parody between East and West? Poland would push Russia’s crap in if they started fighting.

Yes, we need to get back to the previous policies of becoming energy independent. Biden isn’t doing that.

As for combating Russia, caving in won’t help. You have to beat them economically yes, but you have to stand up to them.

Russia is winning on the battlefield, but they are losing people, weapons, ammo and most of all street cred. They also created more enemies and woke up much if Europe to the danger to their East.

Winning like this can’t be good in the long run,