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re: Israel–Hamas War Discussion Thread: News Links On First Page
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:29 pm to Smeg
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:29 pm to Smeg
quote:
Yeah but this works both ways. Some people will still defend Israel even if it's proven to be deliberate by them.
Well, it may have been Israel.
It may have been deliberate.
They may also have had 100% justification for doing it.
In a conflict like this in an area with a population density like Gaza, there will be collateral damage from just about any military engagement.
If information like this, accurate or not, is going to sway someone from side to side every time it comes up they are going to be in for a rollercoaster ride.
I understand there are a lot of people who feel there should be peace at any cost in this and other conflicts but that always plays into the hand of the belligerent and IMO they should never be allowed to prevail as it just brings more belligerence.
1
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:29 pm to ned nederlander
well that is certainly a retarded fricking take.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:32 pm to ned nederlander
quote:
"The Palensians Had No Other Choice"
Its too early in the day to entertain that level of nonsense.
The Palestinians had all kinds of other choices. They were just hard ones, and they'd rather be violent than address their problems.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:33 pm to Thracken13
regardless of who lit the fuse, does this explosion clearly show how weapons are being kept inside their hospital?
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:35 pm to 1BamaRTR
quote:hamas leader is saying the US bombed the hospital. Who saw that coming?
Yeah most people will still believe it’s Israel at fault even if it’s proven not to be
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:36 pm to ned nederlander
quote:
The best revenge is continuing to exist and thrive.
I couldn’t imagine the public reaction if after 9/11, our government just said “Yeah, I think the best way to respond is to keep existing and that’s about it.”
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:37 pm to UFownstSECsince1950
it is hard to say - as others have stated, the lack of any secondary explosions makes it see as if it wasn't an ammo dump or munitions location - BUT it is possible the errant missle set off the cache all at once which would be pretty devastating.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:37 pm to Smeg
quote:
even if it's proven to be deliberate by them.
This post was edited on 10/17/23 at 4:41 pm
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:38 pm to UFownstSECsince1950
quote:
regardless of who lit the fuse, does this explosion clearly show how weapons are being kept inside their hospital?
Not necessarily. No one really needs this to know they do that regularly, though. There have been documented instances in the past of them doing it.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:41 pm to Grassy1
quote:
Should you feel openminded, spend 30 minutes listening to a professor who's parents were both in Nazi concentration camps, and has been studying this subject for 40 years. Jimmy Dore podcast, "The Palensians Had No Other Choice"
Yes Norman Finkelstein’s parents survived Nazi Germany, but they were also Marxists if not stalinists.
quote:
Finkelstein has said of his parents that "they saw the world through the prism of the Nazi Holocaust. They were eternally indebted to the Soviet Union (to whom they attributed the defeat of the Nazis), and so anyone who was anti-Soviet they were extremely harsh on".
They supported the Soviet Union's approval of the creation of the State of Israel, as enunciated by Andrei Andreyevich Gromyko, who said that Jews had earned the right to a state, but thought that Israel had sold its soul to the West and "refused to have any truck with it".
… One childhood friend recalls his mother's "emotional investment in left-wing humanitarian causes as bordering on hysteria".
… Subsequently, reading Noam Chomsky played a role in learning to apply the moral passions his mother bequeathed to him with intellectual rigor.
… According to Finkelstein, his involvement in the Israeli–Palestinian conflict began in 1982 when he and a handful of other Jews in New York protested against the Israeli invasion of Lebanon. He held a sign saying: "This son of survivors of the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising, Auschwitz, Maijdenek will not be silent: Israeli Nazis – Stop the Holocaust in Lebanon!"
… During the First Intifada, he spent every summer from 1988 in the West Bank as a guest of Palestinian families in Hebron and Beit Sahour
… Finkelstein has expressed solidarity with Hezbollah with respect to defensive actions.
“I was of course happy to meet the Hezbollah people, because it is a point of view that is rarely heard in the United States. I have no problem saying that I do want to express solidarity with them, and I am not going to be a coward of a hypocrite about it.”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Finkelstein
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:42 pm to ned nederlander
quote:
Do what you need to do to secure your borders and your people going forward
They are, by
quote:
moving major personnel into Gaza.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:44 pm to beerJeep
@MiddleEastEye
Xwitter
MEE does have a more pro-Palestinian slant, but I've found their coverage informative, though keeping their stance in the back of my mind.
quote:
Jordan’s foreign minister Ayman Safadi has called off the summit between the US, Egypt and Palestinian leaders scheduled for Wednesday
Xwitter
MEE does have a more pro-Palestinian slant, but I've found their coverage informative, though keeping their stance in the back of my mind.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:49 pm to LegendInMyMind
@IDF
Xwitter w/video
I wonder if they will back channel some of the evidence they have?
quote:
IDF Spokesperson RAdm. Daniel Hagari confirms: Islamic Jihad is responsible for the rocket that hit the hospital in Gaza.
Xwitter w/video
I wonder if they will back channel some of the evidence they have?
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:53 pm to Obtuse1
Wiley Hamas blames the Roadrunner.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 4:58 pm to ned nederlander
quote:Feel good bullshite that is demonstratively nonsense when applied to almost any other remotely comparable situation. Someone breaks into your home, murders your family, desecrates the remains, and your "revenge" is existing? GTFOH.
But this reaction is unfortunately part of why I hope Israel proceeds with caution. The best revenge is continuing to exist and thrive.
NVM the fact that it's not primarily about revenge. It's about making sure it never happens again.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 5:02 pm to beerJeep
Israel is small. It cannot survive without complete US support. They simply can’t root out Hamas, Islamic jihad, and whatever other organization will replace them root and stem without seriously compromising continued US support.
Do what you can from the air and with bombs, invest more in rapid response militias along border settlements, and make sure you can defend against the drone swarm terror attack that will surely come your way in the next 10 years.
There are no good choices here. But unless someone can tell me what is the exit ramp from a gaza invasion, I hope they don’t do it.
Do what you can from the air and with bombs, invest more in rapid response militias along border settlements, and make sure you can defend against the drone swarm terror attack that will surely come your way in the next 10 years.
There are no good choices here. But unless someone can tell me what is the exit ramp from a gaza invasion, I hope they don’t do it.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 5:04 pm to au4you
quote:I for one do think Israel is capable and probably considered such things.
It’s truly awful but the very fact that people don’t think Israel may be capable of doing this, is very concerning.
I, also, for one think it is called for with the military situation in such that I think the only way this is "won" is by doing such things as you have to "break" the population of Gaza as opposed to "winning them over".
Israel is about to take heavy casualties; if you're not in it to win it do not spend that blood and treasure. And unfortunately, as above, in it to win it doesn't really fit the rules on this one.
Unfortunately for the Israelis, unlike their neighbors and Iran, they have a leash. That leash is from being democratic where their enemies can and will treat their peoples as subjects and not citizens, as Hamas does the Gazans. They have no leash other than revolution and losing their own heads. For that reason it is logical to assume Israel would not do such things (while I would) and their enemies wouldn't hesitate.
So your complaint or point assume a level ground; equal rules. Hamas proved they are not playing by the same rules Oct. 7th, so if anyone gets the benefit of the doubt, and it is nothing more than that, it's Israel.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 5:04 pm to LegendInMyMind
It doesn’t appear to be much in the way of structural damage.
Posted on 10/17/23 at 5:06 pm to Havoc
@sentdefender
quote:
Initial Reports that Rioters in the Lebanese Capital of Beirut are attempting to reach the U.S. Embassy but that they are being prevented by the Lebanese Army and Police.
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