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Message
re: Is Game Warden activity Constitutional
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:46 am to brass2mouth
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:46 am to brass2mouth
quote:
They stop anybody that is engaging in the recreational activity of hunting/fishing.
Outside of that they have to abide by the same rules as a regular cop.
Now, an argument can be made that you don’t need a license but that’s a different topic.
Not required. They will check you at a boat ramp regardless of what you are doing. Prior to the boat going in the water. Happens here in Georgia and South Caolina on the regular because for about 4 years they have been on limited mileage and hours on vehicles and boats LOL. I was checked for a fishing license Saturday afternoon by a Georgia Game warden with a Licoln County Deputy present, at a boat ramp, as I pulled up and started untying my boat. I did not have a rod and reel in my possession. I had done some maintenance on my boat and during a lull in the monsoon I was testing it out. Guy insisted on seeing a fishing license, which I had and gave him, and my drivers license, again which I gave him, boat registration (probably legit), which I gave him, and a parking pass, which I gave him. This is so normal that to quastion it would mean you may as well not even attempt to hunt or fish. I know that allowing them to abuse rights this way encouages it but I ain't fighting that fight.
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Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:48 am to PaperPaintball92
quote:
If people didn't act like assholes and abuse nature, there would not be need for game wardens.
Some truth in this. People trespassing on private property is a huge issue. But there'd be way less nature and wildlife if it were not for people hunting and fishing. They could easily police the community by being professional and not violating anyone's rights. They choose not to do either all too often..
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:49 am to Ten Bears
quote:Were you supposed to band the quail? Hunted pen raised pheasants in Texas that were banded by the owner was wondering if this was the correct way abide by the law. Still think you could only kill a limit of em.
license to shoot pen birds on my own property
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:55 am to thelawnwranglers
Last November, a game warden crashed my daughter's wedding on our high-fenced property. Can through a side gate that was unlocked because I had heavy trucks using that way to enter property. He drove about a mile into my place before he encountered a florist working at ceremony site.
I caught him at that point and asked who he was and what he was doing on my place. He said it was big place and had never been on it; thought he might find some deer hunters.
I told him we were having a wedding and that he was trespassing and to leave immediately, which he did. I talk to his supervisor and he regional captain the next week and they told me they (game wardens) could go anywhere they wanted, whenever they wanted, for absolutely no reason other than idle curiosity.
I believe they violated a reasonable expectation of privacy and my fourth amendment protections again illegal search and seizure.
They had no probable cause, no suspicion or hunch of any kind that there was even any game/fish activity. They could not even see a person, vehicle, building or anything. Just an unlocked gate and an empty pasture yet he opened the gate and drove in simply to see what was over the hill.
I would still like to contest their claimed authority and ability to trump the fourth amendment. I don't think the founders felt a squirrel took precedence over a citizen.
I caught him at that point and asked who he was and what he was doing on my place. He said it was big place and had never been on it; thought he might find some deer hunters.
I told him we were having a wedding and that he was trespassing and to leave immediately, which he did. I talk to his supervisor and he regional captain the next week and they told me they (game wardens) could go anywhere they wanted, whenever they wanted, for absolutely no reason other than idle curiosity.
I believe they violated a reasonable expectation of privacy and my fourth amendment protections again illegal search and seizure.
They had no probable cause, no suspicion or hunch of any kind that there was even any game/fish activity. They could not even see a person, vehicle, building or anything. Just an unlocked gate and an empty pasture yet he opened the gate and drove in simply to see what was over the hill.
I would still like to contest their claimed authority and ability to trump the fourth amendment. I don't think the founders felt a squirrel took precedence over a citizen.
This post was edited on 3/27/23 at 9:43 am
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:56 am to VernonPLSUfan
quote:
quote:
license to shoot pen birds on my own property
Were you supposed to band the quail? Hunted pen raised pheasants in Texas that were banded by the owner was wondering if this was the correct way abide by the law. Still think you could only kill a limit of em.
Most states have a license for the owner of the bird that are shot on preserves that allows a paying customer to hunt. The birds are supposed to be banded. Most limits are in place by the owner, not the state. The exception, in my experience, is with pen raised waterfowl preserves which always require a federal stamp and steel shot because it is usually not possible to keep migrant waterfowl out of such areas. Birds that are not common in an area like Pheasants and Huns in Alabama, for example, are only there because someone put them there. Quail, native to the area, may be different.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:56 am to Animal
What is a game warden? Kind of like a referee in basketball?
Posted on 3/27/23 at 8:56 am to AwgustaDawg
quote:
quote:
It's no different than requiring a driver's license on the street. A cop can ask for that when he pulls you over.
Only if he can articulate what crime it is he is investigating and has reasonable suspicion of a crime. Not a very high bar but game wardens are not limited by that, apparently, because fishing is not a crime and they have no reasonable suspicion to suspect everyone of committing a crime yet they will always ask everyone for a license, and usually a drivers license to prove residency.
True game warden story concerning license checks. A group of guys we grew up with were deer hunting on Paper Company land years ago. Some had their state hunting license, but no Paper Company permit, some had both, some may have had neither (they were a pretty rowdy bunch). A game warden stopped them, and began checking licenses and permits. One of the guys suddenly took off running, and the game warden pursued him on foot, and finally caught him after a long chase. The game warden triumphantly demanded to see his license and permit. He was stunned when the guy produced both. When asked why he ran, he said he just felt like running. Naturally all the folks without licenses and permits were long gone by the time the game warden got back to check the rest of them.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:04 am to Tupelo
quote:
True game warden story concerning license checks. A group of guys we grew up with were deer hunting on Paper Company land years ago. Some had their state hunting license, but no Paper Company permit, some had both, some may have had neither (they were a pretty rowdy bunch). A game warden stopped them, and began checking licenses and permits. One of the guys suddenly took off running, and the game warden pursued him on foot, and finally caught him after a long chase. The game warden triumphantly demanded to see his license and permit. He was stunned when the guy produced both. When asked why he ran, he said he just felt like running. Naturally all the folks without licenses and permits were long gone by the time the game warden got back to check the rest of them.
LOL. I have heard variations of that one many times. Probably has happened a lot.
I know an old boy who will get fighting mad if you question the validity of this story. He had just shot a deer about a mile from his truck when the man steps out and asks for a tag and license. He said he didn't have a license. Warden tells him to drag the deer to the truck. He tells the warden if he wants the deer drug to the truck the warden can do it himself. Warden does so and when they get to the truck dude reaches in his wallet, produces tag and license and proceeds to tag the deer. Gets written anyway for not producing license when asked and not tagging deer before moving it.
Goes to court. Says he forgot his wallet was in his pocket. Judge dismisses since he did indeed have a legit license. Judge asks about the tag. Dude explains he never moved the deer....the warden did. Warden had already said this in open court. Judge dismisses that charge also and chastises the warden for moving the deer LOL. I don't know if its true or not...I have heard variations of this minus the court details. Dude who tells it will get fighting mad if anyone questions it...especially if he has been drinking....
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:22 am to AwgustaDawg
Many many years ago, my dad and about 6 of his buddies were stopped by some wardens after an opening day pouledeau hunt. They had killed their limit of 105. The warden asked them to count them and my dad's buddies told the warden that he would have to count them. When the warden got to the 30's, some of the hunters started saying random numbers to screw the warden up. The warden lost count so he told them to get their drunk arse out of there.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:24 am to AwgustaDawg
I was hunting a beaver swamp accessible by a navigable waterway and a public highway in Georgia in 1985 with a friend who eventually became the head of the Georgia Department of Natural Resources (game warden boss among other things). At the time he was merely a lowly wildlife biologist. We got back to the hill about 10 minutes after shooting hours having not fired a shot but the folks on the private property close to us were having a time shooting a wood duck roost on the same river. When the boat hits the hill the man puts a boot on the bow and says something to the effect of "why y'all shooting so late"? Meanwhile the shooting is still going on. We explain we ain't fired a shot. Warden says he knows better, saw us do it. We were about 30 minutes from the hill where we were hunting, no way he could see us from the road but could see us for at least shooting hours putting back to the hill. The guy with me begins to litigate and the warden ain't having none of it...says he will take us straight to jail or write a ticket, our choice. Of course we take the ticket.
Dude with me worked for the same agency. Talked to the wardens boss at the state level. They dismissed his ticket but not mine. I had to go to court. The first time the warden didn't show. The judge's only concern was asking the bailiff if I had been hunting out of his blind. Bailiff said no, we were boat hunting. Judge postpones to a later date. I show up again, no warden. Postponed again. Show up the third time and judge is about to postpone again until the DA tells him I have been there 3 times, the fine was way less than the cost to postpone again and they dropped the charges.
2 weeks later me and another friend were hunting the same area. Left about noon because of rain. Got to the hill and the same warden and a young trainee were going through my truck. I asked them what they were doing and was told they were looking for illegal game. I got pissed and told them to get the frick out of my truck. Older warden draws his weapon, points it about 6 inches from my face and says he can shoot me dead and there ain't nothing I can do and he wouldn't miss a paycheck. The younger warden talks the moron down and insists that they leave. They do so. We go about 1/2 a mile and get pulled over by a local sherrif. Said they had been told that someone had pulled a gun on someone. Went through my truck with a fine tooth comb while I am handcuffed in the police car, my buddy handcuffed sitting on the tail gate. Game warden comes around without young trainee. They have a discussion. After about 90 minutes of being in the car handcuffed they release us with no ticket, nothing. Tell us next time to not be assholes. File a formal complaint with the county and the state. Dude that becomes head of DNR in Georgia sends state a letter detailing his side of the first encounter. County does nothing, state issues some sort of reprimand to the warden.
That summer I am fishing on the river and the warden comes up and tells me that he don't care who I know he can do anything he wants to in "His" county. he does not, however, check my license or anything...just wanted me to know he wasn't skeered of me and my "connections".
Filed another complaint with the state. Was told to stop provoking the warden by staying out of his area LOL. I did just that....I like to hunt and fish but three encounters with a power hungry state employee is enough for me. That game warden finally retired. He was well known in West Georgia for similar actions. How he kept a job is beyond me but you can bet he stepped and fetched for anyone who could challenge his authority in Carroll County, Georgia.
Dude with me worked for the same agency. Talked to the wardens boss at the state level. They dismissed his ticket but not mine. I had to go to court. The first time the warden didn't show. The judge's only concern was asking the bailiff if I had been hunting out of his blind. Bailiff said no, we were boat hunting. Judge postpones to a later date. I show up again, no warden. Postponed again. Show up the third time and judge is about to postpone again until the DA tells him I have been there 3 times, the fine was way less than the cost to postpone again and they dropped the charges.
2 weeks later me and another friend were hunting the same area. Left about noon because of rain. Got to the hill and the same warden and a young trainee were going through my truck. I asked them what they were doing and was told they were looking for illegal game. I got pissed and told them to get the frick out of my truck. Older warden draws his weapon, points it about 6 inches from my face and says he can shoot me dead and there ain't nothing I can do and he wouldn't miss a paycheck. The younger warden talks the moron down and insists that they leave. They do so. We go about 1/2 a mile and get pulled over by a local sherrif. Said they had been told that someone had pulled a gun on someone. Went through my truck with a fine tooth comb while I am handcuffed in the police car, my buddy handcuffed sitting on the tail gate. Game warden comes around without young trainee. They have a discussion. After about 90 minutes of being in the car handcuffed they release us with no ticket, nothing. Tell us next time to not be assholes. File a formal complaint with the county and the state. Dude that becomes head of DNR in Georgia sends state a letter detailing his side of the first encounter. County does nothing, state issues some sort of reprimand to the warden.
That summer I am fishing on the river and the warden comes up and tells me that he don't care who I know he can do anything he wants to in "His" county. he does not, however, check my license or anything...just wanted me to know he wasn't skeered of me and my "connections".
Filed another complaint with the state. Was told to stop provoking the warden by staying out of his area LOL. I did just that....I like to hunt and fish but three encounters with a power hungry state employee is enough for me. That game warden finally retired. He was well known in West Georgia for similar actions. How he kept a job is beyond me but you can bet he stepped and fetched for anyone who could challenge his authority in Carroll County, Georgia.
This post was edited on 3/27/23 at 9:57 am
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:26 am to DamnGood86
quote:
I believe they violated a reasonable expectation of privacy and my fourth amendment protections again illegal search and seizure.
Me too
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:28 am to CootKilla
quote:
Many many years ago, my dad and about 6 of his buddies were stopped by some wardens after an opening day pouledeau hunt. They had killed their limit of 105. The warden asked them to count them and my dad's buddies told the warden that he would have to count them. When the warden got to the 30's, some of the hunters started saying random numbers to screw the warden up. The warden lost count so he told them to get their drunk arse out of there.
Had similar experience happen in high school on the Coosa River in Rome, Georgia. A buddy and were wearing the crappie out and had a bunch (50 fish limit then, 30 now). Game warden checks us and asks how many we got. We have NO idea but pretty sure we're under 100. Tells us we gotta count them. We start but its not an easy task LOL. After starting and stopping several times he finally tells us just to leave and take them with us. We do, thankfully and when we started cleaning fish we had 89.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:32 am to AwgustaDawg
quote:
LOL. I have heard variations of that one many times. Probably has happened a lot.
That's true. If an idea occurs to one person, there's a good chance somebody else has done much the same before (or will in the future). There was a similar instance that happened in our community regarding illegal whisky (moonshine). The authorities handcuffed most of the people involved, then went after another of the group. While they were gone, one of my uncles wandered by, and took all of the five gallon jerrycans of whisky that had been confiscated. There was no evidence, so they just let all the people go.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 9:33 am to Ten Bears
quote:
Ah don’t think so. I raise about 5000 quail on my property. Didn’t think I needed a license to shoot pen birds on my own property without a license.
I was wrong.
Well, there's no way you can prove that those birds didn't come from off your property. If you have a pond that isn't fed by a body of water off your property, you can 100% fish without a license.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 10:03 am to TexasTiger33
quote:Wrong.
Ironically, the Constitution is what grants each state the right to enact and enforce such regulations (i.e., states' rights).
CON LAW I
Posted on 3/27/23 at 10:04 am to thelawnwranglers
Not sure if it is or not, but I wouldn’t frick with them. Especially in Florida.
If they think you are messing with the gators, they can frick you up financially.
If they think you are messing with the gators, they can frick you up financially.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 10:20 am to DamnGood86
quote:then do so. Folks with the means should absolutely fight this shite for the greater good.
I would still like to contest their claimed authority and ability to trump the fourth amendment. I don't think the founders felt a squirrel took precedence over a citizen.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 10:28 am to redstickrick
quote:
This is also not true. Louisiana state code describes navigable waterways as property of the state. When is why they can enforce fishing laws in private ponds. Don’t agree with it again but that’s the their legal theory.
NOPE
quote:
Louisiana Revised Statute 56:27
§27. Management and harvesting of fish in private ponds exempt from statutory limitations; permits; exceptions
A. Except as provided in Sub-sections B and C of this Section, the management and harvest or taking of fish in privately owned man made ponds or impoundments shall not be subject to statutory limitations as to the kind, number or size of fish which may be harvested or taken, or as to the method of harvesting or taking fish, or seasons or other limitations, restrictions, prohibitions or regulations governing the management and harvest or taking of fish, but shall be governed by administrative rules and regulations of the commission, and the commission may issue permits to each private owner therefor.
B. Statutory and administrative regulations governing or prohibiting the sale or exchange of game fish shall apply to game fish harvested or taken from privately owned man made ponds or impoundments.
C. Sub-section A of this Section does not apply to ponds or impoundments built within the basin of a continuously flowing river, bayou or other stream of water.
Added by Acts 1960, No. 127, §§1 to 3.
Posted on 3/27/23 at 10:30 am to thelawnwranglers
quote:The Constitution is a piece of paper and is treated as such by those in charge.
Is Game Warden activity Constitutional
Posted on 3/27/23 at 10:33 am to thelawnwranglers
quote:
If it's your property can you tell them f off
Check out the "open fields doctrine" (I think that's what its called) - it gives some scary latitude to Mr. Green Jeans....
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