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re: If you have kids starting to search for college/career... what is left worth pursuing?
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:39 am to Deactived
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:39 am to Deactived
quote:
No one uses numbers like that to talk about pay.
If you tell me a job pays 100k, that doesnt mean its actually 75k and 25k of benefits. Its 100k and if you have benefits, theyre not just randomly added to that number
I mean if thats the case, every guy that works for a refinery could add $30+ dollars an hour to their pay just for the insurance if they are using the ppo plan
1
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:45 am to Deactived
quote:
No one uses numbers like that to talk about pay.
If you tell me a job pays 100k, that doesnt mean its actually 75k and 25k of benefits. Its 100k and if you have benefits, theyre not just randomly added to that number
You are correct, most employees do not. ALL employers do because they have to know exactly what an hour of an employees labor costs THEM. Benefits are not a bonus, they are all earned by the employee or the employee will soon be an ex-employee. The point is that were you to compare a job where an employee made $100k and their health and retirement benefits came out of that $100K a year, as most peoples do, at least in part, they would be making about the same thing as a Union Tradesman at $40 an hour working 50 weeks a year 40 hours a week because the union tradesman would have the same (in most cases better because they will have one or more DPBPs and a retirement savings account) and earning $80k in their pocket. I promise you 90% of union tradesmen do not look at wages this way either...because all they see is what their earnings and take home pay is, they forget about their various pensions and health and welfare benefits that they earn but are no itemized on their check every Thursday.
In most cases if I tell you your job pays $100k a year you would understand that outside of any matching retirement savings you elect that is exactly what you will be making and at least some of the costs of your benefits will be coming out of that $100k a year. That is not the case with Union Tradesmen. At the end of the day an employee MUST earn every penny it takes to keep them employed lest they become an ex-employee...but there is a lot of wiggle room in what is called wages and what an employee earns.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:45 am to concrete_tiger
I have businesses in the trades. Going to encourage my kids to go that route when it’s time. So much opportunity out there for young ppl to get in early and learn. I’d have them learn Spanish as the majority of the workforce is Hispanic. At some point there will be Hispanic kids that grow into blue collar business owners and they’ll take over…but there will always be opportunities there.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:46 am to Mo Jeaux
quote:
but this “everyone should go into the trades” thing that gets parroted on this board a lot is stupid (and seems like some sort of psyop to be honest).
It's not a psyop. The demographics have shifted in this board/site. Bigly
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:52 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
It's not a psyop. The demographics have shifted in this board/site. Bigly
problem is its not the people in the trades saying go into the trades. the ones that have worked the trades usually say different and the ones that do say they like it...are perfectly fine living in a trailer in VP so long as they can duck and squirrel hunt and attend Mardi Gras in Mamou every year. those are the types that think that is the perfect life
but most that are encouraging it seem to be cubicle bunnies that have never worked outside in the heat and cold before.
like i said before...seems the board has been run over with cubicle douches that cant even make mid management that some how missed their calling as blue collar business tycoons.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:53 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:more of a country music awards crowd these days
It's not a psyop. The demographics have shifted in this board/site. Bigly
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:57 am to lsu777
quote:
exactly. to make the type of money you are talking about it takes shite tons of OT working all over the country living in a fricking trailer.
better off going to work in the oilfield. make more and same shitty lifestyle
but sure trades just write their ticket....to a 50k a year job working their asses off in the heat and cold broken down by 50
or working 84 hours a week living in god knows where while someone else fricks your wife and not seeing your kids but one week a month at best.....sounds like a great life i want to encourage my kids to go into
never change OT, never change. like someone else said...bunch of cubicle douches who missed their calling as blue collar tycoons
I have been on both sides of the fence...I have chased white lines and overtime all over the country working with my tools...in RTW states and in closed shop states. I am a 5th generation member of the same IBEW local I belong to today (I will never give up my ticket because I can put butter beans in the pot with it anytime I need to). I knew when I started in the trade I was not going to be 65 years old trying to run 4" rigid pipe with a 26 year green as a gourd foreman acting like he was the only thing keeping the shop in business. I went to college and trade school simultaneously and transitioned into management pretty early on so I could earn a good living AND not have to chase white lines and overtime to do so. It is a damned hard way to earn a living...anyone who says otherwise is a damned fool or ignorant. Its is just as disingenuous to claim that it is an ideal way to earn a 6 figure salary as it is to say it isn't possible to earn a 6 figure salary doing it. It is entirely possible and, depending on the state you are in it is actually pretty damned easy...but that ain't so in RTW states. If you live in a RTW state you are going to have more difficulty earning a living no matter what it is you do for a living.
There is this caveat...but it only works for about 1 in 100,000. There is a fantastic opportunity to work for yourself by learning a trade. It ain't for the feint of heart but many do it and many make a good living and some even approach true wealth.
You can also make a decent living with a trade without traveling and chasing OT. You aren't going to make $100K in your pocket for sure in a RTW state, it is entirely possible in states where RTW statutes do not exist. If you can live on $50-$60K a year in your pocket and enjoy being off work 3-4 months a year it is actually very doable. Hard to raise a family on that but people do it.
The true downside is most people can't do it into their 50s. Many find it impossible to do the work required at the volume required to keep pace with those in their 30s. If you are in management you have another valuable skill set but many never make the transition and wind up living pretty hard in their late 50s.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:58 am to BLM
quote:
have businesses in the trades.
I have a grandson who is wanting trade school His sister is the total opposite, and wants to attend an Ivy. I encourage them both.
Or you can get an education and learn trades
Gives you far more options
Posted on 2/6/24 at 11:59 am to sidewalkside
quote:
Anyone with a trade these days has a blank check as long as they are halfway reliable, dependable, and professional
Basically anything scalable where your only limitation is the hours in the day. Trades for sure are the way to go rn.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:00 pm to BLM
quote:
I have businesses in the trades. Going to encourage my kids to go that route when it’s time. So much opportunity out there for young ppl to get in early and learn. I’d have them learn Spanish as the majority of the workforce is Hispanic. At some point there will be Hispanic kids that grow into blue collar business owners and they’ll take over…but there will always be opportunities there.
That point happened about 40 years ago in most of the US west of the Mississippi and north of Texas.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:00 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:
Thank you. The trades can be a great career path for some, but this “everyone should go into the trades” thing that gets parroted on this board a lot is stupid (and seems like some sort of psyop to be honest).
The steady 20+ years of crap saying the market for coders is going to collapse definitely has that feel. We are on the cusp on the $200,000 mediocre corporate senior developer, and yet this steady inflation in salary has done nothing to quiet that shite.
It may just be a combination of ignorance and jealousy that feeds this phenomenon, but, intentional or not, it is a preemptive attack on the American middle class. All those people fighting for plumbing apprenticeships will remain relatively uneducated, poor, and easy to manipulate because of this steady diet of misinformation.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:01 pm to tgrbaitn08
quote:
Alabama is giving away free educations to Louisiana and out of state students that don’t even need the money. In some cases it’s cheaper to send them to Bama than it is to send them to LSU even with TOPS
Which is why we’re going to go visit. I’ve only heard great things about it, particularly with advising and student support. LSU advising sucks and for some majors is practically non-existent.
Troy also has very attractive financial packages for out of state students, from what I hear.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:02 pm to lsu777
quote:
No one uses numbers like that to talk about pay.
If you tell me a job pays 100k, that doesnt mean its actually 75k and 25k of benefits. Its 100k and if you have benefits, theyre not just randomly added to that number
I mean if thats the case, every guy that works for a refinery could add $30+ dollars an hour to their pay just for the insurance if they are using the ppo plan
The same people who do not understand that their compensation package includes every penny it takes to keep them employed are the kind of people who, when you ask how much they paid in federal income tax, will tell you how much refund they received. Misunderstanding ones personal finances is as American as apple pie and Chevrolet.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:02 pm to Swoozie
quote:
Which is why we’re going to go visit. I’ve only heard great things about it, particularly with advising and student support. LSU advising sucks and for some majors is practically non-existent.
Troy also has very attractive financial packages for out of state students, from what I hear.
as you should.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:03 pm to AwgustaDawg
quote:
The same people who do not understand that their compensation package includes every penny it takes to keep them employed are the kind of people who, when you ask how much they paid in federal income tax, will tell you how much refund they received. Misunderstanding ones personal finances is as American as apple pie and Chevrolet.
bro...you still count that when someone ask what you make or how much a position pays
you are hard headed af btw.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:05 pm to Old Money
quote:
Basically anything scalable where your only limitation is the hours in the day. Trades for sure are the way to go rn.
yep....lets work 12-16 hours day making 25 a year....great opportunity especially when you are 50.
the fricking idiots on this board
for all yall running your mouth about the trades are so great...spring is coming up and so are all the Turnarounds...go work just 2 and let me know how you like it and if you still think thats a path you would like your kids to go down.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:05 pm to Turnblad85
quote:
This is a business owner, not a tradesman. He makes his money off of tradesmen.
He didn't inherit his daddy's business though. In fact, his father was paying him peanuts, so he specifically went out on his own, temporarily destroying his relationship with his father. It was just him, the same shitty truck he drove in high school, and a toolbox. Every dime that he made went back into his business until he could afford to buy another truck and a guy to drive it. Then another. Then another. Dude's a straight hustler. Here's his driveway now.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:12 pm to lsu777
My grandparents and most of their friends were wildly successful greatest gen blue collar/small business owners (multiple waterfront homes, started snowbirding in their 50s, etc)… and they sent all of their kids to college, even if they wanted to join the family business. I always think back to that in these debates.
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:16 pm to Deactived
quote:
No one uses numbers like that to talk about pay.
Oh but they do
170k for ups drivers ring a bell?
Posted on 2/6/24 at 12:18 pm to Tantal
quote:
Every dime that he made went back into his business until he could afford to buy another truck and a guy to drive it. Then another. Then another. Dude's a straight hustler.
I don't have any problem with how he makes his money. He's probably a hustler and a good business owner. The reality is most people working in the trades, or in general, are *not capable of doing those things. Telling a kid to go into the trades because he will become a successful business owner is silly. Most likely the kid will muck about working with his back for a career.
You can't have a tribe full of chiefs.
This post was edited on 2/6/24 at 12:30 pm
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