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Started By
Message
re: Hospital nurse arrested after refusing illegal blood draw order
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:44 am to shel311
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:44 am to shel311
quote:
Sure, if you want your argument to be all over the place and just fit your narrative when you want it to
It's a case by case basis, you can't apply the same rules to every case.
1
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:45 am to Isabelle81
quote:
Wouldn't the unconscious person having been involved in a collision that left another dead be cause?
That fact, in and of itself, is not evidence of criminal wrongdoing.
quote:
I would hope so, since it could be many hours before the patient is conscious and if there is a drug or alcohol level in his system, it would be much diminished after many hours.
Nothing prevents the police from placing the unconscious person under arrest and getting a warrant. The fact that he/she is unconscious only prevents consent, not the other methods. Plus, you can prove intoxication outside of a blood test.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:45 am to Isabelle81
The patient was a third party, not the victim or the suspect
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:45 am to Isabelle81
Nvm
This post was edited on 9/1/17 at 10:47 am
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:46 am to NYNolaguy1
Mormons really hate the fire water, apparently!
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:46 am to Epic Cajun
quote:Sure you can!!!
you can't apply the same rules to every case.
I think that's a good spot to end this one on.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:47 am to LucasP
quote:
Your rights stop the second a cop tells you to do something.
Those are called authoritarian states.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:48 am to TigerV
quote:
Legal or not, that is the law and the agreement that the Police made with the hospital. He can't just go demand something, she would be fired and sued by the patient. What is worse is the hospital admin was on the phone telling him he is making a mistake and that they were on the way done there. Once they said that he flipped out and tried to cuff her and get the hell out of dodge. She was complete respectful and had documentation, he did not. F that guy
There is not a single argument, legal or ethical, that can be made in the cops defense. This is an egregious example of abuse of power.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:53 am to FalseProphet
quote:
I bet qualified immunity prevents her from ever getting a damn. It's the worst judicially-created doctrine ever, IMO. But, it's there, and it's going to stop her from getting a penny.
Not so fast...
It's a 42:1983 violation. You lose your "qualified immunity" when you violate someone's civil rights. At that point officer Dumbass becomes personally liable.
"Every person who, under color of any statute, ordinance, regulation, custom, or usage, of any State or Territory or the District of Columbia, subjects, or causes to be subjected, any citizen of the United States or other person within the jurisdiction thereof to the deprivation of any rights, privileges, or immunities secured by the Constitution and laws, shall be liable to the party injured in an action at law, suit in equity, or other proper proceeding for redress, except that in any action brought against a judicial officer for an act or omission taken in such officer’s judicial capacity, injunctive relief shall not be granted unless a declaratory decree was violated or declaratory relief was unavailable. For the purposes of this section, any Act of Congress applicable exclusively to the District of Columbia shall be considered to be a statute of the District of Columbia"
I'd have told him he had 30 seconds to release the cuffs or he could kiss his pension goodbye. If he didn't, I wouldn't pursuing it until he was jobless. Men have fought and dies for the last 241 years over behavior just like this. I'll b damned if I'm letting it happen to me or mine.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:53 am to MSMHater
quote:
How is it illegal to draw blood on an unconscious patient?
quote:
The same way it's illegal to perform any other medical procedure without consent. No consent, no cause, no warrant. The hospital policy is in place to prevent litigation against the hospital. And allowing a blood draw would be no different than allowing a drug test, aids test, or pregnancy test when the claim is filed. To the hospital admin, a pissed off cop is preferable to a claimant with a good case
The article didn't do a good job of clarifying the important point Nurse already mentioned: you can draw blood for the trauma work up/medical diagnosis & treatment.
You cannot draw specifically for BAC without a consent or warrant.
This whole thing could have been easily avoided with both parties getting what they wanted/needed. I'm sure they'd already drawn blood. Trauma protocol EVERYWHERE, with EVERY patient that hits the trauma bay--conscious, unconscious, hell even technically dead--gets two large bore IV accesses STAT for blood to be sent to the lab immediately and to start IV fluid resuscitation.
All they had to do was call the lab and ask them to add on a BAC to the blood they already had
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:54 am to NYNolaguy1
If you watch the video of the crash, there is NO QUESTION that the injured driver whose blood the cop wanted to pull was a victim. There was NO REASON to suspect him of shite. The pickup swerved into him last second. Makes these cops even huger pieces of shite.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:54 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:
Wubbels says blood cannot be taken from an unconscious patient unless the patient is under arrest, unless there is a warrant allowing the draw or unless the patient consents. The detective acknowledges in the footage that none of those requirements is in place, but he insists that he has the authority to obtain the draw, according to the footage.
He must have been bullied in middle school. Because NOW HE HAS AUTHORITY!!!
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:56 am to eitek1
quote:
If he didn't, I wouldn't pursuing it until he was jobless. Men have fought and dies for the last 241 years over behavior just like this. I'll b damned if I'm letting it happen to me or mine.
I guess that is close enough to English
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:57 am to BobRoss
quote:
If I was that nurse's husband I would want to kill that dude.
This
Posted on 9/1/17 at 10:59 am to Blizzard of Chizz
quote:
They were trying to railroad the victim from the start because they didn't want to be liable for injuries that resulted from their high speed chase.
Likely
Posted on 9/1/17 at 11:04 am to BobRoss
quote:
If I was that nurse's husband I would want to kill that dude.
In general, I'm a big LE supporter. But this guy was so far over the line he couldn't even see it anymore.
One of the physicians in that ER should have stepped in to help her. I know I would. You have to take care of your nurses.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 11:04 am to CrimsonTideMD
Great point CrimsonTideMD. The cops trying to get the blood is just like them trying to come into your house or vehicle without a warrant or consent.
Posted on 9/1/17 at 11:05 am to NYNolaguy1
nurse about to make BANK. LDS gonna get a 10% cut too.
that's where BLM fools fricked up. there are genuine grievances with the policing of our communities, and abuse of power, that most people could come together on, but when you make it about race, and us against them, one side will naturally get defensive.
that's where BLM fools fricked up. there are genuine grievances with the policing of our communities, and abuse of power, that most people could come together on, but when you make it about race, and us against them, one side will naturally get defensive.
This post was edited on 9/1/17 at 11:10 am
Posted on 9/1/17 at 11:29 am to SamuelClemens
quote:
quote:
They were trying to railroad the victim from the start because they didn't want to be liable for injuries that resulted from their high speed chase.
Likely
I don't really see any other explanation. These cops know damn well what happens in hospitals. They weren't clueless to the fact that the victim in this case would have likely been administered drugs by the hospital due to the nature of the accident. Bottom line is that they wanted a blood sample of a patient they knew would have drugs in his system for the sole purpose of trying to avoid liability for his injuries. The cop in the longer video all but acknowledges this when he starts talking to her about civil litigation. This was a huge cya on their part.
This post was edited on 9/1/17 at 11:30 am
Posted on 9/1/17 at 11:36 am to LucasP
I hope your not as big an assbite as you sound, if you are a 2x4 upside the head is called for
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