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Gulf "Dead Zone" now bigger than Connecticut. No hurricanes and Midwest sewage to blame
Posted on 8/10/21 at 1:52 am
Posted on 8/10/21 at 1:52 am
LINK
Shrimp prices: down [UP]
quote:
A “dead zone,” or an area of low to no oxygen, in the Gulf of Mexico has grown larger than Connecticut, creating an uninhabitable environment for some commercial marine life, and scientists are saying the sparse amount of tropical activity has played a role.
An hypoxic zone, also referred to as a dead zone, is formed when excess nutrients such as nitrogen and phosphorus from agriculture and sewage from cities and farms upstream wash into the Gulf. Algae then feeds on these nutrients during the warmer months, and when that algae dies and sinks to the Gulf's floor, the bacteria that then eats away at the large tangled masses depletes the oxygen in the surrounding water.
The resulting area of low oxygen is called a hypoxic zone, or a dead zone as it becomes unable to support marine life, and it forms in the Gulf every year. Not only can it harm local wildlife, but it can also financially impact fisheries.
The hypoxic area had previously been forecast to reach 4,880 square miles, but when scientists at Louisiana State University and at the Louisiana Universities Marine Consortium had conducted the annual survey from July 25 to Aug. 1, they found a few anomalies.
For one, the dead zone ended up measuring 6,334 square miles -- and while that doesn't appear much larger, the difference in square miles is roughly the size of Rhode Island.
The distribution of the low oxygen was also different from past years, with the area west of the Atchafalaya River larger than it had been in the past. Rabalais attributed this to southerly winds and the resulting currents, which would have pushed the outflow of fresh water back toward the shore and west of the Atchafalaya Delta.
This Atlantic hurricane season's sparse amount of tropical activity in the area may have also had a role. Over the past three years, wind directions, hurricane conditions or both have disrupted hypoxia formation and maintenance. This year, however, the Atlantic basin has been quiet for nearly a month following the dissipation of Elsa.
Rabalais added that there were also municipal water boards that could improve their sewage treatment, and the more that fossil fuels are used, the more the resulting nitrogen will find its way down the river. "We're all in this together," Rabalais said.
Shrimp prices: down [UP]
This post was edited on 8/10/21 at 2:00 am
13
Posted on 8/10/21 at 2:03 am to MrWalkingMan
I agree with this:
Not making the connection here:
quote:
Rabalais added that there were also municipal water boards that could improve their sewage treatment
Not making the connection here:
quote:
and the more that fossil fuels are used, the more the resulting nitrogen will find its way down the river.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 2:05 am to MrWalkingMan
Wonder what happened in 2016
Posted on 8/10/21 at 2:05 am to MrWalkingMan
Corn production, nitrogen fertilizer and gov't subsidies - or simply, ethanol.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 2:17 am to GumboPot
quote:Burning fossil fuels releases nitrogen oxides. Acid rain, half the country drains to the gulf. Does that connect?
Not making the connection here:quote:
and the more that fossil fuels are used, the more the resulting nitrogen will find its way down the river.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 3:02 am to Korkstand
quote:
Burning fossil fuels releases nitrogen oxides.
This is what catalytic converters are for.
But mass of nitrogen compounds from incomplete combustion in the air cannot be anywhere near the nitrogen compounds from farm runoff and poor or no wastewater treatment.
And for eutrophication to take place nitrogen is not the only nutrient needed. Phosphorus is pretty darn important. And fertilizers and surfactants are loaded with phosphorus compounds.
Phosphorus nor potassium (another nutrient important for eutrophication) are not internal combustion engine byproducts. I’m not saying the internal combustion engine does not contribute at all, I’m just saying nutrient runoff from farms and untreated or poorly treated sewerage is the main problem.
Maybe he was referring to the roads. Because after rains the pollution or nutrients that build up on the streets wash into the storm water systems and combine with the residential and farming nutrients loads.
This post was edited on 8/10/21 at 3:04 am
Posted on 8/10/21 at 5:31 am to MrWalkingMan
quote:
and the more that fossil fuels are used, the more the resulting nitrogen will find its way down the river.
Someone will need to explain this to me as fossil fuels want nitrogen removed from them prior to combustion.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 5:33 am to Korkstand
quote:
Burning fossil fuels releases nitrogen oxides. Acid rain, half the country drains to the gulf. Does that connect?
Acid rain is primarily SOx compounds turning into sulfuric acid I thought, hence sulfur recovery units in refineries and IMO 2020 regulations on marine traffic.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 5:37 am to GumboPot
EPA loves to target industrial sites and hammer them with new, tighter permits with regards to suspended solids and nitrogen and phosphorous limits, yet in the grand scheme of things, agriculture primarily and sewage secondarily are bigger contributors. Sewage isn’t even that bug if a culprit any longer as we have technology and capabilities to remove all N and P fairly regularly from it.
You mentioned agricultural runoff. That is a huge culprit along with essentially bottling up the river and not allowing it to disperse its nutrients evenly downstream.
You mentioned agricultural runoff. That is a huge culprit along with essentially bottling up the river and not allowing it to disperse its nutrients evenly downstream.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 5:42 am to MrWalkingMan
Pesticides are always being run into the Mississippi. It’s the primary runoff for a huge part of the country.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 5:58 am to MrWalkingMan
According to the graph, it doesn’t look like it’s really changed since 1985? Who knows what it looked like before that? This is like the global argument, the earth is always changing….
Yes people, I have bad knews for you, 7 billion homosapians is not going to keep the earth as is. We have an impact.
Yes people, I have bad knews for you, 7 billion homosapians is not going to keep the earth as is. We have an impact.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 7:37 am to GumboPot
quote:
This is what catalytic converters are for.
But mass of nitrogen compounds from incomplete combustion in the air cannot be anywhere near the nitrogen compounds from farm runoff and poor or no wastewater treatment.
And for eutrophication to take place nitrogen is not the only nutrient needed. Phosphorus is pretty darn important. And fertilizers and surfactants are loaded with phosphorus compounds.
Phosphorus nor potassium (another nutrient important for eutrophication) are not internal combustion engine byproducts. I’m not saying the internal combustion engine does not contribute at all, I’m just saying nutrient runoff from farms and untreated or poorly treated sewerage is the main problem.
And yet again Korkstand spews bullshite about a subject he knows nothing about.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 7:46 am to Oilfieldbiology
quote:
Acid rain is primarily SOx compounds turning into sulfuric acid I thought, hence sulfur recovery units in refineries and IMO 2020 regulations on marine traffic.
Hydrotreating to remove sulfur especially those for ULSD. I get that this is what you mean by sulfur units, but that is something else to take the H2S created by catalyst +hydrogen + mercaptans then stripped with amine and sent to sulfur units where the elemental sulfur is recovered.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 7:51 am to MrWalkingMan
Well that explains why the trout weren’t biting on Saturday
Posted on 8/10/21 at 7:53 am to MrWalkingMan
Posted on 8/10/21 at 7:54 am to GumboPot
quote:
This is what catalytic converters are for.
There are still NOx compounds released by cars. Of course this is typically thought to be a concern for low level ozone production. If you look at air pollution data, there is a significant difference in NOx from urban centers to rural areas.
However, I agree that Nancy is likely making a poor connection between fossil fuels and the dead zone. She’s the biggest name in dead zone research, as her and her husband made the original discovery. However, that doesn’t make her infallible.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 8:27 am to baldona
quote:
According to the graph, it doesn’t look like it’s really changed since 1985? Who knows what it looked like before that? This is like the global argument, the earth is always changing….
There is absolutely no way to show that without data from pre-1985 so this statement is just speculation. The immediate concern for us in South Louisiana is the fact that the hypoxic zone isn’t anywhere near levels needed for sustainable survival of gulf brown shrimp (F. aztecus).
Shrimping baws are STILL getting hammered by irresponsibility upstream. Despite what is said, it certainly doesn’t appear as if we are “all in this together.”
Posted on 8/10/21 at 9:06 am to Bmath
quote:
However, I agree that Nancy is likely making a poor connection between fossil fuels and the dead zone. She’s the biggest name in dead zone research, as her and her husband made the original discovery. However, that doesn’t make her infallible.
Nancy is probably really good a what she does and I support this kind of environmental science work because there is a direct cause and effect relationship between nutrient runoff and the dead zone and shows us how and where to target solutions. I just get frustrated when scientist use sloppy language (e.g., "the more that fossil fuels are used, the more the resulting nitrogen will find its way down the river"). Targeting the internal combustion engine byproducts is a waste of time and will not solve the dead zone problem. Whereas, for example, storm water capture and treatment will have a positive impact and we can start with crude cheap treatment like turning storm water retention ponds into oxidation ponds. I mean it was professors like Rabalais that would kick my arse (academically speaking) for being sloppy with scientific communications.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 9:10 am to GumboPot
Louisiana should be taxing other states for their water runoff that enters the Gulf of Mexico. Look what it has done to the coast line.
Posted on 8/10/21 at 9:14 am to broadhead
Runoff isn’t what has killed the coast line. Preventing deposition of silt, sand, and organic material as well as well as salt water intrusion due to man made canals and pipelines have done far more.
If the River were allowed to flood it’s southern delta with all of these nutrients, swamps and the coastline would be thriving. I mean, the nutrients are fertilizers after all.
If the River were allowed to flood it’s southern delta with all of these nutrients, swamps and the coastline would be thriving. I mean, the nutrients are fertilizers after all.
This post was edited on 8/10/21 at 9:15 am
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