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re: Electricians - why are high-voltage power lines always exposed?
Posted on 1/14/19 at 3:20 pm to TDsngumbo
Posted on 1/14/19 at 3:20 pm to TDsngumbo
They are insulated when they go underground or get near the ground. No point insulating them when run overhead. It is just extra cost and weight the poles wouldn't handle well.
This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 3:20 pm
Posted on 1/14/19 at 3:52 pm to soccerfüt
quote:
They’re exposed to make it easier to tap into for free power.
Power to the people!
Posted on 1/14/19 at 3:59 pm to tigerpimpbot
Cost, air is a good insulator, so it's cheap to use it.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 4:02 pm to MountainTiger
quote:i’m pretty sure if you hit two of them you are bucking a phase
When they hit two of them and complete a circuit.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 4:15 pm to papasmurf1269
quote:
i’m pretty sure if you hit two of them you are bucking a phase
Not familiar with that terminology but you're connecting two phases together with a resistor (the balloon). And since they're out of phase with one another, there will be a voltage potential between them, causing current to flow.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 4:41 pm to MountainTiger
Bridging two phases is called a line to line fault.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 4:47 pm to Dam Guide
quote:
Bridging two phases is called a line to line fault.
What is bucking a phase? I'm an EE but not in power distribution.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 4:47 pm to KosmoCramer
Found a image of insulated overhead distribution line, notice the gap in the insulation where the tap is connected.
This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 4:49 pm
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:03 pm to TDsngumbo
because they never ate from the tree of knowledge
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:18 pm to dillpickleLSU
Not true. The only thing in oil would be high voltage circuit breakers. The oil has a high dielectric value (High Resistance Value). It is used to dissipate the arc flash when opening or closing the high voltage breaker. In the industry those breakers are called OCB’s (Oil Circuit Breakers).
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:27 pm to Roman Candle Tag
quote:
Cost prohibitive?
Bingo
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:30 pm to TDsngumbo
Insulation on high voltage lines are not used because because it causes a voltage drop. Basically in simple terms it means it takes a higher voltage leaving the generating facility to get desired voltage at desired point in the grid system. Transformers are used to step down voltage, step up voltage or simply to boost the desired voltage. It is better to transfer voltages at higher values and then use a transformer to step the voltage down to desired voltage. When cables are run underground they are insulated but any place that a connection is made it has to be installed a certain way because of the way those cables are made.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:42 pm to dillpickleLSU
quote:
You can run them underground, but they are usually cooled with an oil circulating system and a pump on each end.
Not bashing you, but worked for Entergy in Transmission Substation department (69kv up to 500kv) for over 20 years and I’ve never seen that type of setup. I’ve seen SF6 ( Sulphur hexaflouride) insulated buss work within substations, I’ve seen solid aluminum pipe used as a conductor, but never circulated oil, other than in a HV circuit breaker.
In the field, for distribution, underground utilities are extremely expensive, are difficult to troubleshoot faults and, as was said earlier, cannot dissipate heat as an open air setup does, therefore limiting current or necessitating larger conductors (re: higher cost). Same reason the spacing on poles is what it is - code and cost. However, depending on the subdivision/development, the aesthetics are worth the added cost.
Basically, all things (not mandated by safety etc) boil down to costs.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:45 pm to Croozin2
quote:
run them underground, but they are usually cooled with an oil circulating system and a pump on each end.
airport lighting has been on a system like that for decades, I'm sure tech is/has evolved for a better system by now, or I would hope so
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:47 pm to Miketheseventh
quote:
Insulation on high voltage lines are not used because because it causes a voltage drop. Basically in simple terms it means it takes a higher voltage leaving the generating facility to get desired voltage at desired point in the grid system. Transformers are used to step down voltage, step up voltage or simply to boost the desired voltage. It is better to transfer voltages at higher values and then use a transformer to step the voltage down to desired voltage. When cables are run underground they are insulated but any place that a connection is made it has to be installed a certain way because of the way those cables are made.
Insulated overhead high voltage primary distribution lines are in common use everywhere. Voltage drop is not caused by insulation, voltage drop in a conductor is a function of the loss resulting from the product of the square of the current flowing through the conductor, and the resistance of the conductor. This loss produces heat which must be dissipated to the air. Insulating a conductor reduces the rate of heat loss from the conductor to the surrounding air which requires a insulated conductor to be rated for less current than a equally sized non-insulated conductor, but for a given current and conductor resistance the voltage drop is the same.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:48 pm to TDsngumbo
1. Cost prohibitive to run underground
2. Difficult to repair underground
3. Electric utilities make a LOT of money renting ‘pole connections’ to phone & cable companies. They charge by the pole.
2. Difficult to repair underground
3. Electric utilities make a LOT of money renting ‘pole connections’ to phone & cable companies. They charge by the pole.
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:52 pm to Croozin2
quote:
but worked for Entergy in Transmission Substation department (69kv up to 500kv) for over 20 years and I’ve never seen that type of setup.
There was oil filled cables under the industrial canal for a while as well as under the MS river
Posted on 1/14/19 at 5:54 pm to CE Tiger
The real answer is wire is cheap and lightweight why complicate it with insulation. NESC dictates clearance values to avoid phase to phase contact and protect the public
Posted on 1/14/19 at 6:03 pm to EA6B
quote:
Insulated overhead high voltage primary distribution lines are in common use everywhere. Voltage drop is not caused by insulation, voltage drop in a conductor is a function of the loss resulting from the product of the square of the current flowing through the conductor, and the resistance of the conductor. This loss produces heat which must be dissipated to the air. Insulating a conductor reduces the rate of heat loss from the conductor to the surrounding air which requires a insulated conductor to be rated for less current than a equally sized non-insulated conductor, but for a given current and conductor resistance the voltage drop is the same.
If the insulated conductor runs hotter due to the insulation, wouldn't the resistivity also be higher which would then cause more voltage drop along it?
Posted on 1/14/19 at 6:09 pm to TDsngumbo
Not totally related, but PC&G in California just filed for bankruptcy in CA due to the wildfires. Supposedly a downed line initiated the fire.
After Hurricane Michael, there were downed lines everywhere and people were just driving/walking over them. Not a fun experience
After Hurricane Michael, there were downed lines everywhere and people were just driving/walking over them. Not a fun experience
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