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re: An update, honestly if anyone cares...
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:31 pm to bayoubengals88
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:31 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
the vagueness of this concept has driven me mad over the last five years
What, exactly, is vague about it? It means to personally believe that Jesus is the Son of God, who died for your sins and rose again, thereby trusting Him alone for salvation, forgiving your sins, and submitting to Him as the authority in your life. That's not very vague.
1
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:32 pm to SouthernHog
Ewww, a non denominational
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:32 pm to SouthernHog
quote:
she would have an idea but she said it was too boring.
Mass is not for me, you or your wife. It's for Jesus.
quote:
She is the kind that needs the feel good Gospel and Concert for church.
Again, mass is not for me, you or your wife. It's for Jesus.
Flip perspectives. It's not what you get out of it, it's what you give.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:32 pm to REB BEER
quote:
I've known several adult Catholics that don't know John 3:16
quote:
They just thought it was a sign people hold up at football games.
Yeah? Don't believe this.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:33 pm to JiminyCricket
quote:Fair points to be sure. But think about how little the afterlife is mentioned in the OT. I think it is crucial to adopt the idea that salvation begins now. What difference does it make?
If Christ's love wins in the end regardless of our trust placed in him or not, what exactly is the point of evangelism at all? If even unbelievers will be saved in the end, what difference does it make if we preach the gospel or not?
I like to think about it the other way around. If I truly believed in eternal conscious torment, I don't think I'd ever stop actively preaching the gospel. But that's just not the way 99% of us act.
quote:
I get where you're coming from because Hell is a long time, it really sucks and it's a very real thing. I get why people are uncomfortable with the idea but I also cannot go as far as to dismiss the judgement the bible speaks of.
For starters, check out the video I posted. It just dropped today!
If you don't have that kind of time, check this one out.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:34 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
the vagueness of this concept has driven me mad over the last five years.
It's a great question as many struggle with this idea. Jesus makes it very clear in the book of John chapter 6. He says that the entire work of man is to believe in the one God has sent. The greek work used here that is translated to believe is pisteuo which means to place our trust. That is all God wants from us for salvation, to place our trust for salvation in the finished work of Jesus. We will give an account and we have two options; we can plead our own case on our own goodness or we can place our trust in Christ and plead his goodness our our behalf.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:35 pm to JiminyCricket
quote:Yeah, he just meant crossing the Tiber...converting to Rome.
We speak of conversion as something that happens when an unbeliever becomes a believer. The post spoke of "converting" someone who is already a professed believer in Christ. The new testament is full of people worshipping differently but all submitting to Christ. It's weird to me to box it in like that.
I'm not Roman Catholic, but if I went through RCIA and was received into the Catholic church, I'd be a Catholic convert.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:36 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
If I truly believed in eternal conscious torment, I don't think I'd ever stop actively preaching the gospel.
This is the entire point my brother and why God calls us to action now. There are real consequences and they are eternal and yet we all get so caught up in the non sense of this life. God calls us to fix our eyes on what is unseen and there absolutely is a sense of urgency to preach the gospel.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:38 pm to SouthernHog
I attended catholic mass a few times as a kid...I don't remember anyone singing? That is the funniest shite on earth in a protestant church, folks singing. Not the chorus, some of them are extremely talented, but the general congregation? Hilarious. The point is to make a joyful noise and it has always brought me a great deal of joy watching it....and it is certainly a noise so I think they hit the mark.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:40 pm to MemphisGuy
quote:Well, you elaborated a lot.
What, exactly, is vague about it? It means to personally believe that Jesus is the Son of God, who died for your sins and rose again, thereby trusting Him alone for salvation, forgiving your sins, and submitting to Him as the authority in your life. That's not very vague.
But I struggle to gain assurance from what goes on between my ears alone.
Does that make any sense? Like not "believing as I should" has been a real fear for me. I have underwent severe doubts. Surely I'm not believing in Christ to the extent that I should during those times.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:40 pm to JiminyCricket
quote:
Man this is such a strange line of dialogue when referencing a professed follower of Christ. You speak of her as if she is not even saved.
I think you're reading a lot more into that than there was. I'm not sure why that it, but if I convinced you some how that I didn't think she was saved or even that I knew whether or not she was saved it was not my intent.
This post was edited on 1/28/26 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:45 pm to JiminyCricket
quote:But when I'm not actively preaching the gospel, how can I not be considered a monster? This is a good argument from David Bently Hart. This is him writing about someone who teaches in a seminary and is a devoted husband and father of five:
This is the entire point my brother and why God calls us to action now. There are real consequences and they are eternal and yet we all get so caught up in the non sense of this life. God calls us to fix our eyes on what is unseen and there absolutely is a sense of urgency to preach the gospel.
quote:
If he truly thought that our situation in this world were as horribly perilous as he claims, and that every mortal soul labored under the shadow of so dreadful a doom, and that the stakes were so high and the odds so poor for everyone—a mere three score and ten years to get it right if we are fortunate, and then an eternity of agony in which to rue the consequences if we get it wrong—he would never dare to bring a child into this world, let alone five children; nor would he be able to rest even for a moment, because he would be driven ceaselessly around the world in a desperate frenzy of evangelism, seeking to save as many souls from the eternal fire as possible. I think of him as a remarkably compassionate person, you see, and so his more or less sedentary and distractedly scholarly style of life to my mind speaks volumes, even libraries. If he were really absolutely convinced of the things he thinks he is convinced of, but still continued to go his merry recreant’s way along the path of happy fatherhood and professional contentment, he would have to be a moral monster. But I do not think that he is a monster.
So I have to think instead that, in his heart of hearts, at a level of calm conviction so deeply hidden beneath veils of childhood indoctrination that he is all but unaware of its existence, he keeps and treasures the certainty that in the end—in the words of Dame Julian of Norwich (1342–1416)—“All shall be well, and all manner of thing shall be well.” And I believe that at that same level he also knows that nothing can be ultimately well if the happy final state of things for any of us has been purchased at the cost—or even only at the risk—of anyone else’s eternal misery.
From the book, That All Shall be Saved
This post was edited on 1/28/26 at 2:52 pm
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:50 pm to yadaddy
quote:
I can really appreciate your perspective on this
Thank you.
I have learned and am learning that these arguments between Christians (though not insignificant) are really mostly distractions be the evil working in this world.
We who follow Christ who became the sacrifice for our salvation should lean heavily on that as the glue that holds us all together as brothers and sisters. Again not to diminish the importance of our differences, but are those differences really larger that Christs sacrifice for us all?
I try to think about this a lot and especially in times of arguments. I also try to remember I can do more harm to my beliefs if I lose sight of Christ and focus on being right or proving someone else wrong.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:52 pm to BayouBengal51
quote:I’m telling you it does not meet the obligation to attend Catholic Mass
What I'm saying is alternating weekends still meets the obligation to congregate with other Christians on Sunday and devoting that day to God.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:55 pm to Snipe
quote:
if I convinced you some how that I didn't think she was saved or even that I knew whether or not she was saved it was not my intent.
I don't doubt your intent here at all. Also this reply is not concerning your personal beliefs.
However, the Catholic Church is very clear on these situations. "The Mass: Anyone who states that the Mass is only a sacrifice of praise and thanksgiving, or that it is a mere commemoration of Christ's sacrifice on the cross rather than a propitiatory (atoning) sacrifice, is anathema." This is from Trent. 22nd Session, Canon III, which is considered infallible dogma within the Church. Again, not speaking about Catholics on an individual level, but this is the view of the church as it's said plainly.
I don't know anything about her beliefs other than she attends a non denominational church, but he submits to a Church that declares her cut off from Christ and she does not submit to that. Regardless of who's right or wrong, I think it's fair to assume that if she were to convert to Catholicism (especially a Catholicism that is not declared anathema by Trent) she would have to at some point believe that she was previously not saved.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:55 pm to GreenRockTiger
quote:Correct.
I’m telling you it does not meet the obligation to attend Catholic Mass
quote:LINK
Can. 1247 On Sundays and other holy days of obligation, the faithful are obliged to participate in the Mass.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:58 pm to REB BEER
quote:
I've known several adult Catholics that don't know John 3:16
They just thought it was a sign people hold up at football games.
And I know Protestants who voted for Kamala Harris. Are we just randomly talking about idiots we know IRL?
Posted on 1/28/26 at 2:59 pm to yadaddy
quote:I believe they backed off, maybe in Vatican II, to state that she would simply not have been in full communion previously.
I don't know anything about her beliefs other than she attends a non denominational church, but he submits to a Church that declares her cut off from Christ and she does not submit to that. Regardless of who's right or wrong, I think it's fair to assume that if she were to convert to Catholicism (especially a Catholicism that is not declared anathema by Trent) she would have to at some point believe that she was previously not saved.
Now, how they do this and remain infallible has always been a mystery to me. Just like how the laity only began receiving the cup after Vatican II, where in previous times they were forbidden from partaking in the cup of salvation.
Posted on 1/28/26 at 3:00 pm to GRTiger
quote:I know of a Catholic who made Kamala Harris his VP
And I know Protestants who voted for Kamala Harris. Are we just randomly talking about idiots we know IRL?
Posted on 1/28/26 at 3:00 pm to Loup
quote:
I've found that if your significant other isn't on the same page as far as religion goes it's best to just cut it off unless you're going to convert.
Catholic, wide is Presbyterian. Just celebrated 18th anniversary. It’s not THAT big of a deal.
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