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re: American Christianity is collapsing thanks to Millennials
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:06 am to Techdog89
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:06 am to Techdog89
quote:
Just had to give my $.02 on the subject.
See the thing is, most people who have turned away from religion didn't do so because they lost faith in the folks running the various institutions...though I'm sure there are some.
They walked away because they simply did not believe the tenants of the faith any longer. They no longer believed.
Some of us never really did, despite being raised religious in one way or another. I always doubted and was questioning. One day, sometime after my Confirmation, I simply admitted to myself that I didn't believe any of it...and it was an incredible relief.
Now...am I running around IRL having discussions about this? Nope! I live in South Louisiana and the word "atheist" ranks right up there with "Pedophelic Muslim." there are only a handful of people I can talk to about this, which is incredible really.
But...over the past 15 years or so this has become easier and easier given the internet. Tons of people, like me, who never really believed but felt pressured into acting as if we did are finally feeling as though they can stand up and tell the truth about their own beliefs. It's more so the cultural shirt in making this more acceptable (at least in many other parts of the country) than it is with being mad at institutions.
5
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:08 am to ElDawgHawg
quote:
There is no way that you can justify a world without Christianity being a better place.
Christianity started thousands of years ago in the shite hole that still is the Middle East.
You do realize that the same Abraham that is the patriarch of Christianity is pretty much the same for Muslims and Jews? They may be 3 different religions now, but they all started from the same history, each one just chose which pieces of that history to follow and interpreted it differently. There have been countless wars, genocides, and murders in the name of those 3 religions, so yeah, it would be real easy to justify a better world without Christianity.
You shouldn't need to go to church to know how to treat other human beings with respect. The excuse that it is needed to make people better is weak. religion exists b/c people are scared of the fact that they will simply not exists at all when they die, so they made up a fantasy land to make them feel better about death. humans can't fathom not knowing something, so we made up religions to tell us how the universe started and where we go after we die.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:09 am to GeauxTigerTM
I totally get where you’re coming from, I was in a similar position for a while. Never stop having an open mind though 
for some, questioning brings you to atheism or agnosticism, but for me it ended up with Christianity. Interesting how it happens. I just try to be respectful and not drive people away and answer their questions about my faith as best I can.
for some, questioning brings you to atheism or agnosticism, but for me it ended up with Christianity. Interesting how it happens. I just try to be respectful and not drive people away and answer their questions about my faith as best I can.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:09 am to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
But that purpose can essentially be anything. There is zero reason it needs to be some supernatural issue.
Those of us who argue that we are unconvinced of gods existing simply find that purpose in other avenues of our life. I'm not unfulfilled in the slightest.
Yes, and that is why that higher purpose needs to be morally centered, because if it isn't, it leads to nihilism which can not sustain itself compared to ideologies with moral centers.
Trump is definitely a symptom of the godless seeking a higher power. Go look at the Poliboard sometime. They get just as pissed off when I speak condescendingly of their Orange God King as if I was to walk into a church and just mock Jesus relentlessly. At least Jesus provides a firm moral compass to follow, but Trump has no central ideology, which has caused many youth to be ensnared by the evils of nihilism. Trumpkins believe nothing but what their God King tells them to believe, and that can vary from day to day.
And they don't realize their hypocrisy that they are no different from the nihilism of the SJWs, the SJWs just happen to worship a different calf also dedicated to nihilism. They're godless craving a god, and they have found it in victimization and the people who embody it. How many people claim to be a victim more than Trump? CNN and postmodern college professors perhaps, but they all worship the same Many Faced Faced God of Nothingness. A good moral order must return to this world, specifically America and Europe, because if we don't a moral order that is disgusting like communism or Islam will take its place.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:09 am to GeauxTigerTM
quote:This. Thing is, I still go to church. I like the tradition and community of being catholic. But if you hooked me up to a lie detector, it would show I simply dont beleive there is a god. It was time I stopped lying to myself.
They walked away because they simply did not believe the tenants of the faith any longer. They no longer believed.
Some of us never really did, despite being raised religious in one way or another. I always doubted and was questioning. One day, sometime after my Confirmation, I simply admitted to myself that I didn't believe any of it...and it was an incredible relief.
Now, I dont tell people because I dont want to start a damn fight
However, I bet if you did the lie detector test, you would find a bunch of church goers and others truly "dont believe." And I dont find anything wrong with thatThis post was edited on 3/8/18 at 11:10 am
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:11 am to Big_Sur
Once they get in their late 30s or 40s theyll all repent from their backsliding ways.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:12 am to lsupride87
quote:
Then they are a broken person IMHO. It shouldn't take a higher being to keep them from being self destructive
Well, then you are one man in a million. If you look at societies that have crumbled or radicalized over time, you will find that their moral center was ripped apart and their purpose was lost. They then replace with a far more devious and intentionally destructive higher purpose. Nihilism can not and will not ever sustain itself.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:13 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
For you, probably. For others, it definitely does.
No doubt.
But here's the thing. The fact it it does for many does not make me feel compelled to respect their belief (though I respect their right to hold them) or want their beliefs forced on me in one way or another.
Think if it this way...if you knew a guy who believed there were elves in his backyard and he was constantly telling you about him looking for them, family trips into the backyard hunting for them, etc...you'd think he was crazy, right? what if he went on to tell you that without this belief he'd really not know how to cope in life and it gave him meaning?
I understand that many need this...I'm saying that, in time, they could grow past it.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:14 am to OMLandshark
quote:Not due to religion though
If you look at societies that have crumbled or radicalized over time, you will find that their moral center was ripped apart and their purpose was lost.
The swedes and other nordics are extremely atheist for the most part, and are the only countries that have actually made community socialism work......So, they essentially have lived the most "christian" from a govt standpoint
Now, however, letting in the religious recently has actually threatened that.......
This post was edited on 3/8/18 at 11:16 am
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:15 am to Big_Sur
Why did this have to divide by race? I thought it was just about faith?
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:15 am to Slagathor
quote:
Maybe they're being driven away
That's me. I'm Christian but prefer to not identify with a particular denomination nor be a member of a church. I practice my faith in my own privacy. Got tired of hypocrites looking down their nose every Sunday
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:16 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
You do realize that the same Abraham that is the patriarch of Christianity is pretty much the same for Muslims and Jews? They may be 3 different religions now, but they all started from the same history, each one just chose which pieces of that history to follow and interpreted it differently. There have been countless wars, genocides, and murders in the name of those 3 religions, so yeah, it would be real easy to justify a better world without Christianity.
Judaism and Christianity though were fortunately given a big dose of Hellenism though, which led to higher thought. The Dark Ages were when they faltered back into the shitty ways of the Old Testament, and the Renaissance was when we started focusing back more on Hellenistic Judeo-Christian thought. Islam never had this, and any higher thought they produced were trampled over by the Mongols never to recover.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:16 am to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
GeauxTigerTM
We have had pretty similar experiences regarding religion in our lives. Growing up, I would question more and more but would assume the main tenants were right. Eventually, I just decided that if I didn't buy into most of it, I didn't really buy into any of it. I didn't stop going to church because of anything with the Catholic church, it's just that I didn't enjoy going in the first place, and now I don't believe in what is being preached. I don't have any animosity towards the church over anything.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:18 am to JumpingTheShark
quote:
Never stop having an open mind though
I'm not sure if it originates with him, but I love the quote from Michael Shermer that states, "I'm all for having an open mind. The issue is not have it so open that your brain falls out."
I'm open to anything. But my default position is that of non-belief...which really does seem to be the only rational default position for any belief until it's been proven for you. As of yet, I've been unconvinced by any of the arguments in favor of the existence of any supernatural beings.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:20 am to lsupride87
quote:
Not due to religion though
Well that's not always true. Does Muhammad come to mind?
quote:
The swedes and other nordics are extremely atheist for the most part, and are the only countries that have actually made community socialism work......So, they essentially have lived the most "christian" from a govt standpoint
Now, however, letting in the religious recently has actually threatened that.......
Exactly. Come back to me in 50 years and lets see how they're shaping up when their population has no moral center. Sure this mindset can last a few decades, but this is built on the back of the American military industrial complex and their borders. Now we're seeing a morally centered population come in turn it into a shite hole.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:21 am to GeauxTigerTM
For me, it took an event that was somewhat unexplainable and changed the course of my life. It was traumatic and profound. That’s just what it takes for some folks.
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:23 am to DarthRebel
quote:
You say that, but it is easier to believe an all powerful being created everything than the big bang just up and happened.
Speak for yourself on that one. I don't know what happened, I don't think that anybody could know what happened. There may be some powerful being that created us. I do not, however, believe that a woman who never got laid ended up having a kid fathered by that god who walked on water and rose from the dead after dying for our sins for 3 days. A lot of my family don't understand how I could even consider the big bang might be what happened yet they go watch a dude in a costume perform magic that turns a cracker in to a dead guy every sunday.
This post was edited on 3/8/18 at 11:25 am
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:24 am to OMLandshark
quote:The downfall in Sweden will be the religious, not the atheist
Exactly. Come back to me in 50 years and lets see how they're shaping up when their population has no moral center. Sure this mindset can last a few decades
And to be even more ironic, it was the good natured heart of those atheist that let these religious people in......
Whoops
This post was edited on 3/8/18 at 11:25 am
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:24 am to celltech1981
We get it, you like to make snarky comments about Christianity...
Posted on 3/8/18 at 11:24 am to lsupride87
quote:
Thing is, I still go to church. I like the tradition and community of being catholic.
Yeah...I've been occasionally over the past decade, but I was dragged each time. I never enjoyed it personally because I was always sitting there thinking to myself "well...this is some bullshite." I hate the whole thing.
quote:
Now, I dont tell people because I dont want to start a damn fight
Precisely, and that's putting it mildly.
quote:
However, I bet if you did the lie detector test, you would find a bunch of church goers and others truly "dont believe." And I dont find anything wrong with that
I agree with the belief part. No doubt many are going through the motions.
But, for me, I could never sit there and either recite or pretend to the Nicene Creed knowing I didn't believe any of it.
quote:
Nicene Creed
We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, maker of heaven and earth of all that is seen and unseen. We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, one in Being with the Father. Through Him all things were made. For us men and for our salvation He came down from heaven; by the power of the Holy Spirit He was born of the Virgin Mary, and became man. For our sake He was crucified under Pontius Pilate; He suffered died, and was buried. On the third day He rose in fulfillment of the Scriptures; He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end. We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life, who proceeds from the Father and the Son. With the Father and the Son He is worshiped and glorified. He has spoken through the Prophets. We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins. We look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.
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