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Started By
Message
re: AC unit went out and needs R-22
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:05 pm to alphaandomega
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:05 pm to alphaandomega
quote:
Does this mean you would have to have new piping from the outside unit to the inside (if you have a split system)
Yes
1
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:30 pm to jlovel7
So what's the best way to tell which one your unit takes? Just look up unit model online, or is it a year by year thing where if the unit was built in 2015... it was X gas?
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:40 pm to jagrays
quote:
Yes
It is not required. However, it is required if the existing piping is smaller than the required piping on the new system. If there is a compressor burnout, then it should be replaced. If it's a system replacement with equipment designed for the same size piping or smaller then the system can be flushed and used with the A2L refrigerants.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:43 pm to OutOfNames
quote:
So what's the best way to tell which one your unit takes?
It's on the condenser label.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:46 pm to Boudreauboudreaugoly
quote:
So you’re saying that people that have been in business for 60 years and I have known for 30 years are idiots? People who own and operate one of the largest Industrial and residential refrigeration companies in the area are idiots? Ok, and I’m supposed to believe you?
So YOU show me the chemical symbolizations for propane and for the NEW residential air conditioning refrigerant and explain how they are not at all very similar. I’ll wait.
Don't want to get in the middle of name-calling but it is definitely NOT propane (R290 classified as A3). It is mildly flammable IF you get a highly concentrated pocket of R32/R454 and an ignition source greater than 1300+ F. Leak detectors will be necessary and interlocked with the unit to stop compressors. R32/R454 are considered as A2L, which are mildly flammable. A2L will be used by all U.S. manufacturers such as Goodman/Daikan (R32) and most everyone else is using R454B (which is a mix of R32 and R1234yf). Some systems do use propane but none of them are used in residential and commercial A/C (rooftop) units. Now propane is in our future as we are tasked with single digit GWP (global warming potential) in a/c units but that's 8-10 years away. Thank the EPA for all this.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 8:48 pm to LSU$$$
AC on this house is from around 2002.
Quit working a couple of years ago. Someone came out and gave me a price for a new unit I didn't get another opinion (yes, I know I'm stupid). He said there was a leak, and that it couldn't be fixed.
I couldn't afford a new unit. Went without AC that summer.
Someone else came out the next year and told me I needed a new coil for 1,500. I was able to do that. It's been working fine since the summer of 2022. A new unit would wreck my meager savings.
Quit working a couple of years ago. Someone came out and gave me a price for a new unit I didn't get another opinion (yes, I know I'm stupid). He said there was a leak, and that it couldn't be fixed.
I couldn't afford a new unit. Went without AC that summer.
Someone else came out the next year and told me I needed a new coil for 1,500. I was able to do that. It's been working fine since the summer of 2022. A new unit would wreck my meager savings.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 9:20 pm to Boudreauboudreaugoly
quote:
So you’re saying that people that have been in business for 60 years and I have known for 30 years are idiots? People who own and operate one of the largest Industrial and residential refrigeration companies in the area are idiots? Ok, and I’m supposed to believe you?
Why yes, they are not correct regarding your comment that the new refrigerants are basically propane. They are not.
R-454B, also known by the trademarked names Opteon XL41, Solstice 454B, and Puron Advance, is a zeotropic blend of 68.9 percent difluoromethane (R-32), a hydrofluorocarbon, and 31.1 percent 2,3,3,3-tetrafluoropropene (R-1234yf), a hydrofluoroolefin.
Difluoromethane, also called difluoromethylene, HFC-32 Methylene Fluoride or R-32, is an organic compound of the dihalogenoalkane variety. It has the formula of CH2F2. It is a colorless gas in the ambient atmosphere and is slightly soluble in water, with a high thermal stability.
C3H8 is a three-carbon alkane with the chemical name Propane. Propane is also called n-Propane, Dimethylmethane, or Propyl hydride. It is a gas molecular entity.
Let me know if you need anything else. Side note, we have way more years in the business than your friends. Your friends don't have their business without our business.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 9:24 pm to SOSFAN
quote:bullshite
Anyone that puts a dime into repairing a r-22 system is a idiot.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 9:39 pm to jlovel7
I remember when R-12 (Freon for automotive applications) was 50 cents a can. This was a very efficient refrigerant. Those of us old enough to remember, those old air conditioning systems in the 1960’s - 70’s worked way better than what we have now. Never could understand why our government outlawed this stuff when the rest of the world didn’t seem to care about its use. Just paid $9.99 for a can of R-134a.
This post was edited on 6/18/24 at 9:41 pm
Posted on 6/18/24 at 9:54 pm to dazedconfused
quote:It’s very simple- everything the government does is about controlling the citizenry.
Never could understand why our government
Posted on 6/18/24 at 9:56 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
Daiken/goodman plant is outside of Houston
Amazing facility. Some very innovative tech in there.
Couple of pics of their old plant in Houston. We were buying their machinery that wouldn't be used in the new plant.
One of the ovens for final coil brazing.
One of the furnace production lines.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 10:00 pm to MardiGrasCajun
just had my upstairs replaced, expensive, but i was on R22 with a leak to almost empty, like someone said, about 200 a lb.
I replaced with AS silver. all i really need for upstairs.
I replaced with AS silver. all i really need for upstairs.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 10:08 pm to White Bear
quote:
It’s very simple- everything the government does is about controlling the citizenry.
I am very involved in the regulatory affairs of our company. The D.O.E. and EPA are not your friends. Both have bored employees that create new rules and regulations that cost the manufacturers millions of dollars and end users higher priced products. We continually fight against them in your best interest. Don't get me wrong, we are for higher efficiency products but we would rather the end user make that decision for their home versus one of those two entities. If you want a crappy 8 SEER unit, you should be able to buy it. If you want a 21 SEER, then same thing. I can assure you the cost of the new A2L equipment to the consumer will be 30%+ higher. Don't think for a minute they're forgetting about gas furnaces. That 95%+ minimum efficiency is coming quickly, too. Bye bye inexpensive 80% furnaces.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 10:14 pm to MardiGrasCajun
quote:long story short, keep your old shite: hvac, vehicles, etc.
I am very involved in the regulatory affairs of our company. The D.O.E. and EPA are not your friends. Both have bored employees that create new rules and regulations that cost the manufacturers millions of dollars and end users higher priced products. We continually fight against them in your best interest. Don't get me wrong, we are for higher efficiency products but we would rather the end user make that decision for their home versus one of those two entities. If you want a crappy 8 SEER unit, you should be able to buy it. If you want a 21 SEER, then same thing. I can assure you the cost of the new A2L equipment to the consumer will be 30%+ higher. Don't think for a minute they're forgetting about gas furnaces. That 95%+ minimum efficiency is coming quickly, too. Bye bye inexpensive 80% furnaces.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 10:23 pm to White Bear
quote:
doesn’t mean it should’ve been phased out you fricking fricktard.
Well it's already done, you fricking fricktard
Posted on 6/18/24 at 10:34 pm to jlovel7
407c and mix, you’re welcome.
Posted on 6/18/24 at 11:34 pm to jlovel7
You can order it online, virgin and priced well:
This post was edited on 6/18/24 at 11:44 pm
Posted on 6/19/24 at 12:02 am to jlovel7
quote:
Currently we have a carrier that’s 50 years old, made in the USA, and hasn’t given us any trouble in literally years.
50 years is impressive to say the least. Be grateful it lasted that long. Get ready to spend around $1700 to replace it though. It had a damn good run.
Posted on 6/19/24 at 12:49 am to MardiGrasCajun
quote:
Why yes, they are not correct regarding your comment that the new refrigerants are basically propane. They are not. ...
Thank you. If nothing else you saved me a near stroke inducing tirade on how silly the comparison was.
While we replaced our systems at our home with 410A (Puron) systems last year I am trying to limp the R22 system at the camp along until the R32 and R454B systems come online. I am trying to decide ahead of time (might have to make a fairly quick decision) between the two. My current opinion is R32 for three reasons:
1. R32 is not a patent-covered proprietary refrigerant
2. R32 is a single compound refrigerant. While the claim the glide and fractionation are insignificant, I don't want to be a situation down the road where they have decided that because 454B is blended, you have to vacuum and replace all the 454B after a leak.
3. R32 has been proven in 100s of million of residential units worldwide
Thoughts?
While you explained it well just to answer this more directly:
quote:
So YOU show me the chemical symbolizations for propane and for the NEW residential air conditioning refrigerant and explain how they are not at all very similar. I’ll wait.
Propane is C3H8
R32 is CH2F2
R454B is 70% CH2F2 and 30% CH2=CFCF3
Just the formulas are all that is needed, without a heavy organic chemistry background the skeletal structures (if that is what he meant by symbolization) wouldn't be very useful.
One doesn't need a PhD in organic chemistry to see they are vastly different compounds. The propene in the chemical name of the R1234yf in R454B blend could catch out someone that has no chemistry background.
This post was edited on 6/19/24 at 1:04 am
Posted on 6/19/24 at 1:34 am to MardiGrasCajun
Yep
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