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Message
re: Reminder: The Saints cannot tear it down this offseason. It is virtually impossible.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 8:25 am to Fun Bunch
Posted on 12/28/23 at 8:25 am to Fun Bunch
quote:
No coach that isn't a terrible retread will want this job as HC.
I don’t know if I agree with that. If we had a higher pick we could get someone like Flores to listen. Dude went off the rails for a minute but he’s a very good coach and can build a program. I wonder if he’s chilled a bit.
1
Posted on 12/28/23 at 8:29 am to St Augustine
quote:
If we had a higher pick we could get someone like Flores to listen.
Thanks for proving my point.
Flores is not any good as a HC, they became a beast after he left
Posted on 12/28/23 at 8:32 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
What exactly is the solution if you dont want to rebuild?
Not once did I say I'm against rebuilding. I know its necessary. However, I just don't want the Lions and Texans to be the standard. That's it. Spoiled or not, they are not who you should strive to be.
quote:
The bengals did this with Burrow and Chase.
You can't put Detroit and Houston in the same category as Cincy. That's a much better comp to strive for.
quote:
Typical new generation sports fan who wants results immediately or he gets pissed.
There is no standard because you dont have one. You dont want to rebuild; you just want immediate success where this team is a contender
You have no idea who I am or what I am about. You are making stupid generalizations because you couldn't properly comprehend what I was saying.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 8:48 am to SaintEB
So it is possible to get out of the hell sooner than later, but you have to commit to it and realize that you may not get full value right away.
The Rams are a good example of this post SB win. They traded a lot of their veterans for pennies on the dollar and relied on cheap rookie talent last year. Granted they haven’t had a first round pick for years but their gamble resulted in a title. Now this year they are on the edge of a wild card berth.
Unfortunately I’m not sure if we can copy this strategy completely but we need to trade players for later round picks despite their value being more than that. Essentially we are trying to buy a teams salary cap space as you want the teams to take on as much dead money if possible. So guys like Peat, MT, Ram, and others would go this route, getting later round picks in the future to absorb a contract.
Granted, not everyone will be traded. Guys like Davis, Cam, Mathieu, and Maye may be post June 1 cut candidates. But it’s a possible path.
If we do our restructure and extend strategy, we are guaranteed 7-10 at best with the division getting better around us.
The Rams are a good example of this post SB win. They traded a lot of their veterans for pennies on the dollar and relied on cheap rookie talent last year. Granted they haven’t had a first round pick for years but their gamble resulted in a title. Now this year they are on the edge of a wild card berth.
Unfortunately I’m not sure if we can copy this strategy completely but we need to trade players for later round picks despite their value being more than that. Essentially we are trying to buy a teams salary cap space as you want the teams to take on as much dead money if possible. So guys like Peat, MT, Ram, and others would go this route, getting later round picks in the future to absorb a contract.
Granted, not everyone will be traded. Guys like Davis, Cam, Mathieu, and Maye may be post June 1 cut candidates. But it’s a possible path.
If we do our restructure and extend strategy, we are guaranteed 7-10 at best with the division getting better around us.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 9:04 am to Mister Flawless
quote:
Granted they haven’t had a first round pick for years but their gamble resulted in a title.
With those picks, they ended up with Goff (traded away), Brandin Cooks (traded away), Jalen Ramsey (2 - 1sts), and now Stafford (2-1sts). They still have one of the best defensive players in the game, a mid-round rookie sensation at WR, one of the best WR's still out there, and good coaching.
quote:
Unfortunately I’m not sure if we can copy this strategy completely
We cannot. They have Safford. We have Carr.
quote:
Essentially we are trying to buy a teams salary cap space as you want the teams to take on as much dead money if possible. So guys like Peat, MT, Ram, and others would go this route, getting later round picks in the future to absorb a contract.
I know it's happened at least once (Cleveland maybe), but this doesn't happen often in the NFL. Cap space is so valuable to rebuilding teams. Competing teams won't have the space to absorb dead money without getting into a situation like we are in now.. This happens all the time in the NBA but they don't have a hard cap like the NFL.
You know what. If I knew what to do, I'd be in the front office, not on a message board, lol.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 9:12 am to SaintEB
if Russell Wilson is p.o.ed at Sean Payton and the Broncos, he can extract revenge after he is cut by signing with the Saints for the league min ($1.5m). Saints get a better QB than Carr (who can be benched for 1 year and cut), and Denver gets a $35m cap hit. LINK
Posted on 12/28/23 at 9:39 am to SaintEB
quote:
I know it's happened at least once (Cleveland maybe), but this doesn't happen often in the NFL. Cap space is so valuable to rebuilding teams. Competing teams won't have the space to absorb dead money without getting into a situation like we are in now.. This happens all the time in the NBA but they don't have a hard cap like the NFL.
You know what. If I knew what to do, I'd be in the front office, not on a message board, lol.
Never underestimate the stupidity of other teams' front offices. There will always be a GM that thinks the team is one player away and willing to trade assets to get that one player....unfortunately, Mickey has been that GM the last couple years and has been burned. Assuming he's staying, he needs to find a new sucker and quickly.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 11:32 am to Fun Bunch
quote:
Thanks for proving my point. Flores is not any good as a HC, they became a beast after he left
He turned a shitty team his first year into a team with two winning seasons and largely built the foundation for the next regime? To say he isn’t any good as a hc seems pretty short sighted.
This post was edited on 12/28/23 at 11:35 am
Posted on 12/28/23 at 12:39 pm to Mister Flawless
quote:
Essentially we are trying to buy a teams salary cap space as you want the teams to take on as much dead money if possible. So guys like Peat, MT, Ram, and others would go this route, getting later round picks in the future to absorb a contract.
You can't trade away dead money. Dead money isn't normal salary. It is money that was paid in signing bonus and spread out over several years. It stays with the team even if they trade the player. That's why Loomis constantly converting contracts to signing bonuses and kicking the can down the road has painted us into a corner. Trading those players only takes their salary off the books but still leaves a giant cap hit.
Some examples with the Saints taking big dead money hits would be Jimmy Graham trade and the Junior Galette fiasco.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 7:13 pm to Fun Bunch
They should release Carr outright regardless of contract. Trade back multiple times in this draft accumulating picks for the 2025 draft. Realize you are going to eat dogshit for the 2024 season. Eat the bad contracts in 2024 and do not extend and kick the can. Find a way over the next year and a half to void the bad contracts however possible. Trade any veteran with trade value. Clear them out.
Then you get a top pick in the 2025 draft and a lot of the fat gone off the roster. You’d also be loaded with picks from previous years trade backs. I’d also find a way to maximize compensatory picks over the next few years. Accumulate picks while cleaning the books.
No coach will do this because they realize they’ll be fired. Same with the GM.
It would be the best and fastest way to be competitive again.
Then you get a top pick in the 2025 draft and a lot of the fat gone off the roster. You’d also be loaded with picks from previous years trade backs. I’d also find a way to maximize compensatory picks over the next few years. Accumulate picks while cleaning the books.
No coach will do this because they realize they’ll be fired. Same with the GM.
It would be the best and fastest way to be competitive again.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 7:15 pm to St Augustine
quote:
He turned a shitty team his first year into a team with two winning seasons and largely built the foundation for the next regime? To say he isn’t any good as a hc seems pretty short sighted.
He isn’t any good and he’s a POS.
I don’t want anything to do with that bum.
Posted on 12/28/23 at 8:25 pm to Swagga
quote:
Draft a young QB and hopefully hit on your other picks.
Makes absolutely zero sense unless we firing Allen and Pete and a new coach gets to start developing him while Carr plays.
Posted on 12/29/23 at 7:35 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
The Lions and Texans have successfully gone this route.
How many years and coaches have the lions gone through. And they still haven’t won anything lol. Campbell came around when the team was basically rebuilt. Many others came in and were fired
Posted on 12/29/23 at 8:00 am to pmacneworleans
quote:
if Russell Wilson is p.o.ed at Sean Payton and the Broncos, he can extract revenge after he is cut by signing with the Saints for the league min ($1.5m). Saints get a better QB than Carr (who can be benched for 1 year and cut), and Denver gets a $35m cap hit. LINK
As a guy that follows the Broncos, I will say Russ looked really good when given the chance. Last year, he was humbled into being Seattle Russ instead of thinking he can be Drew Brees in Hackett’s crappy arse offense. This year Sean Payton just didn’t like Russ from the start. He would call screens (you guys know what I’m talking about) and WR reverses until the end of the game in which he let Russ go and he won some games (along with the defense that was creating turnovers). But Payton did Russ super dirty in Denver and he would be an upgrade over Carr.
Posted on 12/29/23 at 8:15 am to Townedrunkard
Passing on a franchise QB never ever makes sense.
Posted on 12/29/23 at 9:34 am to blueboxer1119
quote:
They should release Carr outright regardless of contract.
Sigh, they can’t take the cap hit. In order to get under the salary cap next year they are going to have to restructure Carr. He will be with the Saints for many years. I don’t know why this isn’t getting through to Saints fans. There is no quick way out of this, it will take many years to dig out. And that’s if the FO wakes up and starts now, which it doesn’t seem likely they’re willing to do.
Posted on 12/29/23 at 9:40 am to Gavin Elster
quote:
Sigh, they can’t take the cap hit. In order to get under the salary cap next year they are going to have to restructure Carr. He will be with the Saints for many years. I don’t know why this isn’t getting through to Saints fans. There is no quick way out of this, it will take many years to dig out. And that’s if the FO wakes up and starts now, which it doesn’t seem likely they’re willing to do.
The melt this offseason when they restructure him and guarantee he's here for 3-4 more years will be epic.
I will be among them, even knowing it happens
Posted on 12/29/23 at 9:56 am to msstate7
quote:
Well then the only thing that can be changed is coaching. Make the move
If the Saints brass is serious about winning, they would do whatever it took to get Jim Harbaugh here. Give him at least 5 years to turn it around.
This post was edited on 12/29/23 at 9:58 am
Posted on 12/29/23 at 6:13 pm to Fun Bunch
Rip it up and start over… is 2-15 really that much different than what we are now?
Posted on 12/29/23 at 6:34 pm to Gavin Elster
quote:
Sigh, they can’t take the cap hit
Why?
Just eat it.
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