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Official SFP's 2025 Dead Cap Thread™
Posted on 1/8/24 at 9:46 pm
Posted on 1/8/24 at 9:46 pm
So with the likely impending trade of Lattimore and the potential retirement/cutting of Ramczyk, TO GO WITH the restructure of Jameis recently, I thought it would be good to start on our 2025 dead cap numbers.
All numbers from Over the Cap
Players Without Contracts and Unlikely to be Retained:
These are players without contracts who are unlikely to be retained in 2024 or cut post June 1
Michael Thomas: $9,187,177
Jameis Winston: $7,301,000
Andrus Peat: $6,292,000
Tyrann Mathieu: $7,301,000
Marcus Maye: $6,042,000
Tanoh Kpassagnon: $1,886,000
TOTAL: $ 38,009,177.00
Players Without Contracts but Likely to be Retained:
These are players likely to be retained with an extension, which will push their dead cap to future years
Demario Davis: $7,073,000
Juwon Johnson: $3,000,000
TOTAL: $ 10,073,000.00
Players With Big Contracts with Growing Unlikeliness to be Retained:
Basically Ram and Latt
Marshon Lattimore: $ 31,661,837.00
Ryan Ramczyk: $ 22,634,645.00
TOTAL: $ 54,296,482.00
The first group and Lattimore alone are almost $70M (or approximately 1/4 of our cap, or 26.9% projected to be exact). If Ram really has to retire, we're going to be pushing 1/3 of our 2025 cap as dead cap.
All numbers from Over the Cap
Players Without Contracts and Unlikely to be Retained:
These are players without contracts who are unlikely to be retained in 2024 or cut post June 1
Michael Thomas: $9,187,177
Jameis Winston: $7,301,000
Andrus Peat: $6,292,000
Tyrann Mathieu: $7,301,000
Marcus Maye: $6,042,000
Tanoh Kpassagnon: $1,886,000
TOTAL: $ 38,009,177.00
Players Without Contracts but Likely to be Retained:
These are players likely to be retained with an extension, which will push their dead cap to future years
Demario Davis: $7,073,000
Juwon Johnson: $3,000,000
TOTAL: $ 10,073,000.00
Players With Big Contracts with Growing Unlikeliness to be Retained:
Basically Ram and Latt
Marshon Lattimore: $ 31,661,837.00
Ryan Ramczyk: $ 22,634,645.00
TOTAL: $ 54,296,482.00
The first group and Lattimore alone are almost $70M (or approximately 1/4 of our cap, or 26.9% projected to be exact). If Ram really has to retire, we're going to be pushing 1/3 of our 2025 cap as dead cap.
6
Posted on 1/8/24 at 9:48 pm to SlowFlowPro
I’ll ask the dumb question, but if a player retires, why wouldn’t their contract be voided automatically?
Posted on 1/8/24 at 9:51 pm to rpg37
quote:
but if a player retires, why wouldn’t their contract be voided automatically?
The salary, yes, but we still have to pay the piper for all of the bonus money we paid them.
Teams can schedule it to split it up, which is what we did with Brees basically. That's why if Ram retires before 2024, we can spread his bonus acceleration (dead cap) into 2025.
OR, we can demand the bonus money back, which would likely cause a shite storm because it's been reported our players' contracts have clauses that allow Loomis to automatically move salary to signing bonus and I can see the Saints demanding repayment being a can of worms.
Posted on 1/8/24 at 9:51 pm to rpg37
Because I believe when we restructure and pay out the bonuses, it lets us divide the amount over multiple years. So if Ram retires and has already been paid his money, the “hit” still stands.
So if Ram is in the last year and owed 20 mil, and we extend him out three more years and pay the 20mil now in bonuses, we get a cap hit of 5mil each year. So even if he retires, we still got the hit.
So if Ram is in the last year and owed 20 mil, and we extend him out three more years and pay the 20mil now in bonuses, we get a cap hit of 5mil each year. So even if he retires, we still got the hit.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 6:33 am to HangmanPage1
Guaranteed money and signing bonus.
So when Ram signed say he got $30M signing bonus. That $ does not go to that years cap but is spread over life if the contract. Retiring is basically like being cut. All those years the signing bonus is spread are removed and accelerated into the year retired/cut
So when Ram signed say he got $30M signing bonus. That $ does not go to that years cap but is spread over life if the contract. Retiring is basically like being cut. All those years the signing bonus is spread are removed and accelerated into the year retired/cut
Posted on 1/9/24 at 6:41 am to rpg37
quote:
I’ll ask the dumb question, but if a player retires, why wouldn’t their contract be voided automatically?
Because every team would “game the system” by just kicking the can as the Saints do (extend and restructure) then void the cap hit “when they retire”.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 6:50 am to SlowFlowPro
Any chance that peat's performance at LT gets him a restructure? Stayed pretty healthy out there. Anyone got his LT PFF rating? I know it's horrible at guard, but I feel he played well at tackle
Posted on 1/9/24 at 7:07 am to msstate7
quote:
Any chance that peat's performance at LT gets him a restructure? Stayed pretty healthy out there. Anyone got his LT PFF rating? I know it's horrible at guard, but I feel he played well at tackle
As of right now Peat is in the driver's seat. He played admirable filling in at LT and likely garnered some attention from around the league as a viable backup. The Saints really can't afford to invest much in him at LT so it will depend on Peats interest in staying in NLOA.
I also do not think any team will come calling to overpay for him to be a starting LT so that's a good thing for the Saints. He was willing to tear up his contract and resign a more cap friendly one to remain but he was in a different situation last offseason.
Either way the Saints have to get a permanent fix at the LT spot. Allen eluded to the fact the Penning is still in their plans but they have to figure up a way to develop him. Take that for what it's worth, I'm hopeful he means getting coaches in that can maximize the potential that Penning has.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 8:31 am to Snipe
I think it's theoretically possible Peat can be re-signed but I think the 2024 cap issues will affect this option. I don't know how we can sign him and not add to his 2024 cap number. I have to pull up the contract details again for how we got here to think about it
Posted on 1/9/24 at 9:29 am to SlowFlowPro
Peat unlikely? He held our line together given all the injuries. He’s definitely coming back, provided he isn’t seeking a big money deal
I also see Tanoh being retained (under K in ‘24)
Maye and Mathieu are under K as well but could be cap casualties. I think Maye is more likely to be released. I don’t see them getting rid of Mathieu given his veteran presence and good health
I also see Tanoh being retained (under K in ‘24)
Maye and Mathieu are under K as well but could be cap casualties. I think Maye is more likely to be released. I don’t see them getting rid of Mathieu given his veteran presence and good health
This post was edited on 1/9/24 at 9:42 am
Posted on 1/9/24 at 9:40 am to SlowFlowPro
Peat took a pay cut to stay here I believe.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 10:42 am to saints5021
quote:
Peat took a pay cut to stay here I believe.
Peat re-did his deal to spread out the cap impact onto 2025 and isn't under contract for 2024.
His 2024 cap hit is $7,346,000 (bonus pro-ration).
I think with that high of a hit, if we could roll that pro-ration into a new bonus, we could decrease his 2024 cap hit enough to re-sign him. However, (1) I don't know if this is legal, based on how we structured his last "extension"; (2) I'm not sure how his void years (24-27) will be affected; and (3) This would create a MASSIVE dead cap hit in a few years (for a 30-year old).
Posted on 1/9/24 at 10:44 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
SlowFlowPro
This post was edited on 1/9/24 at 10:52 am
Posted on 1/9/24 at 10:57 am to SlowFlowPro
These numbers are about to get much worse as Mickey figures out how to cut roughly $90M off of the 2024 cap; then sign draft picks, and hit up FA to fill the 53 man roster & PS.
I'm wondering if Mickey will be able to push that over number for 2025 up to $100M
I'm wondering if Mickey will be able to push that over number for 2025 up to $100M
Posted on 1/9/24 at 11:10 am to Weekend Warrior79
No more kicking the can down the road. Bite the bullet, and get out of this cap hell
Posted on 1/9/24 at 11:25 am to Balsamic_duck
You can't bite the bullet. The team has to get under the cap before the start of the league year or the league steps in and adjusts the contracts to get the team under the cap. Either way, the team is forced to make adjustments for the next several years.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 11:32 am to SirWinston
I'm sad you didn't list a few other things like poker, movies, and cooking.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 11:33 am to Weekend Warrior79
quote:
These numbers are about to get much worse as Mickey figures out how to cut roughly $90M off of the 2024 cap; then sign draft picks, and hit up FA to fill the 53 man roster & PS.
The question is going to become who do we extend that has no business being extended, like Mathieu, Hill, Carr, etc.
Posted on 1/9/24 at 11:36 am to SlowFlowPro
Sign 30 Undrafted rookies
Posted on 1/9/24 at 11:38 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
that has no business being extended
quote:
like Hill,
Still frick Phace
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